1961 Beetle trans question

[The Hammer28]

Hello - I'm new to the site and to VW's. I just bought a dune buggy based on a 1961 beetle. The transmission is shot. I'm looking to buy a reman'd or used trans in decent condition, but would like to know 1) which transmissions are compatible with this car and 2) what are the best sources for them. I'd also like to know if certain years of transmissions are better than others. Looking to get this thing running as cheaply as possible before the end of summer. From what I have read, I have a swingaxle trans, which I imagine means that I can unbolt and swing the axles away from the trans for removal. If someone can confirm that for me, I'd appreciate it. The car is now 12V. I was told that the engine and trans are original. The engine sounds great. Starts immediately on the first turn of the key. Anyway, this thing needs a lot of work, so you'll be seeing me around. Any help is appreciated. Thanks.

[TinCanFab]

Hi, the best thing for you would be to get some pictures posted up. It will save you a ton of headaches trying to describe things. A swingaxle does not have the option of removing axles easily. They are held in place by snap rings directly to the differential. You will need to remove the Trans for disassembly. There are 2 main types of swingaxle- split case or tunnel type. Split case is constructed like the engine, the center section is two halves bolted together. The tunnel Trans is one piece, this is the one you will want. How you want to use the buggy, engine combo and tire size will determine what gearing you want. We need more info, but post pics so we can really see what you have.
_________________
Check out my truck brought back from the dead... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=420762&highlight=sprayed+blood

They're never really ever finished 58 rag build...
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=658092

[The Hammer28]

Here are a few pictures. If you want to see anything else specific, let me know.i included a picture of the disc brake hub because I was told that I need to replace the nut on that. Right now, the drum is very loose on there. Previous owner basically told me that this nut also holds the wheel on. I haven't really dug into taking it apart, yet. Can someone tell me the proper name for that large center nut?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/141392619@N04/shares/BFL2J7

[67rustavenger]

The nut is called a "castle" nut. It's torqued onto the axle at 250+ft lbs.
That is, if it was torqued properly by the p.o.
Your trans is a tunnel type trans so at least you don't have to worry about getting the proper trans for off roading.
Good Luck.
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I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
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There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
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[mukluk]

The serial number on your trans appears to start with an 8, making it most likely a 65-66 unit. If still stock internals, it'll be a 4.37 ring and pinion. The engine you have installed is a dual port, therefor not an original to '61 engine either. As the vehicle is converted to 12v and you've a dual port installed, chances are extremely good that you also have a 12v flywheel installed. What this means to you is you will need either a 67-68 swingaxle trans. or you'll need a 61-65 trans that is clearanced for the 12v flywheel... additionally, you'll need to decide if you want to stick with the 4.37 R&P or go with the later 4.12 set that came stock in the 67-68 trans.

What's wrong with the current trans that it's "shot"?
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1960 Ragtop w/Semaphores "Inga"

[67rustavenger]

[The Hammer28]

The previous owner told me that the trans was completely shot after something happened in the sand dunes with it. I took his word for it since people that are trying to sell something typically don't mention problems they're not positive about. I did not even try to put it into gear. I towed it home and put it on stands. I can probably stick it into gear tomorrow to see what happens. I'm basically trying to get it drivable right now, so I can enjoy it while I continue to restore things here and there. Just want it on the street for now, no off-roading. Looking for any suggestions on how to go about this. Mukluk - You mentioned that I may have a 65-66 trans in the car now, but then left out a 66 trans when you were making suggestions about the next trans I could put in there. Was that by mistake or should I avoid a trans from a 66 for some reason?

[mukluk]

No reason to avoid any specific year trans from 61-68, they're all pretty much on par with each other... I left off the 66 due to a brain fart. 61-66 are all 6v trannies, 4.37 R&P, while the 67-68 are 12v with 4.12 R&P. Additional differences are as pointed out, up through 66 use short axles and tubes, 67 uses long tubes and axles but they are still short spline, while the 68 uses long tubes and long axles that have long splines. If you plan on reusing your current brakes, you'll need to determine whether your current axles are long or short spline.

Before you try to do much of anything with the current transaxle, you will definitely need to get that loose axle nut torqued down and verify the gear lube is up to the proper level (should be just up to the bottom of the fill plug on the left side of the trans). Something to check as well before you torque down the axle nut though -- pull the brake disk off and verify the splines in it and those on the axle shaft aren't damaged or stripped.
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1960 Ragtop w/Semaphores "Inga"

[The Hammer28]

Okay, so I didn't have time to do too much with the buggy other than start it and put it into gear. There is terrible play in the gear box, which may be common with these. When I put it into gear, I can literally move the shifter back and forth about six inches without it coming out of gear. In fact, it's pretty difficult to find neutral once you put it in gear. The wheels definitely move, like there is no problem with the trans. I think whoever installed the linkages may have done them backwards. It looks like lower right is first and upper left is fourth. Again, not sure if that was just the way there were made. I pumped the brakes to see if that would stop the axles from spinning when in gear. They did not stop spinning, buy I did end up with a little pool of blackish oil underneath one of the drums. The PO did keep mentioning that I have to bleed the brakes, but I assume he also did not do something right when replacing the brakes since fluid is probably not supposed to pour out. I plan on really digging into this weekend, but any comments before then would be appreciated. Thanks.

[The Hammer28]

I'm resurrecting this thread because I finally got around to pulling the motor off of this thing. I'm looking for someone to give me some guidance on my next move. I'm not sure if I should buy a reman'd trans or just try to have someone rebuild this one. Do the axles come off before taking it in for a rebuild or turning it in as a core? Someone please dumb this down for me. This buggy is just going to be driven around near my house, probably not seeing anything over 30mph. If it's typically more cost effective to replace these, I need to know what to get and where to get it. Thanks for the help.

[TinCanFab]

Most rebuilds are exchanged with the center section only. It's really easy to ship and carry around that way. It's surprisingly light with the axles removed. If you want to pay the money and have all the axle and brake stuff installed by someone else, that's up to you. Odds are good that axle spades, fulcrum plates and side gears are worn or cracked, those do not come with a standard exchange.

Regardless, my next move would be to break the 36mm axle nuts loose and drain the oil out of it while it's up in the air and not flopping all around. Maybe clean off the big grimy gunk on the bottom of it so you don't get grease crumbles all over the ground. And check your shoes so you don't track grease into the house.
_________________
Check out my truck brought back from the dead... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=420762&highlight=sprayed+blood

They're never really ever finished 58 rag build...
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=658092

[The Hammer28]

Thanks for the input. Here are a few more photos that will hopefully help you tell me exactly what I have. Thanks again.

[TinCanFab]

You have a typical 60's era tunnel case swingaxle, looks like it's been clearances for 12 volt flywheel and early style throw out bearing. Just get a stock geared trans that looks identical to what you have and your good for what you are using the buggy for. That's a good core to exchange, you should have no problems.
_________________
Check out my truck brought back from the dead... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=420762&highlight=sprayed+blood

They're never really ever finished 58 rag build...
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=658092