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rubbachicken
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Joined: October 05, 2004
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Location: socal
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 Posted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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well, what else have you got lined up for us ? 
| dhaavers wrote: |
^^^ Glad to hear it, Mark...that was the idea!
Cheers!
- Dave |
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lucy our westy
lucy's BIG adventure
meet 'burni'
markswagen {mobile mechanic} san diego area all early VW's cared for.
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dhaavers
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Joined: March 19, 2010
Posts: 7752
Location: NE MN (tinyurl.com/dhaaverslocation)
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| Posted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 7:07 am Post subject: |
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I'm thinking about an easy way to put a 2nd story on a Syncro camper...
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86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS> |
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Paulbeard
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Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Mon Aug 03, 2015 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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So I am going to go with this resistor swap as a replacement, nothing more. I'll try not to ask too many really stupid questions as I put everything back together. I'm keeping the original blower. It works, it just lacks direction. That should be resolved once this is done.
My flap sealant is a cork gasket material I found in my local hardware emporium. Easily cut, fits under the clips. Belt and suspenders with a little contact cement as well.
Not gonna glue the heater box halves together. In the video I watched that helped get most of this worked out, the guy drilled thru the glue tabs and zip-tied it all up. I already drilled the holes for that.
This is a bigger job than I anticipated, mostly because of the weird stuff I found — or didn't find. There was no vent hose to the passenger fresh air vent. So on the few trips we have taken, my passenger has been slowly cooking…
There is a lot of non-factory wiring with notes like "short to ground" on a wire that has exposed conductor. Another says something about an O2 sensor, also not connected.
The PO or other wiring anomalies I think I can deal once I get closer to sewing the patient up.
Edit: I think the dirt was also depressing, that there was so much of it. Not to anthropomorphize but it seems like she hasn't been cared for very well.
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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Paulbeard
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Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 10:58 am Post subject: So many versions: a little clarification plz? |
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I have the Mopar part in hand (yay, FLAPS) and have sponge bathed the heater/air box once more. You wouldn't believe the state of it.
So based on what I am reading ,it would be hard to find a less useful place for the factory resistor, in a blind channel with no airflow that I can see. Admittedly, I'm just looking at the half it was mounted in. But no wonder it got hot enough to melt plastic and I have to wonder if the dashboard fires I hear mentioned stated there. Lots of airflow, some combustible foam and paper…poof…
Putting that to one side, I see where you all are putting yours and if y'all like it, it's good enough for me. Moving the wires over may take some careful photographic study.
Question: there are two big squarish flaps that I don't see the function of since I have no way to actuate them. No control bar or anything. They're independent. Do they somehow get moved by airflow in the box itself? I just want to make sure I'm not missing anything. I can see that putting this back with all these control levers is going to be the biggest part of this.
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32563
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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Paulbeard
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 11:42 am Post subject: |
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| djkeev wrote: |
Those flaps are a one way air check valve.
If you aren't moving with the fan running the air pressure closes those flaps (which forced air while underway pushes open) to prevent forcing air out backwards through the front air scoop.
They help Direct the fan forced air out the dash outlets.
Dave |
As I suspected. But I don't like to rely on that
I am starting (?) to think this heater box was designed after the sheet metal was done and the design budget was overdrawn. I appreciate frugality (the Volkswagen way) but only to a point.
The new resistor is mounted. I need to get some foam to remount the core. Once that's done, I can move the wires to the new resistor. I drilled out the mounting hole for the old one to route them them through. Seemed sensible.
Many thanks to dhaavers for coming up with this and all who have contributed to this mod. Any frustration in my posts here is mostly with myself and occasionally for the folks who gifted us these challenges.
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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Paulbeard
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Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 2:17 pm Post subject: |
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| vanagon1991 wrote: |
Another job off the list. I only used 3 speeds and the original switch so I bypassed what I believe to be the third speed on this 4 speed resistor. You can hear the speed difference in video... https://youtu.be/nvxZ5Iq0Ehk
I also had to create/use a small yellow jumper on the green wire to reach the top stock yellow wire. Thanks Dave...U-DUH-MAN!
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Thanks a ton for that picture, just what I needed.
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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Howesight
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Joined: July 02, 2008
Posts: 3273
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Paulbeard wrote: |
| djkeev wrote: |
Those flaps are a one way air check valve.
If you aren't moving with the fan running the air pressure closes those flaps (which forced air while underway pushes open) to prevent forcing air out backwards through the front air scoop.
They help Direct the fan forced air out the dash outlets.
Dave |
As I suspected. But I don't like to rely on that
I am starting (?) to think this heater box was designed after the sheet metal was done and the design budget was overdrawn. I appreciate frugality (the Volkswagen way) but only to a point.
The new resistor is mounted. I need to get some foam to remount the core. Once that's done, I can move the wires to the new resistor. I drilled out the mounting hole for the old one to route them them through. Seemed sensible.
Many thanks to dhaavers for coming up with this and all who have contributed to this mod. Any frustration in my posts here is mostly with myself and occasionally for the folks who gifted us these challenges. |
I agree! The Vanagon HVAC system was originally intended to rely heavily on ram air instead of a fan. The 1980 Vanagon required a buyer to pay extra for the optional HVAC fan. The later 1983.5 and on HVAC box was simply a rather poorly-adapted iteration of the first version. It would have been easy for VW to design a box that, like Toyota trucks, for example, left a space for an AC evaporator to be easily installed, but nooooo. . . VW was not going to do that since summers in Bremen and Hamburg are not hot enough to warrant that kind of thinking. 
Dear 1970's VW engineers: Can you say "export market"?
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dhaavers
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Joined: March 19, 2010
Posts: 7752
Location: NE MN (tinyurl.com/dhaaverslocation)
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 5:22 pm Post subject: |
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| Paulbeard wrote: |
The new resistor is mounted. I need to get some foam to remount the core.
Once that's done, I can move the wires to the new resistor...
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Keep it up & git 'r done, Paul...all you have to do is the work...
- Dave
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86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS> |
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Paulbeard
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Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 8:57 pm Post subject: Success. |
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This is a cool mod. Buttoned everything up, not without issues, but the blower works better than ever and I feel a lot better about that than the ceramic time bomb that was in there. I hope the vents and flaps are better, but I'll find out in time.
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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Paulbeard
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Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Tue Aug 04, 2015 11:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Howesight wrote: |
I agree! The Vanagon HVAC system was originally intended to rely heavily on ram air instead of a fan. The 1980 Vanagon required a buyer to pay extra for the optional HVAC fan. The later 1983.5 and on HVAC box was simply a rather poorly-adapted iteration of the first version. It would have been easy for VW to design a box that, like Toyota trucks, for example, left a space for an AC evaporator to be easily installed, but nooooo. . . VW was not going to do that since summers in Bremen and Hamburg are not hot enough to warrant that kind of thinking.
Dear 1970's VW engineers: Can you say "export market"? |
<sigh> Indeed. How many Miatas or Accords or Camrys or interchangable SUV/pickups are on the road simply because they were designed to appeal to a broader market? Looking at the size of the heater/air box for what it does makes you crazy. And no cabin air filter? The amount of dirt that came in through the vent system, not on people's feet — argh. I like simple vehicles, reliable and servicable, but I put a high value on function. I have a kitchen and two twin beds to offset the deplorable HVAC, thank goodness.
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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dhaavers
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Joined: March 19, 2010
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Location: NE MN (tinyurl.com/dhaaverslocation)
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| Posted: Wed Aug 05, 2015 7:42 am Post subject: |
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^^^ Paul -
Any chance you cleaned/lubed the tail bearing on your original blower motor while it was out?
Notorious for seizing up due to the dust/dirt hitting it from the unfiltered fresh air (as you noted).
If not, no problem - search "Mullendore Port"...
- Dave
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86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
<EDITED TO PROTECT INNOCENT PIXELS> |
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Paulbeard
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Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Aug 05, 2015 2:58 pm Post subject: Overheating? What the? |
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| dhaavers wrote: |
^^^ Paul -
Any chance you cleaned/lubed the tail bearing on your original blower motor while it was out?
Notorious for seizing up due to the dust/dirt hitting it from the unfiltered fresh air (as you noted).
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I did after seeing all the mentions of it. I think it helped…
| dhaavers wrote: |
If not, no problem - search "Mullendore Port"...
- Dave |
Seen it mentioned, I'll look up what it means.
Just took the old girl for a warmup so I could see about bleeding out the air that was in the heater core…and overheated. Yikes. Had the heat on, per instructions, mucked about with the fan and the vents to see how they worked and they do, but as soon as I rolled into my parking spot, the red light was flashing…
All kinds of drama in the engine room, tanks a-bubbling, steam working it's way out. I opened the bleed screw and got a little hiss for my pleasure. Started her up after a bit and revved up to 2000 a couple of times and the needle stayed in the happy place.
So once she's good and cool I'll do another little test run and see if we're sorted out.
With all the issues around bleeding the system and the confusion of a no-fill radiator in front, etc., why has no one put a filler port in the rear pillars behind one of those grills? A filler and bleeder valve up there would seem to solve everything.
So now someone can tell me why it won't work. 
To this point:
| howesight wrote: |
| It would have been easy for VW to design a box that, like Toyota trucks, for example, left a space for an AC evaporator to be easily installed |
Why not put the evap under the rear seat? You have a blower there for the secondary heater: why not have both under there, sharing the blower and have the vents that much closer to the driver, maybe even running some ductwork up there.
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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sandcough
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Joined: August 23, 2011
Posts: 80
Location: Brooklyn
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| Posted: Mon Aug 10, 2015 11:42 am Post subject: |
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| So would this resistor work for the ac blowers? I am having a hard time finding a replacement. |
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jvan
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Joined: April 25, 2013
Posts: 162
Location: cascadia
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| Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 12:05 pm Post subject: |
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thank you dhaavers and rest for the excellent post and thread. some thoughts and questions....
The sealing stuff memory like foam from napa..better than the standard foam window seal stuff? Or as Paulbeard mentioned cork material?
Bench testing...i thought my brown wire was grounded. In dhaavers photo i though u mentioned this is power to the van? Are grounds always negative? Also, what gauge wire to use?
Also,
| Quote: |
i recently did this modification to a customers van, IMHO the 4th speed is not worth the wiring and a new switch.
but a big than you to the OP for discovering this, it'll save many people $ |
But is only 1 extra wire and a $10 switch...the 4th speed doesnt really do that much work vs the 3rd?
All in all looking forward to doing this as i already took all apart and failed with a used blower motor (yes stupid to take apart and install motor...and why on earth glued tabs? really seals that much more?) and or bad switch. Ordering new motor, resistor, and switch now. Cant wait to take apart again clean thoroughly, re-wire etc.....   
P.S.
sound deadening and insulation..?...was thinking of cramming in a combo of standard insulation over the space blanket like material pasted to the "firewall"...thoughts?
edit* if u are all curious i heard van cafe will be stocking resistors in 1-2 months...but whats the point of us going that route when we can pick one up for what i assume will always be significantly less than what van cafe is going to charge for a custom built resistor? Longevity? Smoother and faster speeds? Anyways...
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dhaavers
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Joined: March 19, 2010
Posts: 7752
Location: NE MN (tinyurl.com/dhaaverslocation)
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| Posted: Thu Sep 03, 2015 4:20 pm Post subject: |
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^^^ Hey j - I'll try to answer Q?'s from your post as well as your PM:
1) Just pick your favorite flap-seal. I went with the NAPA option when I found it,
although the felt weatherstrip idea certainly has merit and I'd consider it.
Different ideas, different materials, same purpose; I guess they all work.
(Cork seems to me like it'd be too firm for good seal unless it's literally the
PERFECT thickness; I'd love to hear from someone who's done it...???)
2) Yes: in the van, brown is ground. My bench-test jumper-for-power was a new piece
of (unfortunately/confusingly) brown 14 gauge wire. I apologized then and now... 
Yes: in 99% of the automotive world, grounds are negative.
(Don't ask about those crazy Brits, or the 1960's Beetles...just...don't...)
3) I agree that the Jeep resistor I chose does not give much extra "oomph" between
speed 3 & 4. Ultimately, my new "4-speed" switch bit the dust shortly after install
(I blame China) so I've rewired and I'm running with just 3 speeds, which is all I
really need...works great. 
4) My box came with clips at each tab. After hacking apart the glue joint, I simply
used the clips to reassemble because it still fit together pretty much airtight
and I didn't want me (or anyone else) to have to deal with that glue again... 
5) By all means, add some sound deadening and/or insulation while the dash
is out! There are many good threads on this: "What else to do with dash out"
for example...or check the FAQ's on this forum...good stuff!
All good questions...Cheers!
- Dave
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86 White Wolfsburg Westy Weekender
"The WonderVan"
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chris garrett
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Joined: January 11, 2015
Posts: 347
Location: Highland Park IL
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| Posted: Sun Jan 03, 2016 6:34 pm Post subject: Re: Dash blower rebuild with (cheap) Jeep resistor - w/PICS |
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Can someone please tell me how to remove the flaps from the hvac box so I can replace the padding?
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dbeierl
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Posts: 164
Location: Providence, Rhode Island, USA
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| Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 10:13 am Post subject: |
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| sandcough wrote: |
| So would this resistor work for the ac blowers? I am having a hard time finding a replacement. |
No, the AC blowers are much more powerful than the heater blower. They'll take a lower resistance with a higher power rating. |
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Forthwithtx
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Joined: July 14, 2014
Posts: 717
Location: Fort Worth
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| Posted: Mon Jan 04, 2016 9:09 pm Post subject: Re: Dash blower rebuild with (cheap) Jeep resistor - w/PICS |
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| chris garrett wrote: |
| Can someone please tell me how to remove the flaps from the hvac box so I can replace the padding? |
Some of them aren't coming out. It's tricky, but they can be done in situ.
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Skidub
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| Posted: Tue Jan 05, 2016 2:11 pm Post subject: Re: Dash blower rebuild with (cheap) Jeep resistor - w/PICS |
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Depending how much time and patience you want to dedicate to splitting the box open you can remove and rebuild the flaps. I would recommend this approach if you have it out of the van.
Splitting the bottom housing cover is slow work but not difficult. It goes back on with #8 3/4" stainless screws. At least that is what I used.
This is the foam that I used for the flaps. Worked great and seemed to have the right dimensional thickness and squishiness for the plastic flap retainer tabs.
http://m.homedepot.com/p/Armacell-2-in-x-30-ft-R-1-Foam-Insulation-Tape-TAP18230/100539553
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86 Syncro GL Tin Top
Subaru 2.5L Swap
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