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Using Blue Sea SI-ACR Charging Relay w/GoWesty Aux Bat Kit
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mdrsteve
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 10:04 am    Post subject: Using Blue Sea SI-ACR Charging Relay w/GoWesty Aux Bat Kit Reply with quote

Hi, all. I've got a new to me '87 Westy. The PO added the GoWesty Battery kit and Aux battery under the drivers seat. I want to replace the GoWesty relay with the Blue Sea SI-ACR Charging Relay. Since I'm not super clear on what was modified to add the GoWesty kit, I'm not super clear on upgrading the relay.

Do I just replace the GoWesty relay with SI-ACR? Am I right that the GoWesty kit has a wire running to the relay from the alternator that I won't need for the SI-ACR? If so, what should I be doing with that wire?

Any help for this noob would be greatly appreciated!!

Thanks!
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newfisher
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 10:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Try this :

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=633007&highlight=aux+battery+diagram
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mdrsteve
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 10:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That thread helps. It confirms that the GoWesty relay has a wire coming from the starter that the Blue Sears SI-ACR doesn't use.

I'm still not clear if I need to route this wire from the starter elsewhere.
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termuehlen Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 1:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You should verify everything with the instructions of your Blue Seas ACR. My Blue Seas ACR is connected directly to each of the Batteries. (No blue wire from the alternator is necessary to operate it.) I can't tell you how your Gowesty Isolator was wired, but you will most likely be able to tape up the end of the blue wire, as you won't need it.

I would recommend that you basically rewire your system. Jay Brown (thatvwbusguy) is a great source for the basic wiring components that you will need. If you are going to keep your Gowesty house battery under the drivers seat, a good fused connection to each of the positive battery terminals will operate the ACR. You may want to order a Blue Seas fuse block to run your accessories. I would run a new positive under the vehicle from the passenger seat battery to the house battery box and place the ACR there. I recommend the following wires:

"8 ga., fused, with grommets and plastic loom positive cable from my existing starting battery post compression connection to the blue seas 7610 ACR bolt, 6 feet long.

8 ga., fused positive cable from the 1/4" bolt on my aux battery to the blue seas 7610 ACR bolt, 1 foot long.

A ground cable from the ground terminal of the blue seas 7610 ACR to the existing ground bolt on my aux battery box at the original location of the VW "kitchen" relay, 1 foot long."

This will get your isolator operating properly. Then you will need to determine how you want to feed your house battery loads off the house battery positive.
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newfisher
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 14, 2015 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

+1
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Timwhy
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So much better than the stock charging relay!

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thatvwbusguy
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the GW kit is currently installed and working, you can leave all of the wiring that goes from the auxiliary battery positive post up to the dash (to power the inside lights etc) alone and simply improve the charging path to the auxiliary battery with a larger gauge wire.

The Blue Sea Systems 7610 ACR only requires 3 wire to hook up.

1) A wire (8AWG or larger would be best) from the positive post of the starting battery to one of the posts on the ACR

2) A wire of the same gauge from the other post on the ACR to the positive post on the auxiliary battery.

3) A ground wire (14AWG is fine) with a 10A inline fuse to chassis ground.

If you can post a few photos of the GW kit install, I should be able to walk you through getting rid of the stuff you don't need and keeping the stuff that you still want.
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mdrsteve
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks! Will definitely post one next week! (off camping this weekend with the family!)
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Thebeas
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 11:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

about to tackle this same project.
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DwarfVader
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In all the research I've done to date on putting in an aux system, the Blue Sea ACR is far superior to the yardina.
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thatvwbusguy
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It depends on your needs. I have installed both and they are both high quality voltage sensing relays.

For a small auxiliary battery (anything that will fit under the driver's seat), the Yandina C100 is a great solution. For anything over 55Ah, I like the Blue Seas 7610 because it allows you to choose the gauge of wire you want to use. The Blue Seas ACR can handle more amperage as well, which can come in handy for folks with engine conversions or high output alternators.
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DwarfVader
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 22, 2015 6:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thatvwbusguy wrote:
It depends on your needs. I have installed both and they are both high quality voltage sensing relays.

For a small auxiliary battery (anything that will fit under the driver's seat), the Yandina C100 is a great solution. For anything over 55Ah, I like the Blue Seas 7610 because it allows you to choose the gauge of wire you want to use. The Blue Seas ACR can handle more amperage as well, which can come in handy for folks with engine conversions or high output alternators.


That's a question I had actually...

given what I want to do electrically, is it worth looking into a beefier alternator than the stock that comes with a WBX 1.9 or 2.1?

I know many run their Aux setups off the stock alternator, so I'm sure it's not necessary, rather I'm curious if it's not a bad step to take.
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mdrsteve
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

thatvwbusguy wrote:

If you can post a few photos of the GW kit install, I should be able to walk you through getting rid of the stuff you don't need and keeping the stuff that you still want.


Sorry it took longer than expected, but here are a couple of pics of my current setup under the driver's seat...

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acegallagher
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PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2015 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
given what I want to do electrically, is it worth looking into a beefier alternator than the stock that comes with a WBX 1.9 or 2.1?

I know many run their Aux setups off the stock alternator, so I'm sure it's not necessary, rather I'm curious if it's not a bad step to take.


Your 90 amp stock alternator can likely handle charging up to 200 amp/hours of batteries correctly. Generically speaking maximum charge rate on flooded lead acid (FLA) batteries is 10 to 13% of the C20 amp hour rating. You will also see this expressed as C/10 to C/8 where C = the 20 amp hour rating. So for example a 100 AH rated battery max charge current is 10 to 13 amps

People make too much of a fuss out of the alternator amperage when the reason the stock alternator has a hard time with aux systems is because the voltage regulator output is usually too low to fully charge your batts. I wish this was more talked about on the samba but there are a few threads that cover it. There's two solutions, the first is buying one of the fancy adjustable regulators. The other is to solder in a diode from the regulator to ground on your regulator which will add 0.7 volts to the output if you do it right. This is covered on the Samba but I can't find the link at the moment. Somewhere out there is a post where someone describes in detail how to solder in a diode. It's fairly simple.

Links on the adjustable regulator:

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=363115&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=165075
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thatvwbusguy
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 04, 2015 5:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

mdrsteve, the easiest way to describe what you would want to keep to swap over from the GW kit to the Blue Seas 7610 would be to keep everything that runs from the auxiliary battery positive post up to the dash. This is the power out of the battery that runs all of the stuff up front.

You can remove the wires that run to the plastic circuit breaker, as well as the wires that connect the silver solenoid to the auxiliary battery positive post. This will leave you with a constant 12W wire coming from the dash that should be placed back on the stock relay in the position that it was originally connected to. If you don't have the GW instructions handy, I can send you a copy.
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Thebeas
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2015 10:23 am    Post subject: Re: Using Blue Sea SI-ACR Charging Relay w/GoWesty Aux Bat K Reply with quote

When you guys run the wire from the Arc to the starting battery, where do you run the actual wire? Is it okay to drill a hole and run it under the van?

I have my ARC behind the driver seat, the Aux battery under the drivers seat.

I figure a hole in each battery box is the best path?

dumb question I know...

also, my propsort charger...can I connect it to the correct terminals on the ARC?
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thatvwbusguy
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2015 10:40 am    Post subject: Re: Using Blue Sea SI-ACR Charging Relay w/GoWesty Aux Bat K Reply with quote

Running the wires under the van is definitely the best approach, especially if you use the walk through aisle between the front and back on a regular basis.

Be sure to install rubber grommets in the holes and protective loom over the wire to protect it. If you have any trouble finding materials locally, let me know and I will get you some pricing.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2015 10:45 am    Post subject: Re: Using Blue Sea SI-ACR Charging Relay w/GoWesty Aux Bat K Reply with quote

thanks Jay. I have all the grommets, just wanted to be sure.

What about the charger? I had it hooked up to the solenoid on the GW Aux kit. Can it be attached to the Blue Seas Arc in the same fashion?
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thatvwbusguy
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2015 5:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Using Blue Sea SI-ACR Charging Relay w/GoWesty Aux Bat K Reply with quote

I would connect the charger directly to the auxiliary battery and then let the ACR connect the two batteries when the auxiliary hits the combine voltage (13.0V for 90 seconds).

If you want to send all of the charging to the auxiliary battery to ensure that it charges completely in the shortest amount of time possible, put a toggle switch on the ground wire. With the switch turned to ON, the ACR will be in automatic mode. With the switch turned to OFF the ACR will keep the batteries separated.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 31, 2015 5:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Using Blue Sea SI-ACR Charging Relay w/GoWesty Aux Bat K Reply with quote

Quote:
also, my propsort charger...can I connect it to the correct terminals on the ARC


Can you provide some more information? If you have a Prosport Battery Charger / Conditioner with the capacity to manage two separate batteries, then you should connect it to each of the batteries and let it charge/condition each of the batteries based on the status of each when you power up the Prosport.
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