Author |
Message |
Tram Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003 Posts: 22727 Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
|
Posted: Fri Jul 24, 2015 4:07 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Clatter wrote: |
Just because you got a crank or two ground wrong, doesn't mean they are all bad.
Now that beaings SUCK dimensionally more often than not,
Having your crank grind and line-bore cutter adjustment tweaked a little is part of the routine, if you want the numbers all correct.
Try it - crush a bearing into place in a case and measure the ID with good tools.
When you mic everything, all standardized and right and all,
most of the bearings today are not going to give you clearances in the right range of the spec.
If even within spec at all... |
I'm just not a fan of grinding away metal unless it's necessary. I'm one of these goobers who will replace a brake rotor over machining it every time too.
I fail to see how grinding a crank will solve any issues we're talking about, though. _________________ Немає виправдання для війни! Я з Україною.
Bryan67 wrote: |
Just my hands. And a little lube. No tools. |
To best contact me, please use the EMAIL function in my profile |
|
Back to top |
|
|
D/A/N Samba Member
Joined: August 13, 2010 Posts: 2227 Location: 11222
|
Posted: Sat Oct 26, 2019 6:18 pm Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
So, we’re coming up on 5 years since this was posted and I’m the dumbass who got the shit motor from team Tram. Has anyone ever run into a set of the dreaded .040 bearings Tram warned us about? I can’t find anyone else on the site who has in all these years.
Also, FWIW, the set of bearings Tram posted about did have a steel backed center main bearing. Though when we talked about it in person, Tram maintained that at one point all of the bearings were steel backed
Anyway, just wondering if anyone can confirm that there are bad batches of .040 bearings out there. _________________ '69 Fuel Injected Squareback. "B" D-jet. 1600 with balanced rotating assembly and lightened flywheel. Full flow and external filter.
'70 Riviera. 1904cc w/ 40mm Dellortos, 019 distributor, Steve Tims “super stock” 37x32 heads, Web Cam 218, Vintage Speed SS143 Super Speed exhaust, 1 1/2” heater boxes |
|
Back to top |
|
|
calvinater Samba Member
Joined: September 06, 2014 Posts: 3329 Location: 802 The Pointless Forrest
|
Posted: Sun Oct 27, 2019 4:00 am Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
What bearings do you have now? _________________ "Albatross"! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
gregson1 Samba Member
Joined: December 13, 2004 Posts: 464
|
Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:10 am Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
Steel backed bearings weren't installed until sometime during late '62 - early '63. There's a Workshop Bulletin that discusses the change, but I can't locate it right now. I took apart an original '63 Type 3 engine (built in late '62) that actually had non-steel backed bearings installed. The installation of steel backed bearings was done for all VW Types, not just the Type 3, so VW learned the lesson very early on.
That Kolbenschmidt would attempt to provide non-steel backed bearings in this day and age is borderline criminal, in my opinion. I'm having good luck with Silverline bearings, for what it's worth. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Erik G Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002 Posts: 13278 Location: Tejas!
|
Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 9:37 am Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
D/A/N wrote: |
So, we’re coming up on 5 years since this was posted and I’m the dumbass who got the shit motor from team Tram. Has anyone ever run into a set of the dreaded .040 bearings Tram warned us about? I can’t find anyone else on the site who has in all these years.
Also, FWIW, the set of bearings Tram posted about did have a steel backed center main bearing. Though when we talked about it in person, Tram maintained that at one point all of the bearings were steel backed
Anyway, just wondering if anyone can confirm that there are bad batches of .040 bearings out there. |
I would ask Roy @ Mofoco _________________ Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22422 Location: Kimball, Mi
|
Posted: Mon Oct 28, 2019 12:17 pm Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
gregson1 wrote: |
Steel backed bearings weren't installed until sometime during late '62 - early '63. There's a Workshop Bulletin that discusses the change, but I can't locate it right now. I took apart an original '63 Type 3 engine (built in late '62) that actually had non-steel backed bearings installed. The installation of steel backed bearings was done for all VW Types, not just the Type 3, so VW learned the lesson very early on.
That Kolbenschmidt would attempt to provide non-steel backed bearings in this day and age is borderline criminal, in my opinion. I'm having good luck with Silverline bearings, for what it's worth. |
TRW bought Kolbenschimdt out, and is part of the reason for the lack of the steel backing. It was a cost cutting move. TRW applied that cost cutting across all of their product lines, including Fram filters, which is owned by Allied Signal corp (who owns TRW). _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
Mr.Duncan Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2012 Posts: 3542 Location: Houston, TX
|
Posted: Tue Oct 29, 2019 1:30 pm Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
gregson1 wrote: |
I'm having good luck with Silverline bearings, for what it's worth. |
I too have had very good luck with Silverline main bearings. _________________ (Owner) www.vintagecarleds.com
Red 1971 Squareback Thread
Red 1966 Beetle Thread
---------------------------------------------------
1971 Green Super Beetle (sold)
1966 Ghia (sold)
1971 Blue Super Beetle (sold)
1966 Java Green Std Beetle (sold)
1971 Red Squareback (sold)
1966 Red Beetle |
|
Back to top |
|
|
[email protected] Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2002 Posts: 4394 Location: Brew City
|
Posted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 7:12 am Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
Mr.Duncan wrote: |
gregson1 wrote: |
I'm having good luck with Silverline bearings, for what it's worth. |
I too have had very good luck with Silverline main bearings. |
All I use and sell for main bearings is Silverline....I do have some super old stock of other brands in strange sizes too. _________________ Please "LIKE" us on facebook to see what we are working on.
https://www.facebook.com/mofoco?ref=ts&fref=ts
www.mofoco.com
Cylinder Head Reference Sheet |
|
Back to top |
|
|
blues90 Samba Member
Joined: March 14, 2009 Posts: 1912 Location: Hollywood ,CA
|
Posted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 10:04 am Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
From what I have seen almost every part I bought in the last few years is a far cry from what replacement parts used to be. Mainly mechanical parts, some of the engine seals like runner boots are better yet injector seals I got from 3 places were all a mix match and certain gaskets better hang on to the old ones.
Even new cars in the last 20 years are parts either a poor design and designed with a very short life span. It's all plastic and a joke considering the cost of a new car of truck.
I can't say if it's just old VW parts like bearings that are junk , I can't imagine newer auto engines have bearings that fail even if replacements. Yet quite a lot like intake manifolds and oil pans and valve covers are molded plastic.
I've seen videos where if one wants to fix up an old ford of GM car or truck they still make replacement distributors and all the parts to bring one back from the dead.
Many vintage VW parts are at least reproduced and sold by many on-line sites so one can at least try to get them to fit well and work.
For engines bearings seem to be the main issue.
I recall tram trying to get bearings to find they fail and at that time ones made in Mexico seemed to be a better choice.
Bosch ignition parts as far as points and plugs are far from what they used to be.
It's the same with hand tools as well as timing lights and DVOM's and dwell /tachs unless one can find an old working unit or pay a fortune for a high end product, many don't exist since new cars don't use timing lights or dwell meters. Many don't even use a key for the ignition or to unlock the door.
It's a 10 year time frame for newer cars and parts become obsolete.
They don't want you to repair it just buy new.
I hope my engine holds up, it has old German bearings , seems like so called progress just wants all the old cars off the road. Some people get creative. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22422 Location: Kimball, Mi
|
Posted: Wed Oct 30, 2019 11:13 am Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
blues90 wrote: |
From what I have seen almost every part I bought in the last few years is a far cry from what replacement parts used to be. Mainly mechanical parts... |
Some of us have been saying that for years. _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
[email protected] Samba Member
Joined: August 15, 2002 Posts: 4394 Location: Brew City
|
Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 8:52 am Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
blues90 wrote: |
From what I have seen almost every part I bought in the last few years is a far cry from what replacement parts used to be. Mainly mechanical parts, some of the engine seals like runner boots are better yet injector seals I got from 3 places were all a mix match and certain gaskets better hang on to the old ones.
Even new cars in the last 20 years are parts either a poor design and designed with a very short life span. It's all plastic and a joke considering the cost of a new car of truck.
I can't say if it's just old VW parts like bearings that are junk , I can't imagine newer auto engines have bearings that fail even if replacements. Yet quite a lot like intake manifolds and oil pans and valve covers are molded plastic.
I've seen videos where if one wants to fix up an old ford of GM car or truck they still make replacement distributors and all the parts to bring one back from the dead.
Many vintage VW parts are at least reproduced and sold by many on-line sites so one can at least try to get them to fit well and work.
For engines bearings seem to be the main issue.
I recall tram trying to get bearings to find they fail and at that time ones made in Mexico seemed to be a better choice.
Bosch ignition parts as far as points and plugs are far from what they used to be.
It's the same with hand tools as well as timing lights and DVOM's and dwell /tachs unless one can find an old working unit or pay a fortune for a high end product, many don't exist since new cars don't use timing lights or dwell meters. Many don't even use a key for the ignition or to unlock the door.
It's a 10 year time frame for newer cars and parts become obsolete.
They don't want you to repair it just buy new.
I hope my engine holds up, it has old German bearings , seems like so called progress just wants all the old cars off the road. Some people get creative. |
^^^^^^THIS^^^^^ is why it's important to ask questions and buy engine parts from people/companies that actually build engines every day. The parts change so fast that one week a particular brand of bearing is the best and next week, it's the worst. I will tell you, it's hard to keep up. That is why I build all the motors here and arrange all the parts buying. My guys who actually send in the orders get really annoyed sometimes because all of a sudden I will tell them, "Hey, we can't buy that part from that place anymore because they are all garbage" and then have to switch suppliers. It more that the quality control isn't there. There are still plenty of great parts available and they aren't all a million dollars but you just have to know what to buy from who and just because you used a particular brand 4 years ago in your build, doesn't mean that is the best now. _________________ Please "LIKE" us on facebook to see what we are working on.
https://www.facebook.com/mofoco?ref=ts&fref=ts
www.mofoco.com
Cylinder Head Reference Sheet |
|
Back to top |
|
|
heimlich VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016 Posts: 6612 Location: Houston, Texas
|
Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:08 am Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
I've seen a lot of the manufacturers go to non steel backed bearings. That's the main question I get from customers. I tell them that all of mine have the split steel backed one. If the split crank bearing doesn't have some weight to it then it isn't steel backed.
If you can get a good grind then you shouldn't shy away from ground cranks. NOS ones are getting harder to find. Factory grinds in VW boxes are available too. _________________ www.vwnos.com [email protected]
Classic Brands. Classic Quality.
Not all parts are made the same. NOS OE/OEM parts made mainly in West Germany, Early Germany, and Early Brazil are where VW produced the best quality parts and best fitting products.
5% Off your order with coupon code: 5%OFF
Restored Distributors Available (<--Click here) |
|
Back to top |
|
|
Erik G Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002 Posts: 13278 Location: Tejas!
|
Posted: Thu Oct 31, 2019 9:09 am Post subject: Re: Attention: Quality Control Alert- Engine Builders |
|
|
that's why I said "ask roy" above, as I figure you have built more engines than anyone else regularly on thesamba. Also why I would only use someone that does this every day if I'm spending the big bucks for a motor _________________ Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|