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Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild
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OKType3Tim Premium Member
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2018 7:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Nice tip, thanks.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 18, 2019 7:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

I had a dealer tell me that TRW has been sold to ZF and the steering box production has been moved to Germany. Anyone else hear this?
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 19, 2019 8:49 am    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

That transaction completed in early 2015. I don't have any information regarding whether manufacturing operations were moved from one place to another.
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Bala
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:10 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Looks like Iím just about ready for reassembly!

Everything has been cleaned and rebuild kit purchased.

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New worm shaft

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Lucked out and a neighbor gave me this granite sink cut-out. Just the right size.

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Resurfaced the adjustment screw.

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I have Corn Head grease being delivered later this week. In the mean time Iíll get the body, lid, etc. painted black.
Am I missing anything else needed before the final assembly?
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OKType3Tim Premium Member
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2019 3:42 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Looks like you are prepared.
Work the top of the housing on the surface plate to make sure you have a nice level sealing surface:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

And chase all the threads.

Also, based on recent evaluation of a couple units that had now been reassembled for a couple years; I recommend going on up to 22-25 ft-lbs on the cover bolts, and using blue (medium) threadlocker. At 15-18 ft-lbs and no threadlocker, we have seen a couple bolts become loose with time.
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PostPosted: Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:29 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Bala/ May I ask where did you get the rebuild kit ?
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2019 12:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Solidbug wrote:
Bala/ May I ask where did you get the rebuild kit ?


From the man himself:

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2013334
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Bala
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 31, 2019 8:49 am    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Yes indeed, straight from Tim. Awesome that he is offering these kits.

Next steps complete.

I resurfaced the housing/lid mating surface.

Before

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I used 1500 grit wet/dry sandpaper, and it took a LONG time. Just what I had around and was actually kind of relaxing working it on the granite.

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After 3-4 sheets of paper and a good 1/2 hour. I can still see a few original tooling marks and what looks to be some sort of factory stamping (check out the upper left corner), but otherwise it is very flat and mirror shiny.

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Painted all my parts.

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New worm shaft all cleaned off.

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And got my Corn Head grease in the mail! They sent me horizontal CHG when I requested vertical as it specifies in the Bentley. Hope this still works.

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I've installed the adjuster screw bearing dry and it feels perfect I think. But, I'll have to take it back apart and add grease to see if it still feels right.
Tim, should if feel similar to the resistance when adjusting valves but maybe a little more firm?
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Good progress BALA.
Yes, that would have taken some time starting with 1500. But, your shoulders are all "buffed up" from all those repetitions. Very Happy

I start out with "Fine" emery and finish with 2000.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 7:52 am    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Thank you!
Yes, it was a workout for sure. Smile

Did you see my question on the adjustment screw above?
I have non of the specialty tools, so I'm sure I'll have plenty more inquires coming. Hopefully my slow progress will be a decent guide for the "average" box rebuilders out there. Smile
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:10 am    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Bala wrote:

Did you see my question on the adjustment screw above?


When assembled with grease, the adjuster screw should turn freely, but without any vertical play.

(Sorry, saw the question and forgot to answer sooner.)
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 06, 2019 9:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Bala wrote:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Dancing Dancing Applause Dancing Very Happy
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:43 am    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

That's a fantastic thread...
One question, any idea about the quantity of special oil go inside a 1972 1303 steering box ?

https://assets.ctfassets.net/kznjmjn6augk/5EgucG4A...PDS_GB.pdf
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2019 10:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

OKType3Tim wrote:
Next, I build up the roller shaft.

The roller shafts are degreased, all the paint and gunk is removed from the bottom of the shaft and the splines where the steering drop arm attaches.
Then checked for wear on the surfaces that ride on the brass bushings. This one is pretty suspect at the top of the shaft. I rejected it:
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Then check for wear on the roller surface:
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With my limited experience I think this one has only moderate wear, and will still have some life in the roller surface. I.E. the shinny wear is not all the way to the bottom of the groove, and there are no FLAT spots anywhere on the roller surfaces.

Then the roller is checked for axial (side) play. The Bentley spec is that if a 0.05-mm (.002-in) feeler gauge can be pushed between the roller and washer, then the roller shaft must be replaced.

This one is bad (double the allowed play):
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This one is just barely ok:
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Note, that every bit of side play at the roller translates directly into free play when you move the steering wheel back and forth.

The roller rides on a cage-less needle bearing. The movement should be smooth without excessive play. Here are some pictures of one that was NOT smooth. (but it still turned.)
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Yep, those needle bearings are worn out. Laughing
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The adjuster screw bearing surface at top of the roller shaft must be clean and smooth:
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And the circlip WILL BE worn, so replace it.
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Note: The adjuster screw is a bearing. The adjuster screw is fixed/locked in the cover plate. And applies continuous pressure to the top of the roller shaft as the shaft rotates back and forth.

I found a unit that had been assembled "DRY" and even though it had never seen service, the adjuster screw already shows scaring.
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Since the adjuster screw is a bearing, I make sure that the surface is nice and smooth,
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by doing a few figure 8 motions on the surface plate:
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With this result:
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So now I have all the parts.

    Acceptable shaft
    Polished adjuster screw
    Selection of Roller shaft shims
    New circlip
    Adjuster screw lock nut


Note that the shaft bearing surfaces are clean, bright, free of damage. On this unit, the bottom section of the shaft has been "blackened" to protect from corrosion.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I test fit the adjuster screw, shim and circlip dry.
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And the adjuster screw turns nicely, just right.
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BUT I disassemble and fill the cavity with corn head grease,
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and the circlip has to be forced into the slot and the adjuster screw is so tight that it will not turn. So I back off one size on the shim:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Note: both the shims shown above are VW shims. So you get an idea of what the manufacturing tolerance on those shims were.

And all is well. No sloppiness, adjuster screw turns nicely, but firmly:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Next, I'll examine the worm shaft.


Im feeling less and less optomistic about a good steering box rebuild after reading all these pages of thread.

Interested in how you got that pin out.. do you drill out one side? I cant tell if its peened over or not and she wont budge
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duncan1958
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 31, 2019 10:08 am    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Bought a new box for my type 3
With these markings
AMPRI
24109
1618

This was from a vender online in the UK
Got the box home (Spain) unpacked it and it does,nt rotate freely/smoothly as I would expect a new box to be.
After reading this fabulous article I am concerned that what I have bought is of poor quality.
Could I make adjustments to the box to eliminate the roughness of the turning action, I have not installed the box yet but have removed the one that was on my squareback, The adjustment top screw was wound right in and had a large amount of play on full lock and felt tight in the centred position.
Looking for guidance as to best course of action.
Rebuild original box ?
Strip new box (mildly) to investigate cause of non smoothness ?
Thanks in advance guys
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

flyingbrick wrote:


Interested in how you got that pin out.. do you drill out one side? I cant tell if its peened over or not and she wont budge


Yes, the only way is to drill off the end of the pin. I mounted the shaft in my mill and used an end mill to take off the end of the pin. So yes, I destroyed that unit in the name of science. [although obviously, it was already pretty destroyed.]
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

duncan1958 wrote:
Bought a new box for my type 3
With these markings
AMPRI
24109
1618

This was from a vender online in the UK
Got the box home (Spain) unpacked it and it does,nt rotate freely/smoothly as I would expect a new box to be.
After reading this fabulous article I am concerned that what I have bought is of poor quality.
Could I make adjustments to the box to eliminate the roughness of the turning action, I have not installed the box yet but have removed the one that was on my squareback, The adjustment top screw was wound right in and had a large amount of play on full lock and felt tight in the centred position.
Looking for guidance as to best course of action.
Rebuild original box ?
Strip new box (mildly) to investigate cause of non smoothness ?
Thanks in advance guys


Could you post a picture of the box you purchased?

With the adjustment top screw wound right down in; my experience is that both shafts are gone. Possibly the top bushing also. The question will be if the bottom bushing is still worthy. If it is, then new shafts, the kit, and a rebuilt top bushing could get you back in service.

Another option is a new, real TRW that doesn't have machining errors; Take it apart, clean out the bad grease, cheap bearings and seals. Use the bearings, seals, etc. from the kit. Corn Head Grease. Adjust it properly. Several individuals have had success with this approach.

Here is a bad TRW machining error:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Make sure the drop arm slides onto the roller shaft when you receive the unit. This one doesn't fit. The splines on the roller shaft are not spaced properly. TRW made good on this one and provided a replacement.
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PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 3:22 am    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


here is a photo of the box,doesnt tell you much really

have adjusted the top set screw in a little with wheels off the ground and steering wheel centred took for short drive and seems to track better in straight line at speed 100mph although still not confidence giving feeling at the wheel
there is still what i would call too much play when the steering wheel is in the centre /straight ahead position.
have ordered some oil seals and corn head grease to rebuild the original box
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PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 7:04 am    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

This popped up just in time, I might be picking up a box of type 3 steering boxes this weekend if all goes to plan.d
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 05, 2019 5:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Steering Boxes: VW vs. TRW; VW Teardown & Rebuild Reply with quote

Where can I find a steering gear box for a 1971 Karmann Ghia. My mechanic said no TRW......Help
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