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Tram
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2015 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Clatter wrote:
Just because you got a crank or two ground wrong, doesn't mean they are all bad.

Now that beaings SUCK dimensionally more often than not,
Having your crank grind and line-bore cutter adjustment tweaked a little is part of the routine, if you want the numbers all correct.

Try it - crush a bearing into place in a case and measure the ID with good tools.
When you mic everything, all standardized and right and all,
most of the bearings today are not going to give you clearances in the right range of the spec.
If even within spec at all...


I'm just not a fan of grinding away metal unless it's necessary. I'm one of these goobers who will replace a brake rotor over machining it every time too.

I fail to see how grinding a crank will solve any issues we're talking about, though.
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D/A/N
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:18 pm    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

So, we’re coming up on 5 years since this was posted and I’m the dumbass who got the shit motor from team Tram. Has anyone ever run into a set of the dreaded .040 bearings Tram warned us about? I can’t find anyone else on the site who has in all these years.

Also, FWIW, the set of bearings Tram posted about did have a steel backed center main bearing. Though when we talked about it in person, Tram maintained that at one point all of the bearings were steel backed Rolling Eyes

Anyway, just wondering if anyone can confirm that there are bad batches of .040 bearings out there.
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calvinater
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:00 am    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

What bearings do you have now?
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gregson1
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:10 am    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

Steel backed bearings weren't installed until sometime during late '62 - early '63. There's a Workshop Bulletin that discusses the change, but I can't locate it right now. I took apart an original '63 Type 3 engine (built in late '62) that actually had non-steel backed bearings installed. The installation of steel backed bearings was done for all VW Types, not just the Type 3, so VW learned the lesson very early on.

That Kolbenschmidt would attempt to provide non-steel backed bearings in this day and age is borderline criminal, in my opinion. I'm having good luck with Silverline bearings, for what it's worth.
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Erik G
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:37 am    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

D/A/N wrote:
So, we’re coming up on 5 years since this was posted and I’m the dumbass who got the shit motor from team Tram. Has anyone ever run into a set of the dreaded .040 bearings Tram warned us about? I can’t find anyone else on the site who has in all these years.

Also, FWIW, the set of bearings Tram posted about did have a steel backed center main bearing. Though when we talked about it in person, Tram maintained that at one point all of the bearings were steel backed Rolling Eyes

Anyway, just wondering if anyone can confirm that there are bad batches of .040 bearings out there.


I would ask Roy @ Mofoco
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 12:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

gregson1 wrote:
Steel backed bearings weren't installed until sometime during late '62 - early '63. There's a Workshop Bulletin that discusses the change, but I can't locate it right now. I took apart an original '63 Type 3 engine (built in late '62) that actually had non-steel backed bearings installed. The installation of steel backed bearings was done for all VW Types, not just the Type 3, so VW learned the lesson very early on.

That Kolbenschmidt would attempt to provide non-steel backed bearings in this day and age is borderline criminal, in my opinion. I'm having good luck with Silverline bearings, for what it's worth.


TRW bought Kolbenschimdt out, and is part of the reason for the lack of the steel backing. It was a cost cutting move. TRW applied that cost cutting across all of their product lines, including Fram filters, which is owned by Allied Signal corp (who owns TRW).
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Mr.Duncan
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 1:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

gregson1 wrote:
I'm having good luck with Silverline bearings, for what it's worth.


I too have had very good luck with Silverline main bearings.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:12 am    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

Mr.Duncan wrote:
gregson1 wrote:
I'm having good luck with Silverline bearings, for what it's worth.


I too have had very good luck with Silverline main bearings.


All I use and sell for main bearings is Silverline....I do have some super old stock of other brands in strange sizes too.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:04 am    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

From what I have seen almost every part I bought in the last few years is a far cry from what replacement parts used to be. Mainly mechanical parts, some of the engine seals like runner boots are better yet injector seals I got from 3 places were all a mix match and certain gaskets better hang on to the old ones.

Even new cars in the last 20 years are parts either a poor design and designed with a very short life span. It's all plastic and a joke considering the cost of a new car of truck.

I can't say if it's just old VW parts like bearings that are junk , I can't imagine newer auto engines have bearings that fail even if replacements. Yet quite a lot like intake manifolds and oil pans and valve covers are molded plastic.

I've seen videos where if one wants to fix up an old ford of GM car or truck they still make replacement distributors and all the parts to bring one back from the dead.

Many vintage VW parts are at least reproduced and sold by many on-line sites so one can at least try to get them to fit well and work.

For engines bearings seem to be the main issue.

I recall tram trying to get bearings to find they fail and at that time ones made in Mexico seemed to be a better choice.

Bosch ignition parts as far as points and plugs are far from what they used to be.

It's the same with hand tools as well as timing lights and DVOM's and dwell /tachs unless one can find an old working unit or pay a fortune for a high end product, many don't exist since new cars don't use timing lights or dwell meters. Many don't even use a key for the ignition or to unlock the door.

It's a 10 year time frame for newer cars and parts become obsolete.

They don't want you to repair it just buy new.

I hope my engine holds up, it has old German bearings , seems like so called progress just wants all the old cars off the road. Some people get creative.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:13 am    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

blues90 wrote:
From what I have seen almost every part I bought in the last few years is a far cry from what replacement parts used to be. Mainly mechanical parts...


Some of us have been saying that for years. Rolling Eyes
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 8:52 am    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

blues90 wrote:
From what I have seen almost every part I bought in the last few years is a far cry from what replacement parts used to be. Mainly mechanical parts, some of the engine seals like runner boots are better yet injector seals I got from 3 places were all a mix match and certain gaskets better hang on to the old ones.

Even new cars in the last 20 years are parts either a poor design and designed with a very short life span. It's all plastic and a joke considering the cost of a new car of truck.

I can't say if it's just old VW parts like bearings that are junk , I can't imagine newer auto engines have bearings that fail even if replacements. Yet quite a lot like intake manifolds and oil pans and valve covers are molded plastic.

I've seen videos where if one wants to fix up an old ford of GM car or truck they still make replacement distributors and all the parts to bring one back from the dead.

Many vintage VW parts are at least reproduced and sold by many on-line sites so one can at least try to get them to fit well and work.

For engines bearings seem to be the main issue.

I recall tram trying to get bearings to find they fail and at that time ones made in Mexico seemed to be a better choice.

Bosch ignition parts as far as points and plugs are far from what they used to be.

It's the same with hand tools as well as timing lights and DVOM's and dwell /tachs unless one can find an old working unit or pay a fortune for a high end product, many don't exist since new cars don't use timing lights or dwell meters. Many don't even use a key for the ignition or to unlock the door.

It's a 10 year time frame for newer cars and parts become obsolete.

They don't want you to repair it just buy new.

I hope my engine holds up, it has old German bearings , seems like so called progress just wants all the old cars off the road. Some people get creative.


^^^^^^THIS^^^^^ is why it's important to ask questions and buy engine parts from people/companies that actually build engines every day. The parts change so fast that one week a particular brand of bearing is the best and next week, it's the worst. I will tell you, it's hard to keep up. That is why I build all the motors here and arrange all the parts buying. My guys who actually send in the orders get really annoyed sometimes because all of a sudden I will tell them, "Hey, we can't buy that part from that place anymore because they are all garbage" and then have to switch suppliers. It more that the quality control isn't there. There are still plenty of great parts available and they aren't all a million dollars but you just have to know what to buy from who and just because you used a particular brand 4 years ago in your build, doesn't mean that is the best now.
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heimlich Premium Member
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:08 am    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

I've seen a lot of the manufacturers go to non steel backed bearings. That's the main question I get from customers. I tell them that all of mine have the split steel backed one. If the split crank bearing doesn't have some weight to it then it isn't steel backed.

If you can get a good grind then you shouldn't shy away from ground cranks. NOS ones are getting harder to find. Factory grinds in VW boxes are available too.
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Erik G
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:09 am    Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders Reply with quote

that's why I said "ask roy" above, as I figure you have built more engines than anyone else regularly on thesamba. Also why I would only use someone that does this every day if I'm spending the big bucks for a motor
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