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72SilverBullet Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2010 Posts: 92 Location: Belle Mead
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 5:31 am Post subject: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Hello everyone, got my 1915 in my dune buggy and it ran decent enough for a test drive last night. I took it out and I feel like it lacks some power. It feels quicker than my 1600 but not by much. One issue that is noticeable is if I floor it in 2nd 3rd or 4th while doing 30, 40 or 50 is that it revs up quickly but doesn't move any faster. It feels like the clutch is not holding which could be possible but I get no burnt clutch smell and from start I don't feel slip. Off the line acceleration is decent but not great. I expected way more. Not sure what it could be, maybe timing or lack of fuel? I still need to time the engine and play around with carbs but it's just weird issue I didn't think I'd come across. Engine specs below, thanks.
94mm pistons
Dual Weber 44s
W-120 cam
Stock rockers, solid shafts
40/35.5 heads
4 into 1 header
Stock clutch _________________ 72 Dunbar Minivolks
67 Camaro RS/SS
86 GT
04 Terminator Cobra |
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Mikedrevguy Samba Member
Joined: October 15, 2008 Posts: 2233 Location: Medford, OR
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 6:07 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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When you say it revs quick, how quick, how high?
Where are you shifting?
Stripped axle stub? _________________ 74 1303 (RevBug): plan for German Look
76 914 with 2260
79 VW Iltis
69 Bwajaja
"The wise speak because they have something to say; while the foolish speak because they have to say something." Plato
Illigitimi non-Carborundum!! |
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72SilverBullet Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2010 Posts: 92 Location: Belle Mead
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 6:32 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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I don't think its an axle nut, car ran and drove prior to motor swap and it was fine. It is also a new lightened flywheel.
As far as RPM go, if im going steady at 2200-2500 RPM and then floor it, it will increase speed (not at a rate that is anything to write home about) but then at like around 4000 RPM it goes to like slip feel mode where you actually have to back off the throttle because you feel like your just burning up the clutch and wasting gas. I understand that the cam may make peak power at higher RPM but at roll I don't see it tearing through the clutch. Maybe a compression check is next? _________________ 72 Dunbar Minivolks
67 Camaro RS/SS
86 GT
04 Terminator Cobra |
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tzepesh Samba Member
Joined: May 28, 2003 Posts: 723 Location: Romania
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 6:35 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Did you re-adjust the clutch cable to the new motor? _________________ '74 1303S, L98B Viperngrun (extra glitter), German Look
'64 1200, Sea Blue, under restoration |
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porkchop-rob Samba Member
Joined: April 28, 2015 Posts: 440
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 6:37 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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If it feels like a clutch and it sounds like a clutch.... _________________ 1965 Beetle
1968 Beetle Baja (Son's First Car)
1976 Bus with Subaru (Wife's Riviera Camper) |
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72SilverBullet Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2010 Posts: 92 Location: Belle Mead
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 7:01 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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tzepesh wrote: |
Did you re-adjust the clutch cable to the new motor? |
That I did not, the clutch was off the old motor and maybe had 2K miles on it. It looked perfect so I threw it on the new flywheel. Its just weird how it has no odor at all if its slipping and how from a start feels fine. I guess that's whats throwing me off. Perhaps a clutch order would be in the works next, any recommendations? _________________ 72 Dunbar Minivolks
67 Camaro RS/SS
86 GT
04 Terminator Cobra |
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Singerdude Samba Member
Joined: March 07, 2015 Posts: 464 Location: Quebec, Canada
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 7:09 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Mine did something very similar and it turned out to be the cam and lifters getting chewed away. Check valve lash to make sure it is not that... |
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72SilverBullet Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2010 Posts: 92 Location: Belle Mead
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 7:17 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Singerdude wrote: |
Mine did something very similar and it turned out to be the cam and lifters getting chewed away. Check valve lash to make sure it is not that... |
It was a new cam and I did break it in according to instruction. I actually adjusted the valves again just this morning to see if they were out of adjustment and only a few were at .007" so I brought it down to .006". I also didn't see any metal in the oil when adjusting valves.
Does anyone know what valve float feels like? Im curious if its related to that. _________________ 72 Dunbar Minivolks
67 Camaro RS/SS
86 GT
04 Terminator Cobra |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 7:56 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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sounds like it's just driving through the clutch. change it befor you burn up the flyingwheel. stage 1 pp&good disc, or a duel friction disc may work with stock pp, but is it worth trying that just to find it needs pp too? |
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Cusser Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006 Posts: 31266 Location: Hot Arizona
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 9:25 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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porkchop-rob wrote: |
If it feels like a clutch and it sounds like a clutch.... |
"Quack, quack !!!"
Engine revving up and VW not moving faster correspondingly would be clutch slippage or axle nut splines as noted previously. _________________ 1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297 |
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coonhunter Samba Member
Joined: January 20, 2013 Posts: 150 Location: Amarillo, TX
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:15 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Mine did the same thing, when I put in my 1835. It's your clutch, I would almost bet on it. |
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mikedjames Samba Member
Joined: July 02, 2012 Posts: 2715 Location: Hamble, Hampshire, UK
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 10:26 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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It sounds very like it is the clutch, but it might have oil on it too which might let it slip and stay cooler
Mine decided to let go at around 65mph when there was enough gearbox oil on it to slip. The driveshaft seal was worn and hard and oil seeped out. The seal was not helped by the vibration from when the previous engine should have died but did not when a rocker slid off the rocker arm. The backfiring shook everything up because I was overtaking a truck at the time and had to hold on for about half a mile to pull in. _________________ Ancient vehicles and vessels
1974 VW T2 : Devon Eurovette camper with 1641 DP T1 engine, Progressive carb, full flow oil cooler, EDIS crank timed ignition.
Engine 1: 40k miles (rocker shaft clip fell off), Engine 2: 30k miles (rebuild, dropped valve). Engine 3: a JK Preservation Parts "new" engine, aluminium case: 26k miles: new top end.
Gearbox rebuild 2021 by Bears.
1979 Westerly GK24 24 foot racer/cruiser yacht Forethought of Gosport.
1973 wooden Pacer sailing dinghy |
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jpaull Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2005 Posts: 3456 Location: Paradise, Ca
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 11:11 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Experimental Wet Clutch disk test in progress?
Reminds me of the Burnout contest at Kelly Park. He let out the clutch and floored it, everyone cheering him on.... and thought the smoke that followed slowely later was his tires. Then the cheering sounds stopped, someone informed him that the whole time neither one of his tires was spinning. _________________ [email protected] MPH 1/4 Mile & 8.1 @ 83.7MPH in 1/8 Mile with Mild Type 1 VW Mag Case 2234cc commuter engine in stock weight bug w/only .491 total lift(CB2292 Cam), 42x37 heads, 48idf's, Street tires, Belt on, Mufflers, Pump gas, video of the run here: https://youtu.be/M3SPqMOKAOg
Transmission by MCMScott:
Rhino case, Klinkenberg 4.12, Superdiff, 002 mainshaft with 091 first idler. Weddle 1.48 Third & 1.14 Fourth. |
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72SilverBullet Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2010 Posts: 92 Location: Belle Mead
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 12:01 pm Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Im looking into a Kennedy Stage 1 clutch kit. Whats better Daiken or Kush kit? Stage 1 should be enough clamping power right at 1700lbs? _________________ 72 Dunbar Minivolks
67 Camaro RS/SS
86 GT
04 Terminator Cobra |
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rs58rag Samba Member
Joined: August 22, 2010 Posts: 419 Location: riverside,ca
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Posted: Fri May 27, 2016 12:32 pm Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Everything looked good on your build specs till i read stock clutch. |
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72SilverBullet Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2010 Posts: 92 Location: Belle Mead
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2016 3:58 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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rs58rag wrote: |
Everything looked good on your build specs till i read stock clutch. |
Hahaha, figured if I'd stay away from launches I'd be fine. I have other vehicles designated for that. _________________ 72 Dunbar Minivolks
67 Camaro RS/SS
86 GT
04 Terminator Cobra |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2016 7:56 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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I learned on my first build(1874cc) that the stock pp & new disc wasent enough. I learned with my 2332 the kenady stage 1&new disc wasent enough.(works fine on my 2028). you have to remember that the gearatios in the trans gets the car moving & reduction keeps the clutch fealing like its enough...untill the engine power/torque over comes the gear reduction&holding power of the clutch. there's when you get slip in high gears and not somuch if any lower gears. hell way back when...(early 90's) I bought a new 4wd.after some work(better breathing intake,syn oil& a few other mods) it would drive through the stock clutch in higher gears.some on these vehicles the clutch is just barly enough to hold the avaliable power. kinda hard to sell a new vehicle to the masses with a race clutch in it....and no need for it 90% of the tyme. |
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72SilverBullet Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2010 Posts: 92 Location: Belle Mead
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2016 10:07 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Thanks for the input everyone, I adjusted the clutch cable and found that it got better but is still slipping. Il be ordering a Kennedy pretty soon. Would a stage 2 be overkill? And worse drive ability? _________________ 72 Dunbar Minivolks
67 Camaro RS/SS
86 GT
04 Terminator Cobra |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Sat May 28, 2016 10:51 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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yes it's over kill. |
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72SilverBullet Samba Member
Joined: May 06, 2010 Posts: 92 Location: Belle Mead
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Posted: Thu Jul 07, 2016 5:58 am Post subject: Re: 1915cc installed, lack of power feels like clutch slip |
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Installed the Kennedy Stage 1 rigid disc, no more slip, rejetted carb moves a lot better now. Thanks for the help everyone. _________________ 72 Dunbar Minivolks
67 Camaro RS/SS
86 GT
04 Terminator Cobra |
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