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2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run
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smitty1976bus
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 3:59 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

Yes, I'll have to check all the grounds, and make sure they're really good. Even though the engine will start, she doesnt run very well.

I have it running the best I've had it so far, but there seems to be some vacuum leak somewhere. Then there is a loud screech that stalls the engine out. I'm not sure how to describe it, so I made a video of it happening:


Link


I don't know if this streeching squeek is a very large vacuum leak, or something much worse. Has anyone ever heard this before?

Smitty
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 8:05 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

sounds like it kicks back which stalls it. Then the cylinder pressure goes sky high and that makes a head leak. That would be my best guess. If you have a catalytic converter I would tell you to temporarily take it off just to see if it runs any better. Here is a post you might find interesting. You may have 2 problems - a reason it spits back and a loose head(s).

VDubTech wrote:
This is what the squeak from a leaking head gasket sounds like, and the noise to which Amskeptic was referring to. You can hear the obvious chirp and how it differs from a normally running T4 engine.


Link


Link


Link

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old DKP driver
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 02, 2016 8:53 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

Times 2 on the cylinder head gasket that should have been deleted years
ago.
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smitty1976bus
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 9:33 am    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

So you're thinking my head gasket is bad? Kind of sounds similar. Would a compression test answer this question?

-SMitty
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 10:28 am    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

smitty1976bus wrote:
So you're thinking my head gasket is bad? Kind of sounds similar. Would a compression test answer this question?

-SMitty


Maybe to both. Do you KNOW if you have the copper gaskets between the head and cylinders? (This is not a typical "head gasket" like water-cooled cars have.) A compression test might show one cylinder being lower than others, pointing towards the problem. But if they're all low, it will be more ambiguity.

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smitty1976bus
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:35 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

Quote:
Do you KNOW if you have the copper gaskets between the head and cylinders?


Unfortunately, I have no idea i have no idea what material it is. I havent been able to contact the dude who put them on; i left him a message, hopeflly he'll remember.

I went out and bought a compression tester, and tested all the cylinders. They all came up between 120-125psi. Which is releif. But I still don't know what to do next. Is it possible to have a bad head gasket with good compression?

-Smitty
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 03, 2016 4:46 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

If it is a head leak, the squeak is the air being forced out when the cylinder pressure is too high. Kinda like pressurizing your mouth with your lips closed until the squeak. The issue needs to be fixed but it may be a side effect of another issue.

Did you check the timing with a timing light?

Did you do a thorough test for vacuum leaks?

Did you ever do a tune-up on it, plugs, points, wires?

Reasonably new fuel?
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smitty1976bus
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 11:45 am    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

Thats a spot on analogy.

Quote:
Did you ever do a tune-up on it, plugs, points, wires?


Yes, the plugs, wires and points are all new. All gapped properly.

Quote:
Did you check the timing with a timing light?


I've tried. I'm having a little issue identifying the timing mark on my crank pulley. There's only on mark (groove) on it, and I cannot find a similar one; most have 2 or 3 grooves. So I'm assuming that this groove is TDC, and timed it accordingly.

Quote:
Did you do a thorough test for vacuum leaks?


I don't have the original vacuum hoses, so I put some together myself, then wrapped them in some type of rubbery wrap; it did the trick. Only, there has to be a leak somewhere else. When the engine starts, it revs really high, then tries to die. The squeek doesnt happen all the time either, it only happens randomly. I'm trying to figure out whats causing it, but no luck.

Right now, I'm pulling off the intake tubes, and putting new gaskets on the side connecting to the heads, hoping there was a vacuum leak there. Other than that, not sure where else there could be a leak.

-Smitty
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 12:53 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

A Type 4 bus pulley should have and needs only a single timing mark. It is a tiny "V" on the forward rim of the pulley, that you may have to feel for with a finger nail. Once found use paint to make the mark more visible. Sometimes the mark is not correct though as 411/412/Porsche engines have a mark located elsewhere and when people use these pulleys on their buses they often err in locating a replacement mark on the pulley. Ratwell.com gives the proper way to locate a replacement mark on the pulley.

You can time your engine very accurately by turning the ignition on, setting the distributor end of the coil wire 1/4" from a good ground and then turning the engine CW very slowly past the 7.5* BTDC mark. You ignition should spark right at the mark, not before or after. Repeat by turning the engine CCW about 20* and then CW again past the 7.5* mark until you get the timing right at the mark.

Do not leave the ignition on for an excessive time when timing your engine this way. Only a few minutes at a time.
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 1:32 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

Several posts ago, you said you were "skeptical" of your fuel pump. Did you throw a gauge on the rail to test it and the pressure regulator?
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vic74westy
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 1:44 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

That squeak reminds me of a lean backfire I had on my weber carbs when they were jetted too lean. Vacuum leaks would cause you to run lean. What about spraying some carb cleaner into the intake to richen things up and see if they smooth out?
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smitty1976bus
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 8:15 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

I spent the day wrapping all my vacuum tubes, and replacing intake gaskets, on the drivers side of the engine. I ended up buying paper gaskets from a local auto parts store:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

The old gaskets didnt look too bad, and they were new when I put the engine back together. But the paper ones look good, and fit nicely, dispite me just cutting them to fit:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I then put all the fresh vacuum lines back on:


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Nothings getting through that.

This is the last thing I try before pulling the heads off.

I cranked over the engine, and to my surprise, it started right up, and the weird squeeking sound was gone! It even was able to idle! albeit, a high idle. I think there is a vacuum leak somewhere though. It does rev high when ever I hit the accelerator. Here's a video:

Link


I still havent timed it properly though, i'll have to once i figure out what crank pulley i have.

Quote:
Ratwell.com gives the proper way to locate a replacement mark on the pulley.


Great webpage, I'm going to have to dive into that tomorrow, ty.

Welp, after a few days of bad news, this good news is nice. Hopefully it means I wont have to replace my head gaskets....

Smitty
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 04, 2016 9:54 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


It doesn't look like your #4 wire is actually attached to the spark plug, but just stuffed down next to it.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2016 3:56 am    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

Great job!

Get it timed, and I think you'll find the idle will come down. Don't stress over what pulley is there. There are no aftermarket stock type ones for the T4 motor. Variations from other cars exist, like wildthings said above, but likely you have a proper bus one on there.

Even better if you can get it tuned via tail pipe sniffer, LM1 or other wide and o2 sensor. But that's a few steps down the road for you.

Now start adding back in your other Vac hoses and go for a drive.
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2016 4:43 am    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

Hard to tell from your pic, but both ends of the fuel line clamped at the injectors?

Get some real hose clamps when you put your vacuum hoses back, IMO those auto zone clamps are terrible..

http://www.belmetric.com
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2016 11:08 am    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

this is what the timing mark will look like. It will be on the engine side of the pulley.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


The arrow on this one. Ignore the O ?

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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smitty1976bus
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 05, 2016 7:35 pm    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

Quote:
this is what the timing mark will look like.


Cool, found my little mark, and made a line with a Sharpie on the outer lip of the pulley. Also, inked up my scale thing, so I know where 7.5 BTC is right away.


Quote:
Get some real hose clamps when you put your vacuum hoses back, IMO those auto zone clamps are terrible..

http://www.belmetric.com


Oh man, that site amazing! Its near impossible to find any of the clamps in stores around my area, so I'll have to order away for some.

Quote:
It doesn't look like your #4 wire is actually attached to the spark plug, but just stuffed down next to it.


It's on there, just the little rubber boot thing was caught over the fuel rail. I snug it up to the tin now

Quote:
Get it timed, and I think you'll find the idle will come down.


I tried to time it, but there's definitely another vacuum leak somewhere. I tried to do the smoke method to try and find the leak, and it kind of worked. I bought a cheapo cigar, and was blowing all the smoke into the intake plenum; hoping to see some come out. I did end up seeing some smoke coming from the passenger side of the engine, but really could see where it was coming out of. But, i figured, if one side of the intake tubes had bad gaskets, the other side probably does too. I fired up the engine, and shot some carb cleaner down by where the intake meets the heads, and right away the engine bogged down. There's my problem!

I pulled the intake tubes off, and cut out some new paper gaskets, and re-assembled it all again. Fired it up, and she runs sooooo nice now (knock on wood)!


Link


I went out and bought a small tachometer, so I could really dial in the timing, but I'll have to do that tomorrow after works because by the time I was ready to do it all, it was time for Game of Thrones on HBO. So tomorrow, hopefully this thing will be running perfect, and I can then move onto the suspension.

Thanks all!
Smitty
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 8:57 am    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

If it wasn't already mentioned....make sure to get the foam engine-to-tin seal installed for proper cooling.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 9:05 am    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

nice steady idle. Get a fan screen for it so it doesn't suck a rag etc into the fan and destroy it. Also check the exhaust for leaks.
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 06, 2016 9:13 am    Post subject: Re: 2.0L EFI Engine Install --- Won't Run Reply with quote

smitty1976bus wrote:
Quote:
this is what the timing mark will look like.


Cool, found my little mark, and made a line with a Sharpie on the outer lip of the pulley. Also, inked up my scale thing, so I know where 7.5 BTC is right away.


7.5 is a good start, but not your target anymore. Its running and sounds good, once you are warmed up time 3500RPM to 28-30* BTDC with the hoses off the Distributor. then let the Idle fall where it does.

7.5 is good to get it running and it will let you know potentially if your Dizzy needs lubed or changed but best operation will come with the above time set.
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