How to patch a CV boot? (And needle-greasing CVs)

[Butcher]

[Mellow Yellow 74]

I find it weird that someone would drill holes in a gearbox case to install non standard cooler ports and change the gearbox oil way more than normal but wouldn't occasionally check the condition of their CV boots and replace them before they are in poor condition.
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1962 Karmann Ghia
1974 Deluxe Microbus
1985 Caravelle (Vanagon)

[61Scout]

Man, tough crowd here. Sounds to me like Sodo is well aware that the joints need to be serviced and boots changed, but is choosing to take the van on vacation and deal with them later. Haven't we all dealt with time constraints in our lives?

As for adding extra grease, it would also be logical that grease with fewer contaminants would be better than grease with a greater percentage of contaminants. Hence, adding new, clean grease would essentially increase the total volume and thus decrease the percentage of contaminated grease. I don't see anyone here making the argument that adding grease is or should be a replacement procedure for properly servicing a CV. Furthermore, Sodo isn't reinventing the wheel here... Van-cafe has recommended this for ages. See step 2 under CV Joint Maintenance here: http://www.van-cafe.com/home/van/page_16_9/cv-joint-maintenence.html

Bottom line, if you don't think adding grease is useful or practical, then don't do it on your van. Since this isn't your van, it's not a problem, right?

-Kevin
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1986 Westfalia Weekender Wolfsburg, RJE 2.3
1985 Tin Top, Subie 2.2 + 5MT
Floppy Mirrors no more: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=653018&highlight=
Remove the front spindle nut with ease: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=679567&highlight=
Remove the rear wheel bearing housing without messing with the big 46mm nut: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=679507&highlight=

-Nec Spe, Nec Metu

[Merian]

You are on the wrong track. Someone asked for advice and was then given advice.

The advice bifurcated a bit due to the length of the needle being shown as short on one photo, then again on preventative maint. vs. I now see a problem & what is the risk of not doing a complete fix before leaving on a trip.
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[Abscate]

Best argument to leave it alone is that a 3000 mile trip is nothing in the wear cycle of a CV joint. You will get plenty of noise warning if they start getting dry to deal with it when you get home.

Shoo-goo, plastic bag with ties, bicycle patch...all will work to keep dirt out.

Sorry about the tough crowd. Enjoy your trip!
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.ssS!

[Sodo]

Epilogue.

Upon servicing the CVS (new boots too) I could not even FIND the holes in the old boots except for the ones with shoo-goo on them. Which was still fine. I don't know that shoo-goo is even necessary.

I pumped LOADS of grease in, and couldn't really "detect it" by squeezing the boot. When I serviced the CVs (later) I found them well-greased. Which is kind of obvious, right? Anyway I think I can conclude that this works. Don't know how long, cuz I replaced the boots, but as some predicted 3,000 miles was not an issue.
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'90 Westy EJ25, 2Peloquins, 3knobs, pressure-oiled GT mainshaft, filtered, cooled gearbox
'87 Tintop w 47k 53k, '12 SmallCar EJ25, cooled filtered gearbox
....KTMs, GasGas, SPOT mtb

[fleetwood41]

Thanks for the update!

I'm glad people raised their concerns but many of us are or have been or will be in the same situation as you and it's good to know that for this small amount of miles, your instincts were correct.

I've pumped new grease into the joints a couple of times when full-on removal and inspection and repair was not possible and/or convenient and it's always been fine....part of owning these beasts is minimizing damage from repairs you can't make immediately....in my opinion of course.
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1987 2WD w/ 2.5 Subi & Poptop Conversion

[IdahoDoug]

Nice! Tuesday night, I had the Quattro in the garage to squirt black RTV into a worn r diff mount. Worked perfectly btw - massive clunk simply gone. While it was in, I needle filled 6 of 8 CV boots n covered punctures with a smear of said RTV. In a single trip to the store I could feel n hear one or more quieted down n the faint drivetrain tremors of all those axial shimmys disappeared. Yup, it works. 2 boots r new n The remaining 6 are on the bench to do on a nice warm day this summer. Great temporary strategy until age failure of the boots happens.

PS - I use a short needle n puncture the closest flat face to the CV. I can feel the needle against the joint. I use 40 pumps fwiw, and I dont squeeze it in. I just drive off knowing that slippery stuff sprayed all over the vertical face of the joint will do what slippery stuff on a vertical face does - spread itself around. I do back up in a circle at full lock first one, then the other way in front of the house before setting off. And no - I no longer worry what the neighbors think of my automotive penchants! Heh.
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1987 2WD Wolfsburg Vanagon Weekender "Mango", two fully locked 80 Series LandCruisers. 2017 Subaru Outback boxer. 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20V with rear locking differential, 1990 burgundy parts Vanagon. 1984 Porsche 944, 1988 Toyota Supra 5 speed targa, 2002 BMW 325iX, 1982 Toyota Sunrader

[Paulbeard]

[Wildthings]

I have been adding grease to my CV's as part of my routine maintenance for over twenty five years. Got a needle that is long enough to go under the small end of the boot and reach all the way into the bearing itself. Add a couple of pumps of grease between each bearing. This isn't frequent maintenance, maybe only at 30,000 mile intervals.

I first started doing this when the CV's on my then shiny new 91 Multi started making noise in a remote area of Canada on a trip. Doing normal service of removing, cleaning, and regreasing the CV's didn't seem to be a very viable option. I could get my hands on a grease needle and some plain #2 lithium grease so I pumped the grease into the boot and then messaged it into the bearing and it worked. Later on I got a long enough needle to get the grease more directly into the bearing.

I never otherwise touched the CV's until the tranny went out over a decade later, at which point the CV's got replaced but really didn't look that bad.

If there is one thing I have found about maintenance it is that doing something that is simple like adding coolant conditioner to a cooling system annually or adding grease to a CV's ever year or two is easy and gets done, while doing it "right" such as draining and refilling the coolant system or removing, cleaning, and relubing the CV's are big jobs that very often get put off for another year or two or three until damage is done.

[AZ Landshaper]

Yeah man tough crowd.
Next time expect to get chastised for unconventional stop gaps.

That's exactly what this is, a stop gap. And four a few thousand miles or more that would make me feel a bit better. In the long run I just replace the entire unit. I don't find rebuilding or even scrubbing down to eval worth my time.
At 178000 mine are shot.

I do believe the joint heats up and the new will mix w the old to amend the gritty old grease w some viscosity.
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85 Weekender w/ EJ22
Previously
64, 71, 72, 73, 76, 81, 84, 85 & 87 Campmobiles and Westfalias
and a 67 bug.

[IdahoDoug]

I first did this to my Fiat X1/9 in college when I noticed one of the boots was torn and I had nowhere to do any work, nor tools. I bought a curved leather needle and some tough outdoor thread, a squeeze tube of silicone, and a squeeze tube of grease. Sewed the lips shut and sprayed the result with brake cleaner, then smeared silicone on the result. It held until well into the following summer.

That type of boot is easier to repair and hold together as its a shaft that only changes a few degrees with suspension movement. A front outer boot may not be possible due to the extreme angles it sometimes operates at.

AZ made a comment on grit. I think its important to say that if the boot is split or torn then this is not a good strategy. An aged but intact boot means there is no grit inside - just grease that has wear metal in it and has worn out the additives and become too thick to protect the metal contact surfaces. So its an effective strategy though as noted a stop gap. Fresh grease dramatically slows wear when it is introduced.

But if the CV has been exposed to road dirt, water splashing directly into it, etc then its only a stop gap to get home with, not an effective way to delay proper servicing until its more convenient.
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1987 2WD Wolfsburg Vanagon Weekender "Mango", two fully locked 80 Series LandCruisers. 2017 Subaru Outback boxer. 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20V with rear locking differential, 1990 burgundy parts Vanagon. 1984 Porsche 944, 1988 Toyota Supra 5 speed targa, 2002 BMW 325iX, 1982 Toyota Sunrader

[Ahwahnee]

Edit: Well, that's weird - the post I was replying to disappeared while I was typing a response.

[teej]

Here is what I did to patch a tired CV boot. I used some Sikaflex polyurethane construction sealant, in 2013. Outer ribs were cracking but had not fully split. Cleaned rubber well with alcohol, let dry, applied Sika, cured 24hrs before driving, with note to monitor.

Well 6 years later in 2019 micro cracks were showing so cleaned and applied another layer.

Finally after another year, I am replacing the boot. The joint and axle end are still clean, no grit or water got in.

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1986+ Wolfsburg Weekender Pop-Top 2.3 WBX Manual Trans

[Sodo]

[teej]

Ha. Yeah I expected just a few months and the experiment went on and on, every time I checked it looked ok. They were "looked at" just before this patch job in 2012 when the trans was rebuilt, at least the inners, but I don't think actually serviced. I didn't know much when we bought it in 2009, a mechanic replaced one CV right at that time I think it was L outer. This one is L inner.

Other than that no service over about 25,000mi. I don't know why I avoided touching these, a lot easier than I thought, and less messy than expected if you are ready for it. Threads helped!

I think the CV is still serviceable, some wear but no pitting, but I had a new Lobro that wasn't too tight, nor too roughly machined as others have sometimes noted, I bought it in 2011 I think. I cleaned it greased it up and installed it with the new boot. I will keep the cleaned up old CV as a spare.

Is there a best practice for preserving a clean CV that will be stored for a while? Like a wipe with WD-40 or other?
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1986+ Wolfsburg Weekender Pop-Top 2.3 WBX Manual Trans

[IdahoDoug]

I'd just oil it so 100% of the surfaces have an oily coating, then put a plastic bag over the joint and ziptie it shut. I have a few sitting in the garage like that in case some wayward Vanagon owner calls the Vanagon Rescue Squad in my area...
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1987 2WD Wolfsburg Vanagon Weekender "Mango", two fully locked 80 Series LandCruisers. 2017 Subaru Outback boxer. 1990 Audi 90 Quattro 20V with rear locking differential, 1990 burgundy parts Vanagon. 1984 Porsche 944, 1988 Toyota Supra 5 speed targa, 2002 BMW 325iX, 1982 Toyota Sunrader

[4Gears4Tires]

I would not put oil on rubber. If you're going to coat them with anything, use 303 aerospace protectant.
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'87 Syncro
Ferric Oxyhydroxide Superleggera Edition

[teej]

[ZsZ]