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Malokin Martin
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2007
Posts: 3099
Location: E-burg
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 Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 10:54 am Post subject: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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I'm having some difficulty with finding a stock muffler for the 1972 bus. I'm actually willing to buy a NOS one from the classifieds for a reasonable price but can't seem to find the exit pipe (except from the UK).
There's a complete one listed for a bonkers price.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1785751
This one looks like a good deal, but it doesn't have an exhaust pipe with it:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1836336
Is there a vendor for the pipe in the US? Like the one pictured below
If they're NLA or unobtanium, what are people doing for their mufflers for these years? I know there's a stainless version listed also, but the price is fairly steep for my daily driver. I've heard these are louder than stock anyway.
DO THE LATER YEARS FIT?
Thanks in advance!
Last edited by Malokin Martin on Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:29 am; edited 1 time in total |
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busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 51115
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:15 am Post subject: Re: 1972/1973 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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That's for a 1600 with the RH exit exhaust option (parts of Europe), the one you need has an angled inlet an is much shorter. You need one like this but maybe with a shorter tail pipe tip:
I seem to recall the OG ones exited on more of a 45 degree angle opposed to straight back:
72-74 all share the same muffler as well as earlier 411/412 cars.
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Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
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Слава Україні! |
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Malokin Martin
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2007
Posts: 3099
Location: E-burg
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:28 am Post subject: Re: 1972/1973 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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Thanks for the quick reply. I have one that exits on the right at the moment (passenger). Maybe I have a later version.
Do the later years fit (1975 and up)?
Anyone else have any advice on where to find the pipe or a complete muffler set up? What are other people doing for these years? |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21507
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:40 am Post subject: Re: 1972/1973 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| Malokin Martin wrote: |
Thanks for the quick reply. I have one that exits on the right at the moment (passenger). Maybe I have a later version.
Do the later years fit (1975 and up)?
Anyone else have any advice on where to find the pipe or a complete muffler set up? What are other people doing for these years? |
The 411 and 412 used the same muffler. Other than in books i have never seen anything but a right exit in the US. I have no idea why. Ray |
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Malokin Martin
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2007
Posts: 3099
Location: E-burg
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 11:47 am Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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Thanks for the quick reply.
Do the later years fit (1975 and up)?
Anyone else have any advice on where to find the pipe or a complete muffler set up? What are other people doing for these years? |
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busdaddy
Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004
Posts: 51115
Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 12:09 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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No, later ones have a wildly different flange shape.
Most go for something like this http://www.busdepot.com/071251053ek , aside from a different style tailpipe and the right exit it fits well and lasts.
That complete NOS one doesn't look too bad now eh?
_________________
Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
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alman72
Samba Member
Joined: October 09, 2014
Posts: 2573
Location: MICHIGAN
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 12:30 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| The NOS price even includes shipping! |
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Malokin Martin
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2007
Posts: 3099
Location: E-burg
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 1:14 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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Yeah I had no idea they were that much! It's a bummer because the one I have is still fairly nice, It's just rattling inside and driving me nuts. I've been putting up with it for far too long. Made sure that absolutely everything is tight. Argh.
Guess i'm going to open the wallet on the one mentioned above.
Thanks all! really appreciate it. |
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Amskeptic
Samba Member
Joined: October 18, 2002
Posts: 8568
Location: All Across The Country
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:46 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| Malokin Martin wrote: |
Yeah I had no idea they were that much! It's a bummer because the one I have is still fairly nice, It's just rattling inside and driving me nuts. I've been putting up with it for far too long. Made sure that absolutely everything is tight. Argh.
Guess i'm going to open the wallet on the one mentioned above.
Thanks all! really appreciate it. |
Know what I did to stop a rattle inside a good muffler?
I looked for the spot welds that go radially around the can, they tell you where the support "baffles" are. I drilled a 1/4" self tapping screw halfway into the can where the support baffle was, and this tweaked the damn thing quiet for a good 50,000 miles. Use a dab of Ultra-Copper RTV to keep the entry wound leak-free. You have to use more than one screw to get rid of the rattle.
Colin
(p.s may be more difficult to find the supports inside the '72-'74 mufflers, but endeavor)
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50332
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 8:12 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| busdaddy wrote: |
No, later ones have a wildly different flange shape.
Most go for something like this http://www.busdepot.com/071251053ek , aside from a different style tailpipe and the right exit it fits well and lasts.
That complete NOS one doesn't look too bad now eh? |
VW used this style muffler at least as a replacement if not as original equipment. I bought multiple ones through the classifieds several years ago with all the VW factory numbers stamped on then and in their original packages for only $100 each. |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21507
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 9:05 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| Wildthings wrote: |
| busdaddy wrote: |
No, later ones have a wildly different flange shape.
Most go for something like this http://www.busdepot.com/071251053ek , aside from a different style tailpipe and the right exit it fits well and lasts.
That complete NOS one doesn't look too bad now eh? |
VW used this style muffler at least as a replacement if not as original equipment. I bought multiple ones through the classifieds several years ago with all the VW factory numbers stamped on then and in their original packages for only $100 each. |
It was original equipment. Its called a damper style muffler. Both are listed in the parts book for 411 and 412 early and late. Its a much more quiet muffler. Noise issues and regulations i urban areas in Europe are just one of the numerous reasons air cooled engines were moved away from.
Its also restrictive as hell compared to the end exot muffler. Ray |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50332
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| Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 9:09 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| raygreenwood wrote: |
| Wildthings wrote: |
| busdaddy wrote: |
No, later ones have a wildly different flange shape.
Most go for something like this http://www.busdepot.com/071251053ek , aside from a different style tailpipe and the right exit it fits well and lasts.
That complete NOS one doesn't look too bad now eh? |
VW used this style muffler at least as a replacement if not as original equipment. I bought multiple ones through the classifieds several years ago with all the VW factory numbers stamped on then and in their original packages for only $100 each. |
It was original equipment. Its called a damper style muffler. Both are listed in the parts book for 411 and 412 early and late. Its a much more quiet muffler. Noise issues and regulations i urban areas in Europe are just one of the numerous reasons air cooled engines were moved away from.
Its also restrictive as hell compared to the end exot muffler. Ray |
Ray, I was referring to the end outlet style muffler Bus Daddy linked to. |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21507
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:01 am Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| Wildthings wrote: |
| raygreenwood wrote: |
| Wildthings wrote: |
| busdaddy wrote: |
No, later ones have a wildly different flange shape.
Most go for something like this http://www.busdepot.com/071251053ek , aside from a different style tailpipe and the right exit it fits well and lasts.
That complete NOS one doesn't look too bad now eh? |
VW used this style muffler at least as a replacement if not as original equipment. I bought multiple ones through the classifieds several years ago with all the VW factory numbers stamped on then and in their original packages for only $100 each. |
It was original equipment. Its called a damper style muffler. Both are listed in the parts book for 411 and 412 early and late. Its a much more quiet muffler. Noise issues and regulations i urban areas in Europe are just one of the numerous reasons air cooled engines were moved away from.
Its also restrictive as hell compared to the end exot muffler. Ray |
Ray, I was referring to the end outlet style muffler Bus Daddy linked to. |
Ah....sorry.....missed that. Ray |
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thewalrus
Big Jack
Joined: March 27, 2006
Posts: 3014
Location: Belchertown, MA
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| Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 8:24 am Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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I'm having the same exact problem too. My tail pipe broke off and I'm in the market for a new muffler/tailpipe. This is a bone stock '73 setup also:
Just going to have to bite the bullet on a tailpipe/muffle from the classifieds I guess. My question is, the gasket between the muffler and the heaterboxes is readily available, but what about the gasket that goes between the tailpipe and the actual muffler?
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50332
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| Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 8:51 am Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| thewalrus wrote: |
| My question is, the gasket between the muffler and the heaterboxes is readily available, but what about the gasket that goes between the tailpipe and the actual muffler? |
If you buy a muffler with the outlet on the end, then yes the gasket is readily available as it the tail pipe itself.
http://www.busdepot.com/071251053ek |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21507
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:20 am Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| Wildthings wrote: |
| thewalrus wrote: |
| My question is, the gasket between the muffler and the heaterboxes is readily available, but what about the gasket that goes between the tailpipe and the actual muffler? |
If you buy a muffler with the outlet on the end, then yes the gasket is readily available as it the tail pipe itself.
http://www.busdepot.com/071251053ek |
But if you look at his picture...its not an end exit muffler he is asking about. Its a center exit "damper" style.
And...there are two (at least in 411/412) seal diameters.
35mm 021 251 231
43mm 021 251 231 B
I think the smaller diameter one was early 411
Ray |
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Malokin Martin
Samba Member
Joined: August 19, 2007
Posts: 3099
Location: E-burg
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| Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 11:53 am Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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Weird that such a common part that must be replaced relatively often isn't repopped somewhere like it was OG. I guess the market isn't there, but it seems like it would be.
Anyone with direct experience with the Busdepot one? Is it louder? |
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Wildthings
Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005
Posts: 50332
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| Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 1:55 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| Malokin Martin wrote: |
Weird that such a common part that must be replaced relatively often isn't repopped somewhere like it was OG. I guess the market isn't there, but it seems like it would be.
Anyone with direct experience with the Busdepot one? Is it louder? |
VW had moved over to the end outlet muffler sometime in the seventies, maybe even as early as the '74 models. I can't remember seeing anything but the end outlet muffler for sale in decades, excepting old stock. |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21507
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 2:36 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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| Wildthings wrote: |
| Malokin Martin wrote: |
Weird that such a common part that must be replaced relatively often isn't repopped somewhere like it was OG. I guess the market isn't there, but it seems like it would be.
Anyone with direct experience with the Busdepot one? Is it louder? |
VW had moved over to the end outlet muffler sometime in the seventies, maybe even as early as the '74 models. I can't remember seeing anything but the end outlet muffler for sale in decades, excepting old stock. |
Agreed. In fact....even though the parts part for 411/412 doesnt list the later end exit style....even some new vehicles in a 1972 and 1973.....411 and 412....came with the end exit muffler. I generally would classify my findings of the center exit muffler as about 1 or 2 out of 10 and I got my first 411 in 1978.
I have seen even fewer on busses.
By the way....I believe the damper part of the exhaust IS the tailpipe section. I believe its a resonator.
.
I have a brand new Dansk right hand center exit muffler I have had for about 15 years. I gave up looking for the tailpipe long ago. If anyone is interested. ....pm me and I will make you a good deal. Ray |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21507
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Mon Feb 08, 2016 4:49 pm Post subject: Re: 1972/1973/1974 Muffler: Close to stock option? |
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I posted these earlier and took them down because the quality was poor. These are a little better.
Ray |
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