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Steve M. Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2013 Posts: 6798 Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl.
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Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2024 6:20 pm Post subject: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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I did a search on this because I saw it a few years ago regarding the play in the mounting for the rack & pinion. Somebody was adding braces to it to to give it more support.
I can't find it.
Does anyone else remember it? _________________ This free advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.
There are seven days in a week. Someday is not one of them. |
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skemems Samba Member
Joined: February 23, 2017 Posts: 200 Location: Portland
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Steve M. Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2013 Posts: 6798 Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl.
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Posted: Tue Jan 09, 2024 7:51 pm Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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Thanks. That's what I remember. _________________ This free advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.
There are seven days in a week. Someday is not one of them. |
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mtnhome Samba Member
Joined: July 17, 2010 Posts: 488 Location: Summit County, CO
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Steve M. Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2013 Posts: 6798 Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl.
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2024 3:41 am Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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Thank you for this. It should give the fellow who asked about them enough to br confused!🤣 _________________ This free advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.
There are seven days in a week. Someday is not one of them. |
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Zeitgeist 13 Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009 Posts: 12103 Location: Port Manteau
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2024 12:14 pm Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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Just be aware that I filed a patent application for these modifications, so big money will be rolling in soon.
Zeitgeist 13 wrote: |
Here's what I'd like to do to tighten up things down there. Hopefully you can see my highly skilled MS Paint engineered drawings. The red sections are just flat plates welded in there to brace the steering rack mounts. The yellow sections are diagonal braces with flat boxing to tie the LCA mounts together. Alternately you could just bridge the two mounts together and weld in a couple flat boxes for lateral support.
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_________________ Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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Mateo83 Samba Member
Joined: September 14, 2021 Posts: 591 Location: Lodi, CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2024 2:07 pm Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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I used the van guys, and they seem to do the job. With new bushings while you're down there. At the end of the day, we're all still driving a brick with no aerodynamics. _________________ 83 Air-cooled 2.0 Tin Top
Last edited by Mateo83 on Wed Jan 10, 2024 2:13 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Mateo83 Samba Member
Joined: September 14, 2021 Posts: 591 Location: Lodi, CA
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2024 2:09 pm Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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Zeitgeist 13 wrote: |
Just be aware that I filed a patent application for these modifications, so big money will be rolling in soon.
Zeitgeist 13 wrote: |
Here's what I'd like to do to tighten up things down there. Hopefully you can see my highly skilled MS Paint engineered drawings. The red sections are just flat plates welded in there to brace the steering rack mounts. The yellow sections are diagonal braces with flat boxing to tie the LCA mounts together. Alternately you could just bridge the two mounts together and weld in a couple flat boxes for lateral support.
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I bet the ten's of customers are knocking down your door already. _________________ 83 Air-cooled 2.0 Tin Top |
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Zeitgeist 13 Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009 Posts: 12103 Location: Port Manteau
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Posted: Wed Jan 10, 2024 6:16 pm Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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Gonna get me some of that sweet sweet #vanlife $$$ _________________ Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
'01 Weekender --> full camper
y u rune klassik? |
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Steve M. Samba Member
Joined: July 30, 2013 Posts: 6798 Location: Fort Lauderdale, Fl.
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Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2024 9:36 am Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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Those yellow gussets will help! _________________ This free advice is worth exactly what you paid for it.
There are seven days in a week. Someday is not one of them. |
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skills@eurocarsplus Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007 Posts: 16803 Location: sticksville, ct.
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Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2024 9:49 am Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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Mateo83 wrote: |
I used the van guys, and they seem to do the job. With new bushings while you're down there. At the end of the day, we're all still driving a brick with no aerodynamics. |
any noticeable difference?
I did a full....every bushing possible...springs/shocks etc suspension build on my westy and found it to drive just fine.
so did adding these make it a night and day difference or was it like -meh- in terms of an upgrade?
*manual steering fwiw on my van _________________
gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
Jake Raby wrote: |
Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
Brian wrote: |
Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Mateo83 Samba Member
Joined: September 14, 2021 Posts: 591 Location: Lodi, CA
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Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2024 10:08 am Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
Mateo83 wrote: |
I used the van guys, and they seem to do the job. With new bushings while you're down there. At the end of the day, we're all still driving a brick with no aerodynamics. |
any noticeable difference?
I did a full....every bushing possible...springs/shocks etc suspension build on my westy and found it to drive just fine.
so did adding these make it a night and day difference or was it like -meh- in terms of an upgrade?
*manual steering fwiw on my van |
I wouldn't say night and day difference but it is better. I added the 16" wheels so manual steering was that much more difficult. Like a 15mph wind will still blow in the other lane. But if you lay under the van, you can see how much that area flexes without them. Like most investments/upgrades the value it in the beholder. For me, it's peace of mind knowing it's been done and the best it could be. _________________ 83 Air-cooled 2.0 Tin Top |
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do.dah Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2015 Posts: 427 Location: Washington
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Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2024 11:19 am Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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I ain't right bright, but, when I saw the before and after videos that Christopher made ( https://t3technique.com/collections/front-suspensi...nt-kit-2wd ), I was purty sure that the vanagon engineering/design dept was exceptionally stoned the day they developed that steering rack mounting system.
My front end was tight when I put the braces on, so I don't really think I felt much, if any difference. I do feel that I addressed a deficient design. |
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thatbaldwinlife Samba Member
Joined: August 01, 2011 Posts: 759 Location: Out exploring
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Posted: Thu Jan 11, 2024 12:18 pm Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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I made my own steering rack stabilizers like the ones offered and bolted on a plate that spans the two braces like the red squares in Zeitgeist 13's pic though mine is in the middle and about 12" long.
Noticed no difference but do feel it ties everything together a bit more especially with bigger tires and rough roads.
nate _________________ 1987 Westy
Insta: @Thatbaldwinlife
Vanagon Adventure and DIY videos:
That Baldwin Life YouTube Channel |
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skills@eurocarsplus Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007 Posts: 16803 Location: sticksville, ct.
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Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2024 6:54 pm Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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Mateo83 wrote: |
I wouldn't say night and day difference but it is better. |
thanks. it's one of those mods I haven't done yet and I guess it's because my van is pretty dam good.
if someone were to say "my van is pretty dam good, but these are orgasmic" I'd buy a pair yesterday.
I have seen the vids, and agree it is a weak design. It's on the to-do list but pretty low. _________________
gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
Jake Raby wrote: |
Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
Brian wrote: |
Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Christopher Schimke Samba Member
Joined: August 03, 2005 Posts: 5375 Location: PNW
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Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 9:15 am Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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There's something interesting that I've noticed with the steering rack crossmember reinforcements, and that is, every van is different.
On some vans (my own included), they made a huge difference in terms of tightening up the steering feel, reducing the delayed steering response in relation to steering wheel input (crosswinds, stuff like that), etc. I try to be as non biased and resistant to any placebo-effect types things as I can. I try to just be objective about it and analyze things with an open mind. However, I've had many customers report the exact same thing as I experienced, so I don't think it a placebo effect that's going on here. I truly believe that it makes a big difference on some vans, but less of a difference on others. My best guess is that it may have to do with a combination of things, such as wheel alignment, wheel offset, tire size and load rating, how stiff the suspension is, and on and on. I also think that some people are more sensitive than others in terms of being in tune with what's going on with the feel and handling of their vehicle.
I guess my point is that this is one of those mods where the end result will be better than stock, but whether or not you actually experience a change in feel or handling will depend on your particular van and/or how in tune you are with how your van feels and handles. _________________ "Sometimes you have to build a box to think outside of." - Bruce (not Springsteen)
*Custom wheel hardware for Audi/VW, Porsche and Mercedes wheels - Urethane Suspension Bushings*
T3Technique.com or contact me at [email protected] |
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Wellington Samba Member
Joined: September 21, 2004 Posts: 1882 Location: Montreal
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Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 10:42 am Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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How's this for an idea:
Picture a length of steel 1/8" thick with a custom Z profile.
it spans the distance of the lower control arm mounts, and backs up behind the steering rack mounts.
I think that would stiffen the entire area, as well as become a lower control arm brace.
Ya may as will install new steering rack bushings and control arm bushings while it is apart. Longer control arm bolts likely required too, like the steering rack. |
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Bamboozled Samba Member
Joined: January 14, 2024 Posts: 1 Location: Cascadia
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Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2024 8:21 pm Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
Mateo83 wrote: |
I used the van guys, and they seem to do the job. With new bushings while you're down there. At the end of the day, we're all still driving a brick with no aerodynamics. |
any noticeable difference?
I did a full....every bushing possible...springs/shocks etc suspension build on my westy and found it to drive just fine.
so did adding these make it a night and day difference or was it like -meh- in terms of an upgrade?
*manual steering fwiw on my van |
Been an observer of this forum for years, learned many things and have enjoyed the vibe of the community here. Skill's post prompted me to relay my experience with Chris's kit, which were recently installed on my '82 AC Adventurewagen. I think his comments above are pretty much spot-on. Prior to adding them I performed the following:
Full front & rear suspension rebuilds (upper & lower ball joints, tie rod ends, bearings, etc.), with Chris's urethane bushings including steering rack. Radius rob bushings were the exception - went with new rubber out of cost & convenience. Stock springs, Koni's, heavier front sway bar & added rear bar (both Addco), CLK's with 215/60/16 rubber.
After putting these in I was pleasantly surprised with the marked improvement in turn-in response. |
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Mateo83 Samba Member
Joined: September 14, 2021 Posts: 591 Location: Lodi, CA
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Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2024 9:32 am Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
Mateo83 wrote: |
I wouldn't say night and day difference but it is better. |
thanks. it's one of those mods I haven't done yet and I guess it's because my van is pretty dam good.
if someone were to say "my van is pretty dam good, but these are orgasmic" I'd buy a pair yesterday.
I have seen the vids, and agree it is a weak design. It's on the to-do list but pretty low. |
Like chris said, it may (or may not) tighten up the "feel" i guess its feels pretty solid not like you're floating without control. There's a lot of variables there too if your springs or shocks are soft, shot, etc. But, like I said, I was on a mission to replace bushings, so I was down there anyway. _________________ 83 Air-cooled 2.0 Tin Top |
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Sodo Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2007 Posts: 9519 Location: Western WA
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Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2024 12:44 pm Post subject: Re: Steering rack & pinion support brackets? |
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Some improvements will be more dramatic than others.
Logically the biggest improvement will be noticed when loose steering rack bushings are replaced at the same time.
And even moreso when other wear items are renewed at the same time.
Every little bit helps. _________________
'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb |
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