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houseofboyd
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Joined: September 28, 2014
Posts: 613
Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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 Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 5:53 pm Post subject: Buying/Trading Motors, Where Too? |
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Ok, I'm kicking around different ideas of what to do with the motor that came with my Beetle. From what I can tell, it's a stock 1600 motor that goes with the '74 Beetle. It's ugly, not much to look at. When I bought the car, it was a daily driver. I test drove it and the motor started right up, seemed to run fine, etc. The PO didn't know much about it. He got in, turned the key and drove the car. So like I said, when I bought the car in October, it ran, we drove up on my friends transport truck to haul it home and drove it off the transport when we got it home and it's been sitting the garage since. I haven't pulled it yet, but plan to soon, it's just so damned ugly to look at. Fuel pump has been replaced with a electronic fuel pump, looks like some of the engine tins are missing, coil looks new, intake seals look new, so apparently, some work has been done to it in the recent past. Since I'm planning to keep the car pretty much stock, I want the motor to look as much like it did when it was new. Proper engine tins, heat exchangers, etc....The possibility of me rebuilding it myself with the help of a couple of friends is possible, but still, I don't know everything that may be missing on this motor, so things will still have to be purchased, tins, hoses, etc...Even if I have somebody else locally rebuild it, many items will have to be purchased....so, I'm kicking around the idea of purchasing a turn key motor, properly built, stock, ready to go in the car...But what to do with my existing motor? Try to sell it as is? Trade? Does anybody know of a shop that takes motors as trade ins? I know it's a long shot, but I'd really like to trade this motor and some boot for a turn key setup...thoughts, opinions, ideas are welcome!
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Our 1968 Zenith Blue Beetle: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=619501
My '74 SB Build On The Samba: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=609943
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WD-40
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Joined: May 31, 2006
Posts: 1178
Location: Iowa
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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A trade-in would typically only get you the "core" value for your engine... which isn't much in the big picture, especially since it is missing some of the tin.
My advice: If your current engine runs, just post a few pictures from different angles, and the rest of us here would be more than happy to point out what is missing, what you should purchase, etc.
Once you have all of the parts, the installation isn't too much work - and you have the perfect opportunity to clean things up and paint them to look nice.  You would save a TON of $$$$ (yes, four dollar signs) if you clean up your existing engine rather than purchasing a turn-key rebuild. 
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"The new Volkswagen 1303. We've made so many improvements, they're beginning to show." |
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Zundfolge1432 
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Joined: June 13, 2004
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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This person needs to call GEX huh? They can hook you up brother  |
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houseofboyd
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Joined: September 28, 2014
Posts: 613
Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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| WD-40 wrote: |
A trade-in would typically only get you the "core" value for your engine... which isn't much in the big picture, especially since it is missing some of the tin.
My advice: If your current engine runs, just post a few pictures from different angles, and the rest of us here would be more than happy to point out what is missing, what you should purchase, etc.
Once you have all of the parts, the installation isn't too much work - and you have the perfect opportunity to clean things up and paint them to look nice. You would save a TON of $$$$ (yes, four dollar signs) if you clean up your existing engine rather than purchasing a turn-key rebuild. |
A very distinct possibility...appreciate your willingness to help out...thanks.. 
_________________
Our 1968 Zenith Blue Beetle: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=619501
My '74 SB Build On The Samba: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=609943
Our Web Site: http://www.kentuckyhotwheels.com
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2012 Turbo VW Beetle |
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houseofboyd
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Joined: September 28, 2014
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Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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houseofboyd
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Joined: September 28, 2014
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Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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Rome
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Joined: June 02, 2004
Posts: 9641
Location: Pearl River, NY
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 6:31 pm Post subject: |
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Some immediate pieces noted as missing in your photo above:
-Muffler
-rear cross-piece tin (often called rear breastplate), which fills most of the large gap between the back of the engine and the body
-left and right hoses that come off those snouts on the fan shroud (get BLACK colored hoses if you want the engine to appear near-stock!)
-Air filter (correct for '74 would be a plastic, rectangular-shaped air filter but an earlier metal air cleaner can also be utilized)
-engine compartment perimeter rubber weatherstrip, that attaches to the BODY
That big red "dot" is the oil filler cap. It appears to be a correct one other than it being red. Stock was unpainted dull aluminum look.
Yep, photos (use the camera's flash) will help identify what you need. But since you'll need most of the above pieces anyway on replacement engines, I suggest working with what you now have- a running engine- and cleaning/painting the pieces as needed. If you take the engine out and tear it down to the long block so that all of the tins can be removed, you can degrease them, scuff the surfaces with scotchbrite pad, wipe with paint thinner, and give them a few coats of Rust-O-Leum gloss black (or even semi-gloss) spray paint. Let dry for at least 2 days, then reassemble.
It looks like your car originally had the automatic stick-shift. The large tank for that system was mounted in the right rear wheelwell and had a neck that came through the right side of the body. That oval-shaped metal patch above the bumper mount covers the hole where the neck came through. |
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houseofboyd
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Joined: September 28, 2014
Posts: 613
Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 6:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Rome wrote: |
Some immediate pieces noted as missing in your photo above:
-Muffler
-rear cross-piece tin (often called rear breastplate), which fills most of the large gap between the back of the engine and the body
-left and right hoses that come off those snouts on the fan shroud (get BLACK colored hoses if you want the engine to appear near-stock!)
-Air filter (correct for '74 would be a plastic, rectangular-shaped air filter but an earlier metal air cleaner can also be utilized)
-engine compartment perimeter rubber weatherstrip, that attaches to the BODY
That big red "dot" is the oil filler cap. It appears to be a correct one other than it being red. Stock was unpainted dull aluminum look.
Yep, photos (use the camera's flash) will help identify what you need. But since you'll need most of the above pieces anyway on replacement engines, I suggest working with what you now have- a running engine- and cleaning/painting the pieces as needed. If you take the engine out and tear it down to the long block so that all of the tins can be removed, you can degrease them, scuff the surfaces with scotchbrite pad, wipe with paint thinner, and give them a few coats of Rust-O-Leum gloss black (or even semi-gloss) spray paint. Let dry for at least 2 days, then reassemble.
It looks like your car originally had the automatic stick-shift. The large tank for that system was mounted in the right rear wheelwell and had a neck that came through the right side of the body. That oval-shaped metal patch above the bumper mount covers the hole where the neck came through. |
I will take more photos in the next day or two or after I get it out of the car. It actually had a muffler and I removed it...it was in bad shape...lol Somebody had gone crazy with read spray paint...push rod tubes painted, valve covers (which aren't stock, look to be slotted aluminum)....red paint everywhere...thanks again for your help...I'll get pics soon...I was wondering about the big hole above the bumper mount...it actually had a pickle jar lid siliconed over the hole...lol
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Our 1968 Zenith Blue Beetle: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=619501
My '74 SB Build On The Samba: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=609943
Our Web Site: http://www.kentuckyhotwheels.com
1968 VW Beetle
2012 Turbo VW Beetle |
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WD-40
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Joined: May 31, 2006
Posts: 1178
Location: Iowa
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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| houseofboyd wrote: |
| houseofboyd wrote: |
| Zundfolge1432 wrote: |
| This person needs to call GEX huh? They can hook you up brother |
Pardon my stupidity....what is GEX? Thanks for your input... |
Just found them on the web.... |
He's new here, Zundfolge1432, have to be careful making jokes like that! 
houseofboyd:
Further reading: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=92079
(or dozens of other threads)
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Zundfolge1432
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Joined: June 13, 2004
Posts: 12467
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| Posted: Wed Nov 05, 2014 7:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Actually it was a joke Do a search for GEX and see. Turnkey engines run the gamit from good ol boy local yokel rebuilds to professional race ready with prices to match but truth is you could probably buy a good short black or long block and build the rest yourself. Take a look at Tom Wilson's book how to rebuild your VW engine to see this. Most major cities still have folks doing VW work if you were in California you'd really be in business |
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houseofboyd
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Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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CB_Strange
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Joined: December 17, 2012
Posts: 48
Location: Springfield, MO
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| Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 8:27 am Post subject: |
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If the engine runs good, I would pull it, disassemble, clean and paint it.
My engine was so ugly I almost put it in the abortion thread. It was covered in primer and hideous to look at.
Here it is now. It runs good and I saved a ton of money. The only thing I did was add an alternator and pulley, strip, clean and repaint. I still have some wires to dress and clean up, but I think it turned out pretty good considering.
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houseofboyd
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Joined: September 28, 2014
Posts: 613
Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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| Posted: Thu Nov 06, 2014 9:05 am Post subject: |
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| CB_Strange wrote: |
If the engine runs good, I would pull it, disassemble, clean and paint it.
My engine was so ugly I almost put it in the abortion thread. It was covered in primer and hideous to look at.
Here it is now. It runs good and I saved a ton of money. The only thing I did was add an alternator and pulley, strip, clean and repaint. I still have some wires to dress and clean up, but I think it turned out pretty good considering.
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Wow....thats inspiring...!thanks for sharing....
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Our 1968 Zenith Blue Beetle: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=619501
My '74 SB Build On The Samba: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=609943
Our Web Site: http://www.kentuckyhotwheels.com
1968 VW Beetle
2012 Turbo VW Beetle |
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houseofboyd
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Joined: September 28, 2014
Posts: 613
Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 6:30 pm Post subject: |
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As promised...got the motor out of the Beetle today....here are the pics of this poor engine...but like I said, it did start, it did run....I pulled the valve covers off to take a peek and everything looks pretty good...the oil drained out looked ok.....I don't think any of the tins can be salvaged, they're pretty roached out....where to begin??? However, the red oil cap was just to much...I had to wire brush the paint off of it...lol
_________________
Our 1968 Zenith Blue Beetle: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=619501
My '74 SB Build On The Samba: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=609943
Our Web Site: http://www.kentuckyhotwheels.com
1968 VW Beetle
2012 Turbo VW Beetle |
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houseofboyd
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Joined: September 28, 2014
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Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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WD-40
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Location: Iowa
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 9:08 pm Post subject: |
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That tin is totally fine to re-use. Don't worry about it.
Just wire wheel the rust and give it a spray of paint and it will look great.
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houseofboyd
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WD-40
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Location: Iowa
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:34 pm Post subject: |
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| houseofboyd wrote: |
| Can you tell from the pics what tins I may be missing? |
Yep, it looks like you are missing:
* under-pulley tin
* rear pulley tin (the big curved piece that seals against the apron)
* Two separate pieces of tin that direct the hot air from the oil cooler down and out of the engine compartment
* The large curved tin piece that goes on the back to seal against the firewall
* The left and right "sled tin" under the cylinders (directs air rearward out of the engine)
* The left and right small tin pieces (can't remember the name) that goes on the rear part of the outer lower cylinders to direct air downward
* The left and right flap assemblies at the base of the fan shroud, and the linkage between them. (And since you are missing these, you are probably missing the thermostat and the thermostat bracket as well...)
* Since your engine has J-tubes instead of heater boxes, you would need the industrial engine "shields" to direct the air, as the sled tins normally have one side formed by the wall of the heater boxes. Or, you could just put heater boxes back on it.
I can't quite tell if you have the "Hoover Bit" on the oil cooler or not... but you might need that piece too. (It's small but important.) Also, if you could take a picture of the underside of the cylinders (the pushrod tube area), there should be some air deflector tin under there as well.
Also, it looks like someone made a homemade blockoff for the fuel pump, using the guide/base piece and plugging it. Are you going to convert back to a mechanical fuel pump?
By quantity, you're probably missing most of the tin. To replace it, be sure to buy good quality used German tin from the classifieds- the aftermarket stuff has a really poor fit.  Your engine will be MUCH happier to have the rest of the tin in place!
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houseofboyd
Samba Member
Joined: September 28, 2014
Posts: 613
Location: Flatwoods, Ky
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| Posted: Sat Nov 08, 2014 10:39 pm Post subject: |
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| WD-40 wrote: |
| houseofboyd wrote: |
| Can you tell from the pics what tins I may be missing? |
Yep, it looks like you are missing:
* under-pulley tin
* rear pulley tin (the big curved piece that seals against the apron)
* Two separate pieces of tin that direct the hot air from the oil cooler down and out of the engine compartment
* The large curved tin piece that goes on the back to seal against the firewall
* The left and right "sled tin" under the cylinders (directs air rearward out of the engine)
* The left and right small tin pieces (can't remember the name) that goes on the rear part of the outer lower cylinders to direct air downward
* The left and right flap assemblies at the base of the fan shroud, and the linkage between them. (And since you are missing these, you are probably missing the thermostat and the thermostat bracket as well...)
* Since your engine has J-tubes instead of heater boxes, you would need the industrial engine "shields" to direct the air, as the sled tins normally have one side formed by the wall of the heater boxes. Or, you could just put heater boxes back on it.
I can't quite tell if you have the "Hoover Bit" on the oil cooler or not... but you might need that piece too. (It's small but important.) Also, if you could take a picture of the underside of the cylinders (the pushrod tube area), there should be some air deflector tin under there as well.
Also, it looks like someone made a homemade blockoff for the fuel pump, using the guide/base piece and plugging it. Are you going to convert back to a mechanical fuel pump?
By quantity, you're probably missing most of the tin. To replace it, be sure to buy good quality used German tin from the classifieds- the aftermarket stuff has a really poor fit. Your engine will be MUCH happier to have the rest of the tin in place! |
Wow, thanks for taking the time to look and respond...I'll get some more pics a.s.a.p...And yes, I plan to buy used OEM tin, no cheap aftermarket....thanks again...more pics soon! And yes, I plan to go back to mechanical fuel pump....
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Our 1968 Zenith Blue Beetle: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=619501
My '74 SB Build On The Samba: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=609943
Our Web Site: http://www.kentuckyhotwheels.com
1968 VW Beetle
2012 Turbo VW Beetle |
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houseofboyd
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Joined: September 28, 2014
Posts: 613
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