Neiman steering lock - no key

[BarryL]

...continued from page before...

Final assembly in reverse but with my new pin alignment order.

These are quite the exquisite mechanisms with superb engineering by Neiman. The key and pins interplay on three levels: at rest, while the key is being inserted, and rotation.

Now on to the column mechanism and ignition switch.

[BarryL]

The last things to do is examine the actual steering lock housing.

There isn't a lot that can be done to the steering column locking apparatus as it is assembled at the factory. This is the right side where the key lock barrel goes that does all the rotating and pulls the pin out of the column to free the steering wheel to unlock.

Mine I cleaned up inside with pipe cleaners. A little grease can be daubed on the guts.

The left side controls the electrical ignition switch.

This part interfaces with the lock.

The switch can be opened but I don't advise it as the four tabs break off since the housing is pot metal.

This is what is inside. It has a follower plate with three contacts: 30-power in, 15 coil on, 50 solenoid start. The mechanism has an anti-restart so the starter can't be forced into the flywheel.

This old one was pretty worn away where the current had eaten away on the start contact.

Short of the key saying "Neiman" on it I'm not sure what the make of these contraptions is. The black body has a VW emblem. The lock barrel has no name but uses a "Neiman VW" key. The electrical switch has a circle with "K" and "L" inside.

If anyone knows more post up.

[Tizian]

Hi Barry,

great write-up! Please document how you install the lock onto the steering column, too.

We had to remove the parcel tray the other day in order to apply the the correct vinyl covering onto it. BTW, why is this thing called parcel tray anyway? You can‘t even get your arm under there to remove that bolt underneath the speedo pod which holds the lock in place. Unlike the version without Neiman lock this bolt attaches from above and fastens the lock to the steering column bracket and to the pod assembly. Getting that bolt out is the easiest part of the exercise. Try to get that little bitch back in! This is a huge hassle. How did they do that in the factory? Are my arm muscles too fat? Where only skinny ladies doing the job at the factory? Ad some point, which took me about 2 hours, I managed to fiddle this bolt back in and tighten it. I then realized that my arm got stuck between dash and tray and I had to loosen some bolts and srews in order to free myself. That must have looked pretty funny: loosening that philips screw on the right side lefthanded with the right arm stuck under the dash…

What have I be doing wrong? Maybe it‘s easier to pre-assemble everything without the speedo in place to fiddle the bolt in from above throught the hole of the speedo and leaving the bolts loose in order to have enough space to install the speedo afterwards?

Please let us know

BTW:

The logo is from „Leopold Kostal GmbH“
https://www.kostal.com/de-de/unternehmen/geschichte/

[mdege]

Hi Tizian,

You are right that bolt is a real pain and I had to do it a few times during my restoration. The worst part is to get it all lined up when putting it together with out seeing what you are doing.

I sure it is easier without the speedo in place, but then installing that is the next challenge.
_________________
- Michael

1965 21F: Restoration of a former '65 firetruck
1963 Typ3 Notchback project
1988 Multivan Magnum 112i
1984 Standard: My son wanted a bug for his first car

[matthew henricks]

[BarryL]

Yeah it's a tight squeeze in there. I feel sorry for you guys but it appears you prevailed. I am not installing this steering/ignition lock at this time but I have done mine a few times.

To remove or install a steering/ignition lock you have to pull the steering wheel and turn lever etc. Best place to see all that is in The Bentley 1963-1967 Manual section V9 page 1 and 2.

First thing I do is take off the ground bolt at the battery cable. There are a lot of hot wires that are easy to spark behind the pod.

On mine I found that the bolt method was too frustrating unless the speedo is out. I put an exhaust stud on mine which gives you something to grope for.

The washer and nut I do with them individually taped to my finger. The nut takes a few tries but eventually it will hang on the top thread.

Then I use this 1/4" drive ratchet and socket by feel. For the first part of the threads I have to lift off the socket and move it but eventually I get to use the ratchet. You can purposely bugger the threads with plier bite to help the ratchet start sooner.

[Tizian]

Barry,

that stud method is a really good advice! Thank you! I should have asked before getting trapped under the dash I'll take this into account for the next removal. I would probably put some locktite onto the stud before fastening it in the lock housing. Just imagine what happens if the stud comes loose when you try to dismantle the whole thing. Don't think about it...

[BarryL]

Anyone know if or remember how to take this apart?

The front submarine looking snout thing (on the right in this photo) has a seam that looks like the factory put on that cover last.

[schnidlee]

[BarryL]

[matthew henricks]

Yup. That was how it came out. Now i remember...
_________________
1964 Original Owner build Thread. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=702135&highlight=

Ambulance Fan's. https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=627707&highlight=

Parts i am looking for:
64 bug nice used front/rear Black LHD floor mat.

[BarryL]

To finalize my reporting on the 1965 steering/ignition lock I went ahead and studied the last of the moving parts and their interaction.

This combined mechanism of the key barrel, the steering lock and the electrical switch is an exquisite masterpiece of engineering starting with the key's interaction with the pins all the way through to the final key removal and final lock after driving.

This first photo is looking into the steering lock mechanism into the cavity that the rotating cam mechanism was in. The front of the lock is on the right and the column is on the left in these photos. The part shown moving is not removable. It has a spring on the right. If anyone wants to see the shape I can do a sketch.

This is the column pin interface in the locked or "Halt" position.

The column lock pin "out" or inserted into the column to lock the steering from turning.

The interface in the "unlock" or withdrawn positon to free the steering.

The column lock pin withdrawn to unlock.

This is the brain or smart cam that controls all the positions. Here it is in the lock position or "Halt".

Here is the cam in the unlock with ignition "on" position. This is the "Fahrt" or "Journey" position.

The cam has several moving parts. Here it is naked with the "Halt" side on the left.

Here it is with the ignition on or "Fahrt" position on the left.

Every ledge, shape, crevace and groove of this cam thing does something.

This is the last removable part to show its moving parts that are not removable. It is a sliding, friction, extending and retracting device. There is a latch on a spring secured by a dinked pin. The latch interacts with the key to let the cam lock the column as the key is removed.

Here is the spring loaded pin that rides in and out of the groove of the cam. The loaded pin helps in the final locking as well as retracting the latch as it rotates. I can explain that part more if anyone cares.

The pin's spring is made captive at the factory.

This is the correct orientation of the two parts. The cam and sliding device must be fit this way only.

Here is the cam ready to be inserted into the chamber.

I am astounded at the engineering and interaction of all the moving parts that make up the steering lock/ignition mechanism. These parts were designed by humans sitting at a drafting table then the plans were sent to manufacturing for creation and assembly.

[Culito]

Thanks for all of your documentation, Barry!
_________________
Copyright CJ Industries, Inc.
'64 standard w/2.0L type 4
'62 bug

[Lind]

So I have been doing a little research on steering locks with no key, or a messed up key. I have figured out a couple things. First, a good locksmith can make a key by impressioning. They don't need anything other than their skills, and they don't have to take the lock apart. You can google it to find out how they do it.

Next, the number on steering lock keys is the direct code to the depth of the cut for the five grooves. This is the five digit number on the key that ends with an A. The first digit is the closest to the key ring, the last digit is the furthest inside the lock. 1 is the deepest cut, and 5 is no cut. This info is from the VW key code book. The number is only located on the key, nowhere on the lock.
_________________
.
Wanted:
Idaho VW license plate frames or other dealership items.
VWoA literature and early dealership or distributor literature/pictures/information
.

[qwerty]

The depth of the key cuts for the XXXXXA keys are:


xxxxxA series locks

Code Depth (in) Depth (mm)
1 0.216 5.4
2 0.236 5.9
3 0.256 6.4
4 0.276 6.9
5 0.291 7.25

The angle of the cut is supposed to be 110 degrees

I don't have the spacing info shoulder to center of first cut and cut to cut. If you have a key or a cylinder, you can measure the cut to cut spacing and make an educated guess on the shoulder to first cut spacings...