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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17009 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2020 11:33 am Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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Oh, didn't realize those were for VanCafe. Too bad the plugs were fighting you. It would be a nice feature to be able to clean them out. Those are a bargain. Nice welds. _________________ ☮️ |
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VdubVanner Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2017 Posts: 734 Location: Cowtown AB
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Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2020 2:56 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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THANK YOU! THANK YOU! THANK YOU! And DOUBLE THANK YOU!!!!
These are my dream fuel rails. Order incoming to VC regardless of any increase in price. I'd now call those fail safe.
Bravo! Standing ovation at my end -- and I believe a game changer for that possible fire-starting item.
I can hardly wait to caress a pair.
It's really true: "All good things come to those who wait." _________________ "Fritz", a temperamental and unforgiving 1989 Westy that proudly bears his German flags and status as a member of the exclusive GoWesty Belly Flop Club.
1989 Westy Makeover: GoWesty 2.3L Engine plus plus plus https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0 |
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The Machinist Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2009 Posts: 42 Location: Santa Cruz
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Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2020 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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VdubVanner wrote: |
THANK YOU! THANK YOU! THANK YOU! And DOUBLE THANK YOU!!!!
These are my dream fuel rails. Order incoming to VC regardless of any increase in price. I'd now call those fail safe.
Bravo! Standing ovation at my end -- and I believe a game changer for that possible fire-starting item.
I can hardly wait to caress a pair.
It's really true: "All good things come to those who wait." |
I hope I'm not posting these too early. I believe they may still have a few with the NPT plugs in stock. I just shipped some of the welded ones last week. If you order now, you should probably make sure to specifically request the welded ones. |
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VdubVanner Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2017 Posts: 734 Location: Cowtown AB
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Posted: Thu Jul 30, 2020 5:19 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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Thanks! I'm actually going through Barry at Werke-1 in B.C. since he owes me credit on a malfunctioning GoWesty fridge fan and just sent him a link to this page so he knows what I want. I can wait until I get those welded beauties.
Keep up the innovating and great work.
Cheers! _________________ "Fritz", a temperamental and unforgiving 1989 Westy that proudly bears his German flags and status as a member of the exclusive GoWesty Belly Flop Club.
1989 Westy Makeover: GoWesty 2.3L Engine plus plus plus https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0 |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32432 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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4Gears4Tires Samba Member
Joined: October 08, 2018 Posts: 2982 Location: MD
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Posted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 6:20 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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Yep, that's going to work. You also have a convenient place to tap into for a fuel pressure gauge.
There are manifolds with any number of ports though. You could have gotten a 4 in a row manifold. https://www.amazon.com/Interstate-Pneumatics-FPM44...ANJ409NP2H That said, having the inlet/outlet offset from the injectors could make access just slightly easier so that's certainly something worth considering.
Are you going to use oetiker clamps? _________________ '87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition |
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buspor63 Samba Member
Joined: February 17, 2005 Posts: 1179 Location: Knoxville,TN Where America stops for gas
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Posted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:36 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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That's all we need right there. Like the originals, only four potential fittings to leak _________________ Imagine that, theres not an "h" in either Westfalia or Syncro? |
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satchmo Samba Member
Joined: November 23, 2003 Posts: 285 Location: Crosby, MN
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Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2021 7:24 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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My aluminum fuel rails from Van Cafe started leaking a considerable amount of gas at the threaded plug just recently. They are two years old. I tightened up the plug and the leak stopped, but now I'm watching them closely. Would be nice to have a set of those welded rails so no worries.
Satchmo |
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VdubVanner Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2017 Posts: 734 Location: Cowtown AB
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Posted: Mon Aug 02, 2021 9:38 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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That's why I waited. Welded ends are the ultimate solution to a recurring problem which may cause an engine fire. Skip the threaded handmade or GoWesty versions and get the foolproof BEST. It makes absolutely no sense to penny pinch on a critical component like a fuel rail. What's the old saying? "Penny wise, pound foolish"! Buy a set and be done with it.
https://www.vancafe.com/025133317BILLET-p/025133317billet.htm[/i] _________________ "Fritz", a temperamental and unforgiving 1989 Westy that proudly bears his German flags and status as a member of the exclusive GoWesty Belly Flop Club.
1989 Westy Makeover: GoWesty 2.3L Engine plus plus plus https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0 |
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The Machinist Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2009 Posts: 42 Location: Santa Cruz
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Posted: Tue Aug 03, 2021 10:19 am Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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satchmo wrote: |
My aluminum fuel rails from Van Cafe started leaking a considerable amount of gas at the threaded plug just recently. They are two years old. I tightened up the plug and the leak stopped, but now I'm watching them closely. Would be nice to have a set of those welded rails so no worries.
Satchmo |
That is sketchy! I don't know why they would start to leak after two years. We were so careful with them to make sure they were good before they shipped out. I'm so glad we moved to the welded plugs. |
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VdubVanner Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2017 Posts: 734 Location: Cowtown AB
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Posted: Wed Aug 04, 2021 9:38 am Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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I think I pointed out a page or three back that the sealant was likely going to be the weak link in the chain due to its relatively poor "gasoline" solvent rating. The welded ends take care of that issue. _________________ "Fritz", a temperamental and unforgiving 1989 Westy that proudly bears his German flags and status as a member of the exclusive GoWesty Belly Flop Club.
1989 Westy Makeover: GoWesty 2.3L Engine plus plus plus https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0 |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32432 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Vashon Samba Member
Joined: September 23, 2012 Posts: 200 Location: Vashon Island
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Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2021 5:50 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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Out of curiosity, what are the clips for?
Tim '87 westy |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32432 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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VdubVanner Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2017 Posts: 734 Location: Cowtown AB
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Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2021 7:58 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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djkeev wrote: |
Well.......
I've done the fuel rail thing,
Without exception, I've tossed the OEM plastic garbage.
My 86 is now in Washington State running GoWesty's fuel rails with zero issues.
My 90 is running a home made set using air compressor fittings, threaded plugs and threaded nipples.
It is seeping fuel at the threaded junctions.
So I ordered up a set of what I now consider the Gold standard of fuel rails....... VanCafe.
Do yourself a favor, just order VanCafe's from the get go.
Dave |
Three cheers for Dave: Hip, Hip, Hooray! Hip, Hip, Hooray! Hip, Hip, Hooray!
Good decision. Once you've had a close look at the Van Cafe versions, you'll never look at anything else. You also have to realize that those rails are made by a specialty shop that might decide not to make them any more. What if that gifted Machinist gets ill? Get 'em now and be worry free. They truly are perfection. _________________ "Fritz", a temperamental and unforgiving 1989 Westy that proudly bears his German flags and status as a member of the exclusive GoWesty Belly Flop Club.
1989 Westy Makeover: GoWesty 2.3L Engine plus plus plus https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=...mp;start=0 |
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Xevin Samba Member
Joined: January 08, 2014 Posts: 7599
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Posted: Fri Nov 12, 2021 8:40 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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When I bought the Van last fall. We changed out all the fuel lines. I saw this thread. Made sense to buy VC rails with less moving parts. Nice chunk of metal. Thanks Machinist.
WestyBob wrote: |
Before I tapped into this thread but very recently I chose the VanCafe ones because I did have some concern about the Gowesty ones potentially leaking in time. More money for sure but for me personally any threat at all of leakage ... well ... that's a real bad location for a leak. So, I traded more money for hopefully peace 'o mind. |
RIP Bob. Your spare parts are serving me well. Your Vanagon legacy continues. Thank you. _________________ Keep on Busin'
67rustavenger wrote: |
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo! |
Clatter wrote: |
Damn that Xevin... |
skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
I respect Xevin and he's a turd |
SGKent wrote: |
My God! Xevin and I 100% agree |
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The Machinist Samba Member
Joined: November 16, 2009 Posts: 42 Location: Santa Cruz
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Posted: Mon Mar 18, 2024 2:28 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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Does anybody know what the actual function of the fuel rails is? My best guess is that it is sort of a buffer chamber to smooth out the pulsing of the fuel injection system. With two inlets and two outlets, all of them connected to the same chamber, the fuel just flows in and back out. I was careful to match the factory dimensions as closely as possible, assuming that the volume of the chamber is important. Otherwise it seems like you could just do away with the fuel rails altogether.
There is another fuel rail that is machined with a much smaller bore connecting the inlets and outlets. Is that even providing the function that these were made for? I wonder if it has any effect on how the engine runs. |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32432 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Posted: Mon Mar 18, 2024 2:35 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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The Machinist wrote: |
Does anybody know what the actual function of the fuel rails is? My best guess is that it is sort of a buffer chamber to smooth out the pulsing of the fuel injection system. With two inlets and two outlets, all of them connected to the same chamber, the fuel just flows in and back out. I was careful to match the factory dimensions as closely as possible, assuming that the volume of the chamber is important. Otherwise it seems like you could just do away with the fuel rails altogether.
There is another fuel rail that is machined with a much smaller bore connecting the inlets and outlets. Is that even providing the function that these were made for? I wonder if it has any effect on how the engine runs. |
My guess is considering the volume and pressure in the lines that you could just use some 5/16" Tees and call it good.
Lots of clamps but......
some of the older Porsche fuel rails were just welded pipe into the double Tee configuration. They work just fine if you can find them. _________________ Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert |
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kamzcab86 Samba Moderator
Joined: July 26, 2008 Posts: 7893 Location: Arizona
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Posted: Mon Mar 18, 2024 3:46 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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The Machinist wrote: |
Does anybody know what the actual function of the fuel rails is? My best guess is that it is sort of a buffer chamber to smooth out the pulsing of the fuel injection system. |
On the Golf side of Digifant, VW also referred to the (plastic) fuel rail as a fuel distributor, which eliminates 4 injector hoses, unlike K-Jetronic that has no fewer than 6 individual fuel lines running across the engine. The Digifant fuel pressure regulator in the Golfs is mounted to the rail, and the rail has a return line to the tank. The rail in those cars is kind of a fuel sump for the injectors to draw from, which could, I suppose, be thought of as a buffer chamber as well. FWIW, Subaru uses the same basic design, with aftermarket alternatives: https://www.fiveomotorsport.com/subaru-top-feed-conversion-kit-radium-engineering/ . _________________ ~Kamz
1986 Cabriolet: www.Cabby-Info.com
1990 Vanagon Westfalia: Old Blue's Blog
2016 Golf GTI S
"Real knowledge is to know the extent of one's ignorance." - 孔子 |
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ragnarhairybreeks Samba Member
Joined: October 26, 2009 Posts: 1888 Location: Sidney B.C. Canada
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Posted: Mon Mar 18, 2024 5:48 pm Post subject: Re: Metal Fuel rails.. GoWesty? VanCafe? Others? |
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The Machinist wrote: |
Does anybody know what the actual function of the fuel rails is? My best guess is that it is sort of a buffer chamber to smooth out the pulsing of the fuel injection system. With two inlets and two outlets, all of them connected to the same chamber, the fuel just flows in and back out. I was careful to match the factory dimensions as closely as possible, assuming that the volume of the chamber is important. Otherwise it seems like you could just do away with the fuel rails altogether.
There is another fuel rail that is machined with a much smaller bore connecting the inlets and outlets. Is that even providing the function that these were made for? I wonder if it has any effect on how the engine runs. |
I can answer in a way. I made fuel rails much like yours but slimmer. Just a 5/16” diameter inner bore. The central bore has a plug pressed in and welded. Been using them for 6 months and I haven’t noticed any difference in van performance.
I made them as slim as I could to reduce weight. And just to be different than the plain old square section.
I’m skeptical of any fluid buffer notions. I’m willing to be corrected, but I just don’t see it in the van set up.
Powder coated some, anodized some.
Cheers
Alistair
_________________ '86 7 passenger syncro, converted to westy pop top, project still in progress
'82 westy, diesel converted to gas in '94, now gone...
https://shufti.blog/
Old address still works...
http://shufti.wordpress.com |
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