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Innovative VW 4x4 Bug build, without syncro parts!
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BurghBug
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 7:15 pm    Post subject: Innovative VW 4x4 Bug build, without syncro parts! Reply with quote

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Link



Link


This site has some details about a 4x4 Bug that some guys in Brazil built:

http://www.4x4brasil.com.br/forum/gaiola-baja-e-buggy/77703-fusca-4x4.html

The google translator for Portuguese is very weak, so much of what I 'know' is a guess based on sketchy translation and looking at the pictures. Are there any theSamba members from Brazil or that speak Portuguese? If so, please help!

That said, near as I can tell, they built the power take off by adapting a regular 2wd type 2 transmission, making an extended pinion shaft that ran out of a new hole in the nose of the transmission(!) Now, before you think I'm smoking something funny, please check page 10, where they discuss reinforcing and sealing the nose of the case, and extending the pinion shaft.

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If that really is the approach they took, and the engineering behind this is solid, this opens a whole world of 4x4 builds that no longer need to rely on Syncro transmissions!

For a front diff, they custom built a case for a regular rear diff, flipping it so it would spin the correct way.

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The front suspension and drivetrain seems to have also come from a Bus, with a fabricated subframe to hold the tops of the struts.

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And for at least a while they used a home built decoupler.

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So there you have it.. how to make a 4x4 bug without using Syncro parts!

Of course they didn't stop there.. they use the bus motor and some rear suspension components, reinforced the pan, added vacuum boosted disk brakes all around, added a cage, and a bunch of other touches. Looks like it turned out to be a heck of a car. The only thing missing is lockers Wink

Enjoy!
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Brian
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 17, 2015 9:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

4x4loko
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petrol punk
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seems like they just figured a way to get power off the pinion shaft and out the nosecone. I think I'd rather just buy a Samurai if I wanted a 4x4.
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ORANGECRUSHer
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 7:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

what a waste of time, and a super to boot!
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 7:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 2 wheel drive transmission was designed to do exactly what they did. Officers cars in WWII were 4 wheel drive. While some hackage did occur in making this they are only following the original design.
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Brian
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which seems to have worked just fine.
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earthquake
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why do some people just have to bash other peoples cars because they don't like it, your opinion pretty much only matters to you.
I think its a pretty cool car and they did a nice job on it, as for being a Super that saves a lot of problems like being able to use struts from a front drive car to make powering the front wheels easier. Using a cut up trans to get the center section and have VW drive flanges is a nice piece of backyard engineering.

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Brian
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 18, 2015 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Seriously. I would love to drive a 4x4 bug like that.
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hotrodsurplus
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So what makes you experts think that's a Super?

And since when is it a bad idea for backyard engineers to express a whole lot of ingenuity on such a common car? Before you answer that, remember what forum you're on. Seriously, the second most abundant thing in Brazil beyond big round asses are VW Beetles.

Look at that front gear carrier. I've never seen anyone here even ATTEMPT that. And they have few tools. For those of you clowning this thing, show some respect. It's impressive on several levels.
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ORANGECRUSHer
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 10:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

"For those of you clowning this thing, show some respect. It's impressive on several levels."

Yeah, you need to take it down a notch. It's not the poster's rig and the pictures are five years old. I'm hardly attacking anyone.

Don't get your panties in a bunch, I'm no stranger to doing things just 'cause you can. I'm just not impressed like you are so sue me.
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petrol punk
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

hotrodsurplus wrote:
So what makes you experts think that's a Super?

And since when is it a bad idea for backyard engineers to express a whole lot of ingenuity on such a common car? Before you answer that, remember what forum you're on. Seriously, the second most abundant thing in Brazil beyond big round asses are VW Beetles.

Look at that front gear carrier. I've never seen anyone here even ATTEMPT that. And they have few tools. For those of you clowning this thing, show some respect. It's impressive on several levels.
I don't think the front gear carrier is the impressive part of this build. that's a pretty easy part to make yourself if you have machine tools at your hand. I'm more impressed by how they managed to get power off the pinion shaft and out the nose cone.
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hotrodsurplus
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ORANGECRUSHer wrote:
"For those of you clowning this thing, show some respect. It's impressive on several levels."

Yeah, you need to take it down a notch. It's not the poster's rig and the pictures are five years old. I'm hardly attacking anyone.

Don't get your panties in a bunch, I'm no stranger to doing things just 'cause you can. I'm just not impressed like you are so sue me.



...says the guy who called this a Super.

I guess I found your button.

In my few years I've found that the ones who actually do rather than spectate have very little negative to say about other peoples' work. Respect for others' work comes from personal experience.

Panties. How cute. Laughing


Last edited by hotrodsurplus on Tue Jan 20, 2015 12:15 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ORANGECRUSHer
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 12:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Struts = super afaic

I'm done here.
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71StandardReduction
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That actually looks like some kind of small Front wheel drive car front frame/suspesnion.
which would actually make it much easier to convert to 4WD.
Also in one of the front gearbox pics you can see where the frame head was cut off.
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BurghBug
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2015 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, looks like I was a little wrong about there being no Syncro parts in the build. That rather distinctive looking front strut seems to have come from a Quantum Syncro.

http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.jim...GvIIDI0eBM

The little bit of the front subframe visible in the picture looks a lot like the one they used as well. So, there is a little Syncro in there after all. I still think this is a very creative build!

Also worth mentioning, the biggest problem with the build according to the article was getting the front suspension set up correctly. They even said the front diff carrier was 'easy', given access to the right tools.
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javabug
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 21, 2015 8:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Well, looks like I was a little wrong about there being no Syncro parts in the build. That rather distinctive looking front strut seems to have come from a Quantum Syncro.


Look at it this way: a Quantum would have that same front suspension, Syncro or not. I'd be surprised if Quantum Syncros made it down to Brazil, given the climate (I'm saying this without any research, so take it with a grain of salt).

So, you could assume it's from a regular FWD Quantum, and stick to your original statement.
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chubby53
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have to say this thing is pretty cool. Tons of respect here. I think it would be the bomb to have a Baja that the front wheels worked too. I can't even count of how many times I would of loved to have some action on the front end to get me out of a situation. I would suggest some kind of locker on the drive shaft so you are not alway in 4wd. Very cool though.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 2:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm kinda curious to know what supports the rear of the car now. He cut the torsion splines completely out of the rear housing.
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BurghBug
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 3:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Post 55 has a picture that shows a separate spring and shock setup.

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The text with it says something about rear of van suspension, but it doesn't look like a VW bus rear suspension to me. Maybe someone with more bus knowledge will chime in..

But wait, here's a side picture of a T25 rear suspension. Picture a disk instead of drum brake, and I think it is right after all.

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Last edited by BurghBug on Thu Jan 22, 2015 6:21 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2015 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm not sure why the hate, but I think it's a pretty cleaver build. I also got a pretty good kick out of the first video where he pulled a stuck jeep out of the mud with the 4x4 bug..

I will say the steering set up looks sketchy as hell but I guess do what yea gotta do to make it go.. Laughing
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