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Vanagator Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2009 Posts: 230 Location: Cool lush mountains in Mexico
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 9:56 am Post subject: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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86' 2.1L Manual:
I've been trying to fix my sluggish acceleration in first gear from a start. So far I've replaced plugs, wires, dizzy, rotor and I've cleaned all ground connections.
I was going to replace my O2 sensor now since its about 8 years old.
However, I'm in Mexico and can only find a "Duralast" universal splice type for my van. I've read that they don't work well on the Gowesty site. However, the one in my van is a splice type! (From the PO).
1) Any opinions on this type of O2 sensor?
(I have 900 miles to get back to Texas and would like to get her running better for the trip)
2) Any other things I could check that may fix my sluggish acceleration?
Regards,
KT |
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newfisher Samba Member
Joined: January 05, 2012 Posts: 1764 Location: The wet spot--Oregon
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 11:03 am Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Making a living and helping customers in the Automotive industy, I used a universal once and will never recommend them. O.E. design only. If I was in Mexico and the only thing available was a universal, I would install it and then replace it with an OE grade one when I got back. |
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Vanagator Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2009 Posts: 230 Location: Cool lush mountains in Mexico
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 11:07 am Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Yeah thanks Newfish...this is the current plan....
KT |
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djkeev Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007 Posts: 32625 Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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insyncro Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002 Posts: 15086 Location: New York
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 3:28 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Spring for one with the pigtail attach.
You will be happy that you did. |
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Tom Powell Samba Member
Joined: December 01, 2005 Posts: 4855 Location: Kaneohe
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 5:37 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Vanagator wrote: |
... I've been trying to fix my sluggish acceleration in first gear from a start. ... Any other things I could check that may fix my sluggish acceleration? ... |
I also have sluggish acceleration from a start when below 2300 RPM and I suspect the AFM. I have another AFM to swap in, but not returning to the van until later this month. An O2 sensor or a TPS might cause those symptoms, but I've bypassed my TPS with a 10¢ VSM and my O2 sensor is new. My next troubleshooting step will be checking with a Shoebox ECU monitor and swapping in another AFM.
Aloha
tp |
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Wildthings Samba Member
Joined: March 13, 2005 Posts: 50350
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Posted: Thu Feb 11, 2016 7:53 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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In the states you can buy a Bosch O2 replacement sensor with a pigtail attached. Do a good job on the splice and you should have little chance of trouble. I would do some more trouble shooting before I condemned the O2 sensor though. |
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Vanagator Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2009 Posts: 230 Location: Cool lush mountains in Mexico
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 8:33 am Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Quote: |
I would do some more trouble shooting before I condemned the O2 sensor though. |
Well I do have a new Temp 2 sensor and was thinking of R&R that.
But my O2 sensor is 8 years and over 60,000 miles and its a slice type from PO.
Quote: |
I also have sluggish acceleration from a start when below 2300 RPM and I suspect the AFM. I have another AFM to swap in, but not returning to the van until later this month. An O2 sensor or a TPS might cause those symptoms, but I've bypassed my TPS with a 10¢ VSM and my O2 sensor is new. My next troubleshooting step will be checking with a Shoebox ECU monitor and swapping in another AFM. |
I suppose the AFM and TPS are units that would just need to replaced new, or is there a way to diagnose/fix those? |
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atomatom Samba Member
Joined: May 15, 2012 Posts: 1867 Location: in an 84 Westy or Bowen Island, BC
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 9:38 am Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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the O2 sensor shouldn't kick in until the van is warmed up. is it sluggish when cold? likewise, is it less sluggish when hot? if it changes it, could be a faulty temp ii sensor.
are you certain it is electrical? maybe you have a clogged fuel line/filter/etc.
if i was 900 miles from home i would limp home. perhaps unplug the O2 sensor and see if that helps. _________________ 84 Vanagon Westy, 1.9L, California raised but defected to Canada. |
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Vanagator Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2009 Posts: 230 Location: Cool lush mountains in Mexico
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 10:48 am Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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atomatom, It seems less sluggish when cold. I have brand new fuel filter and all fuel lines replaced 4-5 years ago. I will try unplugging the O2 sensor when I get up to temp on next drive to see if I notice any difference. Thanks for the input.... |
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Tom Powell Samba Member
Joined: December 01, 2005 Posts: 4855 Location: Kaneohe
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 12:36 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Vanagator wrote: |
... I suppose the AFM and TPS are units that would just need to replaced new, or is there a way to diagnose/fix those? |
The VanCafe ECU monitor will give you readings for the AFM and a light for the TPS.
check page 20 of the manual
http://www.van-cafe.com/shop/images/ecumanual.pdf
The complete kit with a wired ECU:
http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_1628_567/8691_shop_ecu_monitor_system.html
I bought the kit for another Vanagon and the ECU itself solved its problem. The kit has been a useful tool for diagnosing problems with subsequent Vanagons that I've owned. I'll be using it to trouble shoot my slow acceleration with my Vanagon on the mainland when I head up there.
It would be nice if you could rent the monitor kit but I think that a service like that would end up with problems for the vendor. Perhaps someone in your area has an ECU monitor and wired ECU that you could use for your troubleshooting.
Aloha
tp |
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Vanagator Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2009 Posts: 230 Location: Cool lush mountains in Mexico
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Posted: Fri Feb 12, 2016 2:45 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Quote: |
The VanCafe ECU monitor will give you readings for the AFM and a light for the TPS. |
Yeah Tom, that's a nifty little device for sure & could save you some money in the long run. I'll consider that when I get back to the US. Here in Mexico, that's a unit hard to find.
I think I have decided to change out my old 02 sensor for now and see if that helps (its time for a change-out anyhow). I can then change my temp 2 also if I get no better results from the new 02.
But first I'll be doing a test drive today and see how the Vanagator reacts with the 02 unplugged.
Thanks for the tip on that Monitor....
KT |
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Vanagator Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2009 Posts: 230 Location: Cool lush mountains in Mexico
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Posted: Wed Feb 17, 2016 3:04 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Well I've come to find out that the Vanagators' 1st gear hesitation goes away after she's warmed up and with green wire of the O2 sensor unplugged. It runs better with it unplugged.
This would lead me to believe that my sensor is in fact bad. I will also wait until I can get a O2 snsr of better quality, with full harness, as I think after investigation that the splice type is inferior. |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17153 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Wed Feb 17, 2016 3:22 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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That the van runs better with the O2 sensor disconnected, may or may not be an indication of a bad sensor. The sensor is reading the mixture from all 4 cylinders combined. If one cylinder is running rich or lean, that will tilt the mixture average one way or the other. The ECU is not smart enough to know which cylinder is not running properly. So if it senses a lean condition, it will richen all 4 cylinders. If it senses a rich condition, it will lean all 4 cylinders.
In a perfect world, a proper tuned, running engine, should not need an 02 sensor. They are there for only when the mixture strays one way or the other from spec. If the van runs better, I would run it without the 02 sensor for now and see how it does. Pull the sparkplugs in a 1000 miles and compare them to each other. This is called "open loop" and should have no ill affect on the engine or the electronics. _________________ ☮️ |
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atomatom Samba Member
Joined: May 15, 2012 Posts: 1867 Location: in an 84 Westy or Bowen Island, BC
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Posted: Wed Feb 17, 2016 7:08 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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the green wire from the ECU is shielded, like a cable TV wire. it is important that this shielding does not ground the inner wire that carries the (very weak) current. probably redundant, but just in case because it is an easy fix _________________ 84 Vanagon Westy, 1.9L, California raised but defected to Canada. |
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Vanagator Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2009 Posts: 230 Location: Cool lush mountains in Mexico
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Posted: Thu May 05, 2016 10:15 am Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Well I finally got back to the ol' USA and replaced the 02 sensor with a new Bosch sensor with harness (non-splice type), guess what? No change, I still have the hesitation. While cold, if I slightly tap the gas pedal it almost wants to stall, but that goes away after it warms up.
SO, I've unplugged my new sensor and it runs normally.
What are the dangers, if any, running my van with it unplugged, If it runs fine unplugged why not leave it off? |
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newfisher Samba Member
Joined: January 05, 2012 Posts: 1764 Location: The wet spot--Oregon
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Posted: Thu May 05, 2016 11:20 am Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Do have a cat? You wont for long if the O2 isn't monitoring correctly on most vehicles. |
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MarkWard Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005 Posts: 17153 Location: Retired South Florida
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Posted: Thu May 05, 2016 12:13 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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Glad you made it home. The oxygen sensor is trying to compensate for something it senses out of spec in the exhaust stream. So, the engine is either running too rich or too lean. You should probably figure out what it is trying to compensate for. A lean cylinder could run hot and melt something like a piston or lead to detonations in that particular sensor.
I would start with a compression check and at the same time compare the sparkplugs to each other while you have them out. See if they all look the same. One that differs from the others might indicate which cylinder might be the culprit.
As a rule, a cold engine needs more fuel than a hot engine. That is the job of the temp sensor. Not saying that is the problem, only that if the engine is hesitating, it might be because it wants more fuel and the oxygen sensor is saying you've had enough. _________________ ☮️ |
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Vanagator Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2009 Posts: 230 Location: Cool lush mountains in Mexico
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Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 12:42 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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I see what you are saying. I'll check out the plugs.
Thanks for the input. |
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Spezialist Banned
Joined: July 01, 2005 Posts: 1941
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Posted: Sat May 14, 2016 1:59 pm Post subject: Re: Universal splice type O2 Sensor? |
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djkeev wrote: |
Universals have proven themselves trouble prone to many users.......
Dave |
I've replaced many o2 sensors with generic sensors, hundreds of them.
On many car brands, never had one single comback.
Gotta follow the instructions. The wire length and connectors have be used that were supplied with unit. _________________
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