Power windows - Why are they always switched on?

[VicVan]

Hi everyone,

91 Vanagon. I noticed the power window switches are always lit, even without the key in the ignition. I'm concerned about the battery drainage...
Is this normal ? Shouldn't the power windows work only with key in ignition or engine running ?
Or is there a way to get rid of those lights (after all, being able to use the windows without key in ignition can be convenient) ?

Thanks for your advice

JB
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'90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH)

[goffoz]

sorry
that shouldn't be
someone switched the power wire at the fuse block...easy fix
use the search, this is a well discussed situation

[syncrodoka]

Yes, you are correct that the illumination shouldn't be on full time. Someone probably installed the trigger wire for the relay(attached to the top of the fuse box) in the wrong place on the back of the fuse box. You will need to look for previous owner "improvements" or changes to the correct wiring of the circuit.
Good luck.

[djkeev]

Simple answer?

Having the power windows only able to operate with the key on is kind of a PITA in certain situations.

Camping for instance ........

While a key being required is the norm, I totally get why someone would make the change.

That being said, it is simply a matter of tracing the power wire and returning it to it's proper location.

Maybe later I'll pull my Bentley and see what color wires feed the window switch if that will help you figure this out.
Buying a Bentley that covers your model year will be a really good idea for future repairs and trouble shooting.
Carry it with you in the Van so that when trouble strikes on the road..... The book can help you or whoever is fixing your Van.

Dave
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Ghia
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https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert

[Tom Powell]

[syncrodoka]

The light stalk short cut to use the power windows has produced problems for several and is no longer advised according to previous threads.

[Tom Powell]

[syncrodoka]

[VicVan]

Hi folks

I found the diagram in the Bentley (97.190), I guess someone plugged the the relay on the permanent + (track 30). I'll take a look later today, I'll let you know.

Two questions :

1/ Can I get rid of the lights inside the switches ? I opened a switch once, was never able to put it back together properly.

2/ so I get it right, the track X refers to equipments that are on when ignition is on or engine running, but turned off when starter is cranking (load reduction) ?
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'90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH)

[syncrodoka]

[kamzcab86]

[VicVan]

Which means I need to solve this.

I checked the wiring on relay 24, seems consistent with what the Bentley diagram indicates (relay triggered by black/yellow wire).

I noticed that when I reconnect the battery, relay 8 (that is load reduction relay) clicks. Is that normal ? From what I understand from the Bentley, it isn't. (97.211, track 89).

I measured the following current draws :
Load Reduction Relay (n.8 ) unplugged : 0 mA
Load Reduction Relay plugged, Power window relay unplugged : 17 mA
Both relays plugged in : 37 mA

Why would my Load Reduction Relay be always switched on ? any ideas ? The ignition switch is in good shape from what I can see...
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'90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH)

[0to60in6min]

I'd think that the PO rewired the power window circuit so it can be operated with the ignition OFF...

I'd think the P terminal was used instead of the G (G1/G3)

the G terminal is hot only when the ignition is ON

the P terminal is hot all the time

look at the back of the fuse board to see if there's any modif there...

[bluebus86]

seems handy to have the windows operable with no key in the switch, but power drain is an issue, I'd remove the light bulbs and thus solve the drain issue while retaining the ability to operate the windows with no key.
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[VicVan]

[kamzcab86]

[VicVan]

Found the culprit ! It's.... the... ignition switch.

By testing voltage on X relay socket 86 as suggested by kamzcab, i noticed the voltage flickering when I touched the key.
I then tested the ignition switch, and indeed, when key is in OFF position, I still have current on the X terminal.
I tested that switch two months ago, worked fine, that's why I dismissed it originally. Lesson learned.

I'll do like many people on this forum and buy two, and keep the spare in the Van. Any brand you recommend ? Or recommend not buying ?
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'90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH)

[kamzcab86]

[VicVan]

Thanks everybody for your help !
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'90 Little Blue Truck, 2WD auto, FAS GenV 2.0 NA (AVH)

[bluebus86]