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michaeltag
Samba Member
Joined: August 22, 2015
Posts: 70
Location: SF East Bay, Northern California
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 Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:37 pm Post subject: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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So, when many people do an conversion on a Vanagon that does not have factory A/C, and the new engine almost always has a modern A/C compressor, they will opt for one of the Vintage Air systems that is being installed by the likes of Small Car performance in Seattle or Stephan's Auto Haus in Sacramento. I'm getting ready to have Stephan's most likely do a 1.8 Turbo conversion on my '87 Syncro Westy that does not have factory A/C.
What makes me hesitate is the fact that the Vintage Air install closes off the fresh air inlet for the Vanagon's ventilation system. This really goes against my way of thinking. I love fresh air and I love having it with the windows up.
I know that A/C is an effective dehumidifier and that the Vanagon has wing windows.
I think I really need to hear from people who have lived and traveled with this system in a variety of weather, before I go and spend the five grand or so on it.
I have seen some alternatives, like installing a small Fridgidaire window style A/C unit under the bench seat or behind the passenger seat. Seems like a crazy alternative, But, I would go to great lengths to keep fresh air.
Please folks share youre experience here!
Thanks,
_________________
'87 Vanagon GL Westfalia Syncro w/ rear locker
• 1.8T engine conversion from Stephan's AutoHaus
• Schwenk Springs, OME shocks, BFG All Terrains on South African 15-inch steel wheels
• GoWesty Plate Steel Bumpers w/ front skid plate & rear swing-away spare carrier
• Big Shot Shifter
• Transaxle rebuilt with taller heavy-duty 4th gear, GoWesty decoupler and oiler plates by Ken at Porter's Precision
* TruckFridge
• Propex Heater
• Vintage Air in-dash A/C |
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MsTaboo
Samba Member
Joined: June 02, 2006
Posts: 4094
Location: East Kootenay, British Columbia
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:43 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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Replicate the stock Westy a/c system with the evaporator and fans in the rear of the van.
This will give you a/c and still maintain the stock air box/heater in front.
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Terry Kay
Banned
Joined: June 22, 2003
Posts: 13331
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:50 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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How many BTU's is this window unit?
How do you plan on powering it up?
On most all automotive ac units you have two dash selections;
Recirculate, or fresh air for the ac to operate on.
Exluding a Vanagon, which you still can manually allow fresh air into the cab.
But, this is counterintuitive as your allowing hot humid air back into the cab.
You would be running the snot outa that ac unit to keep the cab cool.
If you don't like the in dash offerings available, then don't have it installed.
Forget about it.
That would be my advice.
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T.K. |
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Zeitgeist 13
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2009
Posts: 12115
Location: Port Manteau
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:51 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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I like the early Vanagon "headache" units with the evap sitting right behind the passenger compartment.
No need to mess around with the rest of the climate control.
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 12:56 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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The VA system is slick.
I've done a few now and will be updating my personal with them.
The defrost and heat is amazing.
Whisper quiet.
Not quite sure whether they work to potential with Red Tek, just being honest as I have multiple install experience.
The layout and controls have been changed yet again.
I have yet to install the latest version, but looking forward to it as it just sounds easier and more refined. |
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goffoz
Samba Member
Joined: May 09, 2007
Posts: 1486
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| Posted: Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:33 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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| michaeltag wrote: |
I'm getting ready to have Stephan's most likely do a 1.8 Turbo conversion on my '87 Syncro Westy that does not have factory A/C.
What makes me hesitate is the fact that the Vintage Air install closes off the fresh air inlet for the Vanagon's ventilation system. I would go to great lengths to keep fresh air.
, |
I,m looking at under dash systems right now. I've played around with jetta suby, and other donor parts....everything "outback" almost fits.
The problem is most modern systems pull their fresh air from the passengers side...there is a lot of realestate on that side of the vanagon.
Seems to me that Stephan could cut you a 4" hole in the sheet metal right behind the passengers headlight, then plumb the vintage air unit to it.
...Fresh/recirc like a modern car.
just one of the thoughts I'm playing with |
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MarkWard
Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2005
Posts: 17153
Location: Retired South Florida
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:28 am Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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If you search here, a member added fresh air vents into the Vintage Air unit that could open and close. The air came in through the same intake. It was a clever solution. We are running the vintage air Gen III. No complaints. A 30 year old vehicle is not exactly air tight to begin with.
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kourt
Samba Member
Joined: August 13, 2013
Posts: 1946
Location: Austin, TX
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:42 am Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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I'm running a Bostig conversion with the Vintage Air Gen IV system from Small Car with RedTek.
I love fresh air as well, and thought I would miss the option to get it from the vents, but in truth I don't miss it. I drove all day yesterday in 90 degree heat in Texas and didn't miss it one bit. During spring/fall, yes, I may crave fresh air--but I just use the wing windows.
Also--if I feel the need for fresh air, I turn on the blower and dial the temp to the coolest point that does not engage the AC compressor--the Gen IV unit is designed for this nuanced behavior. Also, the Gen IV air handler has heater hoses conveniently located behind the glove box, so adding a heater core shutoff valve back there is easy and convenient to access--furthering your ability to suppress hot air if you just want cool fresh air.
kourt |
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Pcforno
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Joined: October 14, 2014
Posts: 575
Location: Santa Fe, nm
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 6:55 am Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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| I have a small car vintage air as well. Have to say I do miss the fresh air. I think if you could rig something like mark ward mentioned that would be best of both worlds. If I had to do it over I certainly would add/retain a lever for fresh air vents |
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tencentlife
Samba Member
Joined: May 02, 2006
Posts: 10078
Location: Abiquiu, NM, USA
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 8:05 am Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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| michaeltag wrote: |
...
What makes me hesitate is the fact that the Vintage Air install closes off the fresh air inlet for the Vanagon's ventilation system. This really goes against my way of thinking. I love fresh air and I love having it with the windows up.
I know that A/C is an effective dehumidifier and that the Vanagon has wing windows.
...But, I would go to great lengths to keep fresh air. |
I got you covered:
http://www.vanistan.com/Vanistan/other_accessories.html
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=651327&highlight=vanistan
It's foolish from a safety as well as comfort perspective to have no fresh-air input in a vehicle ventilation system, you're entirely correct to demand it. Fresh air is necessary to counter the humidity added by vehicle occupants, and the dehumidifying aspect of AC is limited, if it works at all at lower temps (many AC systems self-disable at 40ºF).
You wouldn't use my recirc flapper valve since your entire stock airbox is replaced by in-dash AC units and the in-dash unit would provide that, but my kit would give you a controllable fresh air inlet closure. If your aftermarket system eliminates the stock vent control levers then you'd need to get creative to integrate my inlet door control cable, but push-comes-to-shove it can easily be a simple pull-knob cable installed separately from whatever controls are used with your new system. If you knew you would go that route I could supply a pull-knob cable rather than the hardware the kit normally comes with.
See the above links for details, please post any comments on the linked thread, and although there's not much more I could tell you that isn't already there, if you have more questions contact me at the email link on my site. Cheers.
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https://intrepidoverland.com/vanistan/
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 9:54 am Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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When you have the dash out and VW air distribution box removed for the VA system, it is extremely easy to figure out how to get fresh air into the cabin.
No, not wasting time explaining how, it is that easy once you have all of the parts removed.
Where you bring that air into is also up to you.
Add a filter element if going to do it.
You can purchase AC filament at any HVAC store.
Don't give mice a free ride into the cabin either, give it a little thought. |
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djkeev
Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32625
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 2:36 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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| insyncro wrote: |
When you have the dash out and VW air distribution box removed for the VA system, it is extremely easy to figure out how to get fresh air into the cabin.
No, not wasting time explaining how, it is that easy once you have all of the parts removed.
Where you bring that air into is also up to you.
Add a filter element if going to do it.
You can purchase AC filament at any HVAC store.
Don't give mice a free ride into the cabin either, give it a little thought. |
Not exactly helpful ^^^^
Sure to someone who has a mechanical mind, it may be a no brainer, but to those whose minds think different than ours..... It isn't quite so obvious.
It would take very little effort to tell us how to plumb in fresh air.
"I know how to do it........ but I ain't telling!"
This isn't unlike past posts saying "I have lots of "them" but I'm not going to sell "them", they are going into the scrap pile."
Just saying........
Dave
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Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert |
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16CVs 
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2004
Posts: 4025
Location: Redwood City, California
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 3:19 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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What's The matter Dave, Is your Karnac Broken ?
When you have the dash out and VW air distribution box removed for the VA system, it is extremely easy to figure out how to get fresh air into the cabin.
No, not wasting time explaining how, it is that easy once you have all of the parts removed.
Where you bring that air into is also up to you.
Add a filter element if going to do it.
You can purchase AC filament at any HVAC store.
Don't give mice a free ride into the cabin either, give it a little thought.
Stacy
_________________
1987 Syncro Westfalia Triple knob (bastard)
1989 Syncro Tristar Triple knob "Swedish"
2013 Jetta Hybrid a true "Zwitter"
Samba member # 14980
Call anytime number 650 722 4914 .
Keep Your van running and upkept tastefully for the love of the hobby.
Don't let your van end up in an "abortions" thread. |
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djkeev
Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32625
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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VWinVT
Samba Member
Joined: April 21, 2013
Posts: 1541
Location: North East Kingdom
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 3:39 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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| djkeev wrote: |
| insyncro wrote: |
When you have the dash out and VW air distribution box removed for the VA system, it is extremely easy to figure out how to get fresh air into the cabin.
No, not wasting time explaining how, it is that easy once you have all of the parts removed.
Where you bring that air into is also up to you.
Add a filter element if going to do it.
You can purchase AC filament at any HVAC store.
Don't give mice a free ride into the cabin either, give it a little thought. |
Not exactly helpful ^^^^
Sure to someone who has a mechanical mind, it may be a no brainer, but to those whose minds think different than ours..... It isn't quite so obvious.
It would take very little effort to tell us how to plumb in fresh air.
"I know how to do it........ but I ain't telling!"
This isn't unlike past posts saying "I have lots of "them" but I'm not going to sell "them", they are going into the scrap pile."
Just saying........
Dave |
Well said Dave. Contribute with kindness...or don't contribute.
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Small wheel turns by the firing rod,
Big wheel turns by the grace of God.
Every time that wheel turns 'round,
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:13 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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You Guys are funny.
I showed the entire process in detail and have contributed to threads about this product that a vendor sells, give crap directions on installation and makes money on....not VA the Vanagon conversion vendor.
Look at the pictures posted.
Those who pmailed me during the process.
Not really interested in doing the work for this vendor and than have them charge more money for the parts and claim it was all developed by them.
Just like brakes, reversed coolant manifolds.....blah blah blah.
Go for it Guys, lets see what you come up with.
And Dave, we both know the level of "help" I provide.
If not, read a few other threads Dudes.
Thanks. |
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djkeev
Samba Moderator
Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32625
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:18 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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| insyncro wrote: |
You Guys are funny.
I showed the entire process in detail and have contributed to threads about this product that a vendor sells, give crap directions on installation and makes money on....not VA the Vanagon conversion vendor.
Look at the pictures posted.
Those who pmailed me during the process.
Not really interested in doing the work for this vendor and than have them charge more money for the parts and claim it was all developed by them.
Just like brakes, reversed coolant manifolds.....blah blah blah.
Go for it Guys, lets see what you come up with.
And Dave, we both know the level of "help" I provide.
If not, read a few other threads Dudes.
Thanks. |
That's interesting, but it's not at all what you said in your first post, do you have a link to your thread now that we know one with said information with photos exists?
I've been searching for it but have come up empty thus far........
Dave
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Stop Dead Photo Links how to post photos
Ghia
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=392473
Vanagon
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=6315537#6315537
Beetle
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=482968&highlight=74+super+vert
Last edited by djkeev on Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:30 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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insyncro
Banned
Joined: March 07, 2002
Posts: 15086
Location: New York
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| Posted: Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:27 pm Post subject: Re: Vintage Air AC that gets installed with many Engine Conversions |
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| djkeev wrote: |
| insyncro wrote: |
You Guys are funny.
I showed the entire process in detail and have contributed to threads about this product that a vendor sells, give crap directions on installation and makes money on....not VA the Vanagon conversion vendor.
Look at the pictures posted.
Those who pmailed me during the process.
Not really interested in doing the work for this vendor and than have them charge more money for the parts and claim it was all developed by them.
Just like brakes, reversed coolant manifolds.....blah blah blah.
Go for it Guys, lets see what you come up with.
And Dave, we both know the level of "help" I provide.
If not, read a few other threads Dudes.
Thanks. |
That's interesting, but it's not at all what you said in your first post, do you have a link to your thread now that we know one with said information with photos exists?
Dave |
Here on the Samba, the pictures are available in Kyle's Lemonade thread.
The complete story, with pictures and videos of the fresh air modifications are on my Facebook personal page.
Reason being, I control who can gain access to the page.
I am moving most of my work to that page so that I can self moderate  |
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
Posts: 32625
Location: Reading Pennsylvania
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djkeev
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Joined: September 30, 2007
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