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ClassicCamper Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679
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Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 7:13 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Making slow progress with the electrical. Finally got this working last night:
The license plate light covers are SO fragile, I'm going to have to figure out a longer-term fix with better seals and lenses. _________________ 1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert |
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ClassicCamper Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679
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Posted: Fri Jun 19, 2020 10:14 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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So... finally got some time to provide an update. After removing the fusebox about 11 times and tracing every single wire I now have about 90% of the car wired correctly. I almost threw in the towel several times and was going to give up entirely. After many ‘nights’ ending about 3:00AM, mission accomplished. I ended up hand-drawing each fuse circuit in my own language:
Ended up doing 1 sheet for each fuse, gauge, switch and relay. Can not stress what a nightmare this was. If I can help anyone with wiring or if you would like pictures of my drawings, let me know.
Note: I could not find one wiring diagram for my 73 412 Variant. Nothing published on Samba or any book I owned matched; I had to hand draw most of the layout.
My car could have been a one off, this may not happen to you. If it does, let me know I’ll help you out.
After sorting all the connections, I now have signs of life on the dash:
I needed a major breather from the electric, so I decided to attach all of the door latching hardware, the door windows, seals and the window regulators. The driver side window regulator was shot. I had to disassemble it and rebuild it. What a major project that ended up being. I couldn’t stop the window from dropping back down. But.... success:
I decided to have my fuel pump rebuilt by Jim Adney. I’m partial to those old Bosch pumps and wanted it in there. I‘m really pleased with the results. So, I went ahead and installed it:
Once I installed that, I did some misc items and reinstalled all of the guides for the rear trunk as well as the latch mechanism, rubber seal and the defroster wiring.
I also jumped into the bumpers. Stripped all of the rust off and painted the brackets:
(Still contemplating which headlight cover to use)
My last item was installing the rear seat:
Anyone have any suggestions as to what I could use as a panel that goes under the rear armrest? I have no idea what to put down there.
Thanks for reading and the encouragement. _________________ 1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:11 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Very nice! I can show you some broken panels that went in the backseat arm rest area of the sedans and the diagrams of what the parts looked like.
They are similar in concept to the front door panels. They are masonite cards/panels that use the same prong and grommet system. Many had ashtrays inserted as well. Ray |
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ClassicCamper Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679
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Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 11:04 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Hiya Ray, I have the panels with the ashtrays.
What I am missing are whatever goes below the armrests. There is a void on mine.
You may not have this void as you have the sedan.
Any insight would be appreciated. Would love to get my hands on a set. _________________ 1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:19 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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ClassicCamper wrote: |
Hiya Ray, I have the panels with the ashtrays.
What I am missing are whatever goes below the armrests. There is a void on mine.
You may not have this void as you have the sedan.
Any insight would be appreciated. Would love to get my hands on a set. |
A picture please
Ray |
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ClassicCamper Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679
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Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 6:58 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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That is the side of the rear seat bench. What goes over that hole? _________________ 1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:03 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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ClassicCamper wrote: |
That is the side of the rear seat bench. What goes over that hole? |
There is a lower vinyl covered cardboard panel. Its two piece because on the wagons the ECU is under the right hand rear armrest:
Ray |
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1974vw412 Samba Member
Joined: September 17, 2017 Posts: 41 Location: ATLANTA
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Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 5:57 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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I have these, I can take one off and snap a picture and if you need a template, I can sketch one over paper. It is made of Masonite covered in leather. The leather wraps to the door. You need to use the metal panel clips to hold it together.
Michael |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:01 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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1974vw412 wrote: |
I have these, I can take one off and snap a picture and if you need a template, I can sketch one over paper. It is made of Masonite covered in leather. The leather wraps to the door. You need to use the metal panel clips to hold it together.
Michael |
yes....its just different from the sedans in that its two piece.... an upper and a lower.
Ray |
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ClassicCamper Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679
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Posted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 9:23 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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1974....That would be awesome if you could sketch what they look like. I have nothing there and it would be great to put something there. _________________ 1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert |
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scott3t Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2014 Posts: 39 Location: Washington, DC
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 11:41 am Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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It really looks great. Wow. So nice to see all the work and progress you have made. I'm way behind you on my 412 but wanted to say you're doing a great job. It helps my motivation as well.
I'm going to be needing to figure out all the wiring on my 412 as well. So may need your diagrams...
Does anyone know broadly the biggest differences - electrical or otherwise - between a) '73 412 and '74 412 and also between b) '74 412 sedan and '74 412 Variant? Is your Variant a '74? I"m only aware that the automatics in '74 started using the AFC fuel injection and my '74 sedan has the D-jetronic. So obviously some wiring differences there.
-Scott |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 6:50 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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scott3t wrote: |
It really looks great. Wow. So nice to see all the work and progress you have made. I'm way behind you on my 412 but wanted to say you're doing a great job. It helps my motivation as well.
I'm going to be needing to figure out all the wiring on my 412 as well. So may need your diagrams...
Does anyone know broadly the biggest differences - electrical or otherwise - between a) '73 412 and '74 412 and also between b) '74 412 sedan and '74 412 Variant? Is your Variant a '74? I"m only aware that the automatics in '74 started using the AFC fuel injection and my '74 sedan has the D-jetronic. So obviously some wiring differences there.
-Scott |
You have a 1974 with D-jet?.....does it have a manual transmission? Are you sure its a 1974?
What size engine?
Ray |
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ClassicCamper Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 7:37 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Quote: |
It really looks great. Wow. So nice to see all the work and progress you have made. I'm way behind you on my 412 but wanted to say you're doing a great job. It helps my motivation as well.
I'm going to be needing to figure out all the wiring on my 412 as well. So may need your diagrams...
Does anyone know broadly the biggest differences - electrical or otherwise - between a) '73 412 and '74 412 and also between b) '74 412 sedan and '74 412 Variant? Is your Variant a '74? I"m only aware that the automatics in '74 started using the AFC fuel injection and my '74 sedan has the D-jetronic. So obviously some wiring differences there.
-Scott |
Thanks for this, Scott! It's that kind of inspiration that keeps me going on this car. If you read my previous posts, I almost threw in the towel a couple of times and gave up. The wiring was a total beast. However, I have your back whether you have D-Jet or AFC FI. Can you post a picture of your engine? This way, I can see what we are working with. My sketches of each fuse circuit worked AND I've wired and unwired the car so many times until I got everything working in harmony, I pretty much know the wiring in my head. (at least for the time being).
Don't give up, you will be behind the wheel before you know it. _________________ 1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert |
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ClassicCamper Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 7:57 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Quote: |
The only way you could not have this cutout for your fuse panel is if someone removed the sheet metal panel from behind the carpet. It is an insert panel that covers the defroster tubes where these connect at the heater channels and rise up to the side defroster and windscreen register. |
Shout out to Ray for figuring out why I couldn't mount the the fuse panel since I've owned this car. I was able to obtain the sheet metal panel from Blair and Son's auto and made some significant progress on my wiring.
Here are some before pictures:
Here are the after pictures I was able to tackle tonight:
Really pleased with the way that this turned out, and everything is secure and the electrical components all operate properly. Obviously, I didn't put the correct amp fuses in the slots, I have since corrected that. I also ran the wiring for the heated seats as well as the air conditioner and radio.
That's it for tonight... more to come. As always, thanks for the support and ideas. _________________ 1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert |
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scott3t Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2014 Posts: 39 Location: Washington, DC
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:13 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Ray, yes- - I have a manual with D-Jet built in Feb '74. It has the 1700 with EA engine code.
And Ron - sounds great on the help with the wiring as we get down the road. It sounds like you have had your share of fun dealing with this. I remember back in high school I hooked up the battery backwards on this car. Burned out lots of wiring there. Ooops. Yes, I'll send a pic of the engine.
If this thing ever runs again, there are things I wonder about that I just accepted as fact and not knowing it could ever be any other way (squishy brakes, practically no heat, not starting if it was really wet/humid to name three). But I always loved this car.
-Scott |
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raygreenwood Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008 Posts: 21474 Location: Oklahoma City
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:14 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Excellent!
The KEY KEY KEY...with the fuse panel in this location....is to make sure that you have no leaks from the fender well, the radio antenna gasket and most especially from the corners of the windshield gaskets.
The scourge of this car is that those leaks will leak down on the wires....run down teh wires and fill your upside down relays up with water. This is why you see so many old 411 and 412 relays with the corners of the relay housings nipped off with a dremel grinding wheel to drain out water. Ray |
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scott3t Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2014 Posts: 39 Location: Washington, DC
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Posted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 8:18 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Whoa! That's a nice fuse panel. Excellent. You must be a very patient person. Heated seats and air conditioning? Getting fancy on us. |
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Hawker Samba Member
Joined: October 03, 2012 Posts: 123
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Posted: Thu Jun 25, 2020 12:55 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Top tip!
Clean up the contact surfaces on each fuse and holder to bright shiny brass. Then put a tiny dab of copper slip on the Brass nipple end of each fuse to stop (differential electrode), corrosion occurring and creating a resistance and heat at the fuse box.
Rob |
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ClassicCamper Samba Member
Joined: December 17, 2002 Posts: 679
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Posted: Fri Jun 26, 2020 8:06 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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Thanks Hawker, trying to get it all together, as best as I can.
I was actually able to get it out on the highway for a trial run this evening. What a great feeling! I was able to get it up to 70 MPH -- and it ran like a charm. I did have a few questions, hoping I can get some help/advice about:
1) I put the headliner on and totally forgot where the interior light goes. Now I am faced with cutting a hole into it and install one. Can anyone let me know where the light is supposed to go? This way I'll know where to cut. Also, if someone can show me a picture of the interior light for a 1973, I'd appreciate it. My car never had one when I bought it.
2) The car shifts a little rough into second gear. Is there an easy way to adjust the way the car shifts? (for example, is there a screw in the vacuum modulator that I can adjust?) If it's any more complicated then that, I'd rather have a shop do it when I can save up some cash.
Thanks for the continued help --- she's slowly getting back together. Tonight I fixed the annoying red brake light which wouldn't go out. Turned out to be a ground. I was surprised to see that the brake light wasn't attached to the emergency brake in anyway like the buses. Did the 73's have a switch there and I'm missing something? _________________ 1973 412 Wagon
1976 Westy
1978 SB Vert |
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Danno5 Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2016 Posts: 63 Location: Leavenworth, KS
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Posted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 1:22 pm Post subject: Re: My 412 these days.. |
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ClassicCamper wrote: |
Thanks Hawker, trying to get it all together, as best as I can.
I was actually able to get it out on the highway for a trial run this evening. What a great feeling! I was able to get it up to 70 MPH -- and it ran like a charm. I did have a few questions, hoping I can get some help/advice about:
1) I put the headliner on and totally forgot where the interior light goes. Now I am faced with cutting a hole into it and install one. Can anyone let me know where the light is supposed to go? This way I'll know where to cut. Also, if someone can show me a picture of the interior light for a 1973, I'd appreciate it. My car never had one when I bought it.
2) The car shifts a little rough into second gear. Is there an easy way to adjust the way the car shifts? (for example, is there a screw in the vacuum modulator that I can adjust?) If it's any more complicated then that, I'd rather have a shop do it when I can save up some cash.
Thanks for the continued help --- she's slowly getting back together. Tonight I fixed the annoying red brake light which wouldn't go out. Turned out to be a ground. I was surprised to see that the brake light wasn't attached to the emergency brake in anyway like the buses. Did the 73's have a switch there and I'm missing something? |
Something I can help on! Let me go downstairs and look at my headliner... ...my 4-door has the interior light mounted over the driver's side rear door just to the rear of the B-pillar. Exactly like this 4-door sedan from the 1973 brochure posted in the archives:
The weird thing is that when you look in the owner's manual on page 25 the interior light is a little further forward:
That looks like a window seal in the owner's manual and not a door-frame, so I am hypothesizing for all the wagon and the 2-door sedan the lights were placed a little further forward. Perhaps to aid in turning it on and off when reaching from the front driver's side door? The only other wagon I see in the archives that remotely has a picture were you can see this lines it up approximately with that above-the-B-pillar position seen in the owner's manual.
Love the wagon by the way. Followed your thread from the off-the-trailer pic. |
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