Hello! Log in or Register   |  Help  |  Donate  |  Buy Shirts See all banner ads | Advertise on TheSamba.com  
TheSamba.com
 
Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's
Page: 1, 2, 3  Next
Forum Index -> Performance/Engines/Transmissions Share: Facebook Twitter
Reply to topic
Print View
Quick sort: Show newest posts on top | Show oldest posts on top View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
cwat1982
Samba Member


Joined: June 24, 2014
Posts: 143
Location: Alberta, Canada
cwat1982 is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 12:32 am    Post subject: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Hello all,

So engine typically takes a few tries to get started, when running there is a slight bog when beginning to accelerate from cruising in 3rd/4th gear. Besides that engine seems fine. When I pulled the plugs, easy to see it has been running rich.

Engine was built in Spokane at ~2000ft elevation. When built it was a 2100cc with 1 1/2" exhaust.

I pulled the jets and found installed were F11 emulsions, 115 mains, 200 airs, and 60 idles. Minus cylinder 4 which had a 50 idle for some reason. This setup seems WAY off from stock, and from what I see forum pro's (Dale M., MURZI, john@ aircooled.net, etc.) recommending in other threads.

Exhaust has been upgraded to 1 5/8", and elevation in my parts is ~1200ft.

Feeling like Shocked, want to be feeling like Cool. Help would be greatly appreciated in getting this running right.

Cheers,
CWAT
_________________
1970 Joe Poty Sand Rover T Bug Pickup, 2095cc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
madmike
Samba Member


Joined: July 11, 2005
Posts: 5291
Location: Atlanta,Michigan
madmike is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 4:57 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

try 55 idles
130 mains
leave the rest alone

what vents? should be 32's
_________________
'Black Ice'Drag Buggy 'Turbo'
Rail Buggy 1915 turbo
76 Drag/Street bug 2180cc 'Turbo' 11:85 @113 mph"If I go any faster I'll burn up the Hamster" ,gets 28 mpg. also 10/09/22 11.90 @115 mph
"If I'm ever on Life Support,UNPLUG Me, Then Plug me back In see if that Works"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
MURZI
Samba Member


Joined: August 25, 2005
Posts: 5063
Location: Madisonville, La
MURZI is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 6:04 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

I would start by adjusting floats to 10.75mm. Jet to 52/140/200. Mixture screws out 1.5 turns from seat. I would also grab each throttle shaft at the carb end to check for up and down play. Somebody has been in there......and definitely sounds like they didn't know what they were doing.

Jet it like this and let us know how it runs at these speeds.....steady pedal. 2000, 2500, 4000 and wide open. Should be a good start.
_________________
62 vert
2276
Tim’s welded heads
45 Dells
A1 sidewinder
Fk44 cam
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Dale M.
Samba Member


Joined: April 12, 2006
Posts: 20365
Location: Just a tiny bit west of Yosemite Valley
Dale M. is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 7:56 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Probably should have stayed with 1 1/2 inch exhaust .... You can get it to big and it reduces scavenging and it can hurt performance...

Dale
_________________
“Fear The Government That Wants To Take Your Guns" - Thomas Jefferson.

"Kellison Sand Piper Roadster" For Street & Show.
"Joe Pody Sandrover" Buggy with 2180 for Autocross (Sold)
============================================================
All suggestions and advice are purely my own opinion. You are free to ignore them if you wish ...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
[email protected]
Samba Member


Joined: August 03, 2002
Posts: 12785
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
john@aircooled.net is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 8:11 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

since Bubba has been in there, MEASURE ALL THE JETS
_________________
It's just advice, do whatever you want with it!

Please do NOT send me Private Messages through the Samba PM System (I will not see them). Send me an e-mail to john at aircooled dot net

"Like" our Facebook page at
http://www.facebook.com/vwpartsaircoolednet
and get a 5% off code for use on one order for VW Parts ON OUR PARTS STORE WEBSITE, vwparts.aircooled.net
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Facebook Gallery Classifieds Feedback
cwat1982
Samba Member


Joined: June 24, 2014
Posts: 143
Location: Alberta, Canada
cwat1982 is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2016 9:28 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Hahaha... impressed 3 of the members I mentioned all replied, very much appreciated!!

john@ air-cooled.net, this engine was brand new when I picked it up the buggy a couple summers ago. The OE put on 300 miles to break it in for me. Came from what I understand to be a reputable engine shop out of Spokane... Hooks Air Cooled VW Repair. Going to order all new Weber jets and start fresh.

Dale M., I purchased the new exhaust based on recommendations from the engine builder, he said the exhaust the OE had on the engine was too small. He said to pick up the 1 5/8" Tri-Mil sidewinder, which I did, and later installed a Flowmaster HP-2 Shorty 2" x 2" to keep my kids shorts dry when riding in it.

MURZI, I will adjust the floats and order new jets as you described. From other threads it looks like Weber jets are the way to go so I will do that. The throttle shafts feel solid, no up/down or side to side play.

madmike, laughing at myself... first took me 5 minutes of searching to figure out vents = venturi's (you now know my experience level). Have the carbs apart and couldn't figure out how to remove them, or a guide on how to remove them to measure... wound up finding a socket that was a perfect snug fit, when I measured that it showed 30mm.

Before I order everything... I was shopping and came across these kits (http://www.racetep.com/webjetkit.html). Based on the jet size I should be installing and engine size, this is showing I should have a 34-36mm venturi's. madmike's suggestion was 32mm, stock is 36mm, and I currently have 30mm... What should I order for venturi's???

Once again, appreciate the feedback.

Cheers,
CWAT
_________________
1970 Joe Poty Sand Rover T Bug Pickup, 2095cc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
madmike
Samba Member


Joined: July 11, 2005
Posts: 5291
Location: Atlanta,Michigan
madmike is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 3:47 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

30's should work Wink
_________________
'Black Ice'Drag Buggy 'Turbo'
Rail Buggy 1915 turbo
76 Drag/Street bug 2180cc 'Turbo' 11:85 @113 mph"If I go any faster I'll burn up the Hamster" ,gets 28 mpg. also 10/09/22 11.90 @115 mph
"If I'm ever on Life Support,UNPLUG Me, Then Plug me back In see if that Works"
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Gallery Classifieds Feedback
MURZI
Samba Member


Joined: August 25, 2005
Posts: 5063
Location: Madisonville, La
MURZI is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 4:06 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Put 36's back in.
_________________
62 vert
2276
Tim’s welded heads
45 Dells
A1 sidewinder
Fk44 cam
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
[email protected]
Samba Member


Joined: August 03, 2002
Posts: 12785
Location: Salt Lake City, Utah
john@aircooled.net is offline 

PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2016 9:05 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

This is the shop that put in (3) 60s and (1) 50, right?

I'm just saying measure them, even if they are new, JIC.

cwat1982 wrote:
john@ air-cooled.net, this engine was brand new when I picked it up the buggy a couple summers ago. The OE put on 300 miles to break it in for me. Came from what I understand to be a reputable engine shop out of Spokane... Hooks Air Cooled VW Repair. Going to order all new Weber jets and start fresh.

_________________
It's just advice, do whatever you want with it!

Please do NOT send me Private Messages through the Samba PM System (I will not see them). Send me an e-mail to john at aircooled dot net

"Like" our Facebook page at
http://www.facebook.com/vwpartsaircoolednet
and get a 5% off code for use on one order for VW Parts ON OUR PARTS STORE WEBSITE, vwparts.aircooled.net
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail Visit poster's website Facebook Gallery Classifieds Feedback
cwat1982
Samba Member


Joined: June 24, 2014
Posts: 143
Location: Alberta, Canada
cwat1982 is offline 

PostPosted: Wed Apr 20, 2016 8:04 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Ok... floats are set 10.75mm and 32mm droop. Looks a little off due to the angle in the picture but I promise thats what it is.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Both are HPMX 44's, but different versions. One has a choke circuit (I believe thats what its called), and the other doesn't.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


After removing the float plate it looks like there are brass components in the older model where the choke circuit is, and the newer model doesn't have any. Am I missing any pieces, or is this just a difference between the models? Does it matter that they are different models?

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Ordered 34mm venturi's, 135 mains, and 55 idles from john @aircooled.net... now the waiting game...

Cheers,
CWAT
_________________
1970 Joe Poty Sand Rover T Bug Pickup, 2095cc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
MURZI
Samba Member


Joined: August 25, 2005
Posts: 5063
Location: Madisonville, La
MURZI is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 6:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

I would abort this mission and move on. I promise you those carbs are someone else's nightmare. Order some new HPMX's and chalk th cost up to engineering costs.

Talking from experience here.....
_________________
62 vert
2276
Tim’s welded heads
45 Dells
A1 sidewinder
Fk44 cam
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
cwat1982
Samba Member


Joined: June 24, 2014
Posts: 143
Location: Alberta, Canada
cwat1982 is offline 

PostPosted: Thu Apr 21, 2016 9:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Hahaha, I would... but already bought the jets and venturi's. Plus this has been great learning for me. A couple years ago if you asked me to point to the carbs I might have pointed to the headlights.

I wouldn't think different version of HPMX 44's would matter, same size... ran fine before, just rich... hopefully the vents/jets will solve that.

The learning continues...
_________________
1970 Joe Poty Sand Rover T Bug Pickup, 2095cc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Dale M.
Samba Member


Joined: April 12, 2006
Posts: 20365
Location: Just a tiny bit west of Yosemite Valley
Dale M. is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 6:45 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Leave all the "choke" parts in place on old model HPMX.... But I believe other comments (MURZI'S) is correct about these two carbs were someone else's problem and got passes on to you....

Dale
_________________
“Fear The Government That Wants To Take Your Guns" - Thomas Jefferson.

"Kellison Sand Piper Roadster" For Street & Show.
"Joe Pody Sandrover" Buggy with 2180 for Autocross (Sold)
============================================================
All suggestions and advice are purely my own opinion. You are free to ignore them if you wish ...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
cwat1982
Samba Member


Joined: June 24, 2014
Posts: 143
Location: Alberta, Canada
cwat1982 is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 3:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

After MURZI's comment I did some more digging on TheSamba to see if there was anything else I should be looking into on these things and came across this thread "HPMX trouble, need carb guru".

john @aircooled.net said both of the plungers should be down in the choke circuit so I looked at mine and found this.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Solution was that experienced VW guys tap the top of the plunger hole, then run a set screw down to hold that piston down. Or to fill the enrichment hole at the base of the carb with some JB weld or tap and plug it.

JB weld idea seems the easiest...

Should I go ahead and do this?

Cheers,
CWAT
_________________
1970 Joe Poty Sand Rover T Bug Pickup, 2095cc


Last edited by cwat1982 on Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:51 pm; edited 2 times in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Dale M.
Samba Member


Joined: April 12, 2006
Posts: 20365
Location: Just a tiny bit west of Yosemite Valley
Dale M. is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 7:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Tap and use screw in plugs at bottom flange... Would not JB Weld with long time soaking of fuel I tend to not trust epoxies...


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Dale
_________________
“Fear The Government That Wants To Take Your Guns" - Thomas Jefferson.

"Kellison Sand Piper Roadster" For Street & Show.
"Joe Pody Sandrover" Buggy with 2180 for Autocross (Sold)
============================================================
All suggestions and advice are purely my own opinion. You are free to ignore them if you wish ...
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
cwat1982
Samba Member


Joined: June 24, 2014
Posts: 143
Location: Alberta, Canada
cwat1982 is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Sounds good, thanks Dale.
_________________
1970 Joe Poty Sand Rover T Bug Pickup, 2095cc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
mark tucker
Samba Member


Joined: April 08, 2009
Posts: 23937
Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
mark tucker is offline 

PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

when taping ,just be sure to not distort the bore or the flutterbys may not close/seal well at idle.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
cwat1982
Samba Member


Joined: June 24, 2014
Posts: 143
Location: Alberta, Canada
cwat1982 is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 6:38 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

I tried searching for flutterby on here to see what it is, but the only hits were from you mark. Are you talking about the throttle plates binding if I warp the enrichment hole while tapping?

Cheers,
CWAT
_________________
1970 Joe Poty Sand Rover T Bug Pickup, 2095cc
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
67rustavenger Premium Member
Samba Member


Joined: February 24, 2015
Posts: 9665
Location: Oregon
67rustavenger is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 7:15 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

cwat1982 wrote:
I tried searching for flutterby on here to see what it is, but the only hits were from you mark. Are you talking about the throttle plates binding if I warp the enrichment hole while tapping?

Cheers,
CWAT

Yes. Mark has a funny way of explaining things. You just have to read them a few times to get what he means.
Good Luck.
_________________
I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!

There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
MConstable
Samba Member


Joined: May 04, 2004
Posts: 1822
Location: Saint Charles IL
MConstable is offline 

PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 7:37 am    Post subject: Re: Help Jetting Dual HPMX 44's Reply with quote

Flutterbys=butterflies
You've been "Mark"ed
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Gallery Classifieds Feedback
Display posts from previous:   
Reply to topic    Forum Index -> Performance/Engines/Transmissions All times are Mountain Standard Time/Pacific Daylight Savings Time
Page: 1, 2, 3  Next
Page 1 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

About | Help! | Advertise | Donate | Premium Membership | Privacy/Terms of Use | Contact Us | Site Map
Copyright © 1996-2023, Everett Barnes. All Rights Reserved.
Not affiliated with or sponsored by Volkswagen of America | Forum powered by phpBB
Links to eBay or other vendor sites may be affiliate links where the site receives compensation.