Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Aircooled Vanagon M-TDI AHU/1Z Swap
Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, 4
Forum Index -> Vanagon Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
camerobias
Samba Member


Joined: April 24, 2014
Posts: 30
Location: USA
camerobias is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2015 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tjet wrote:
camerobias wrote:


Edit: there's no throttle so it obviously wasn't WOT. So I guess it was stuck max diesel pressure? I'm a professional auto mechanic but still new to diesels. Still trying to get used to the new terminology. Smile


I don't understand what you mean about no throttle, unless it's in your blog...

I agree with Waldi & Libby. The fuel (or eng oil) somehow found a different path into the combustion chambers, not thru the injectors. I don't know how the M-TDI setup works, but any air circuit into the intake (including an EGR) could potentially be a path for fuel (or oil).

Anyway, sorry to hear about your conversion troubles & the runaway event. If this was easy, everyone would do it. I plan on converting my Syncro to an ALH out of my Jetta, but I need to pay for my kid's college degree first....

I'm wondering if it would be better to test the engine on a test stand prior to the install. The only thing that my be a factor using a test stand would be applying a load to test the VNT actuator operation (or wastegate valve). A dyno would be a better idea in that case. I dyno'd my last race type gas engine (non vw). I spent around $2500 total, because the cam & lifters failed during the dyno pull, but it would have been around 500-600 without any problems + a dyno tune.. I also helped to install & remove it from the dyno which saved some money. Even though it was expensive, I'm still glad I did it because it would have failed in the vehicle with an additional headache factor.

Good luck Cool


Everything was dyno'd, on both engines. They custom build the pumps, hook them up to the engines then run them on the dyno to test power output and fine tune them. My response about the throttle was because there is no throttle plate in a diesel. They are always wide open to oxygen, you only control fuel. Like I said, I'm still not massively familiar with diesel terminology, but I'd assume that since there's not throttle body or throttle plate, it must not be called a throttle. Perhaps that's still what it is called.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Facebook Instagram Gallery Classifieds Feedback
?Waldo?
Samba Member


Joined: February 22, 2006
Posts: 9752
Location: Where?
?Waldo? is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2015 4:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

camerobias wrote:
My response about the throttle was because there is no throttle plate in a diesel. They are always wide open to oxygen, you only control fuel. Like I said, I'm still not massively familiar with diesel terminology, but I'd assume that since there's not throttle body or throttle plate, it must not be called a throttle. Perhaps that's still what it is called.


You are correct. No throttle. I don't call any part on any of my diesels the throttle. I don't ever drive WOT either although I do press the pedal to the floor on occasion. I don't get any sort of gas mileage. I don't get gas (at least not the kind that vehicles burn as fuel) and the container I don't put the gas into is not the gas tank. Very Happy

I do have an accelerator pedal and connected to the accelerator pedal is the accelerator cable which, on the other end, is hooked to the accelerator lever on the injection pump which rotates the accelerator shaft and when rotated as far as it goes is at full power or max fuel. I sometimes get diesel or fuel (but not often) and when I do, I put the diesel (or fuel) into my fuel tank and get excellent fuel economy which is readily apparent because my vehicle goes more miles per gallon than its gas guzzling cousins. Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
narendra.vw
Samba Member


Joined: February 07, 2013
Posts: 440
Location: Bangalore India
narendra.vw is offline 

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2015 7:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

noganav wrote:
narendra.vw wrote:
Slight play caused the pump to act erotically.


It happens to the best of us. Embarassed

Oops correction, erratically.
The Word would have woken up many. Wink Laughing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
camerobias
Samba Member


Joined: April 24, 2014
Posts: 30
Location: USA
camerobias is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2016 9:23 am    Post subject: Re: Aircooled Vanagon M-TDI AHU/1Z Swap Reply with quote

So I guess I haven't updated this in a while. Our injection pump blew up for a fourth time. I had an EGT gauge installed so I was able to see it happen. Essentially a block off plate on the side of the pump would blow off, ruin the pumps internal pressure and spill diesel everywhere. Apparently the internal pump pressure helps set timing (correct me if I'm wrong.) But basically the moment the plate blows off the pump starts over-fueling which causes EGT temps to spike like crazy which blows up the turbo causing a run-away.

Regardless, none of this happened on the last failure. I just saw the gauge temps, pulled over and cursed my pump builder. I've since had this guy Jerry (or Gerry, Jery, Geri, really have no clue. Never met him in person.) buy his pump back. Then I had Karl at Westy Ventures build us one of his Cummins Diesel pumps that he modifies for TDI use.

It has been fantastic ever since!

So mystery solved and hola from Southern Baja!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Facebook Instagram Gallery Classifieds Feedback
?Waldo?
Samba Member


Joined: February 22, 2006
Posts: 9752
Location: Where?
?Waldo? is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2016 9:39 am    Post subject: Re: Aircooled Vanagon M-TDI AHU/1Z Swap Reply with quote

Pump pressure is what determines dynamic timing advance.
Without proper pump pressure, the timing will get progressively retarded as rpms increase. Retarded timing causes high EGTs as the fuel is being injected so late that it does not have time to burn and turn into useful work and instead burns in the exhaust. Because of this, the issue is not that the pump 'overfuels' without the correct advance, but rather fuels late causing high EGTs and possibly damaging the turbo from excessive heat. With several (4?!) failing from the same builder, I would get a refund on that pump, source a Land Rover 300TDI injection pump, have the bracket machined for mounting, and get on with life.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member


Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12103
Location: Port Manteau
Zeitgeist 13 is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2016 9:43 am    Post subject: Re: Aircooled Vanagon M-TDI AHU/1Z Swap Reply with quote

I'd love to get a postmortem on those dead pumps in order to determine why they were building excess internal pressure. Seems like a user error kind of thing relating to the pump rebuilder.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
camerobias
Samba Member


Joined: April 24, 2014
Posts: 30
Location: USA
camerobias is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Feb 01, 2016 9:49 am    Post subject: Re: Aircooled Vanagon M-TDI AHU/1Z Swap Reply with quote

Well Karl at Westy Ventures took a minor look. I couldn't let him actually open the pump since it'd void my opportunity to warranty/return it, but apparently from what he could see there was a spring that was way to weak allowing something to hammer on the side of the pump. Wish I knew more to describe it better. But the pumps from Jerry were built using AAZ cases stuffed full of TDI parts. So there was a block off plate that kept braking where the idle arm used to be.

Regardless. The new Cummins diesel pump is working fantastically.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website Facebook Instagram Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Waldi
Samba Member


Joined: February 28, 2014
Posts: 1752
Location: Germany
Waldi is offline 

PostPosted: Mon Feb 15, 2016 7:29 am    Post subject: Re: Aircooled Vanagon M-TDI AHU/1Z Swap Reply with quote

Hello A. Libby,

the last 2 Pumps i got from my builder are also from Landis.
1 of them running already since half year good in a sysncro.

What timing do you set to the Landy Pumps, and how is your feeling about power/torque in relation to rpms ?
Do you know some dyno testing results with this setup ?

Edit: we are mashining the pump housing
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Vanagon All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: Previous  1, 2, 3, 4
Page 4 of 4

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2023, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB
Links to eBay or other vendor sites may be affiliate links where the site receives compensation.