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rockerarm Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2009 Posts: 3552 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:48 pm Post subject: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Hello all. Hot VW's magazine ran this 1 page tech tip article in Aug 2010. Basically, it evolved around a bone stock 1600 dual port engine that was experiencing elevated cylinder head temps that pegged the 340 degree Auto Meter gauge. Their conclusion was the aftermarket cylinder heads were plugged with casting material and nearly non existent.
My question is has anyone experienced this?
Thanks in advance, Bill. |
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Erik G Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002 Posts: 13281 Location: Tejas!
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Danwvw Samba Member
Joined: July 31, 2012 Posts: 8892 Location: Oregon Coast
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:26 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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How hot did the heads get after opening the holes? _________________ 1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths! |
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rockerarm Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2009 Posts: 3552 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:31 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Hi. The article stated that after their repairs the cyl head temp dropped to a maximum of 260 degrees, a decrease of 80 degrees.
Bill |
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Danwvw Samba Member
Joined: July 31, 2012 Posts: 8892 Location: Oregon Coast
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:42 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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It's hard to believe that drilling out gaps between fins alone could make such a difference. Was there something else also done? _________________ 1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths! |
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skills@eurocarsplus Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007 Posts: 16883 Location: sticksville, ct.
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:07 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Danwvw wrote: |
It's hard to believe that drilling out gaps between fins alone could make such a difference. Was there something else also done? |
call it 40* a head then....
I have cleaned lots of flash off of heads before I have run them, so I cant say for sure what they could have been before/after but the flash was UGLY... _________________
gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
Jake Raby wrote: |
Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
Brian wrote: |
Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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Erik G Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002 Posts: 13281 Location: Tejas!
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:19 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Danwvw wrote: |
It's hard to believe that drilling out gaps between fins alone could make such a difference. Was there something else also done? |
really?
good casting new CB
stock
aftermarket head casting flash needs to be drilled so air gets through
again, one of the many differences between an engine builder and an engine assembler. _________________ Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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Mr.Duncan Samba Member
Joined: May 12, 2012 Posts: 3542 Location: Houston, TX
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:30 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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That's why I HATE when a customer gives me an EMPI HEAD
100% blocked. Not even joking.
Useless.
(well you can drill them to make them flow again) _________________ (Owner) www.vintagecarleds.com
Red 1971 Squareback Thread
Red 1966 Beetle Thread
---------------------------------------------------
1971 Green Super Beetle (sold)
1966 Ghia (sold)
1971 Blue Super Beetle (sold)
1966 Java Green Std Beetle (sold)
1971 Red Squareback (sold)
1966 Red Beetle |
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Zundfolge1432 Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2004 Posts: 12468
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:15 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Go back to my engine build thread "mystery engine" you'll see me shining a light through the fins as well. Stock heads are usually good but sometimes become blocked with dirt and oil and or a careless job of cleaning. Good idea to restate this, it's little things like this that are sometimes overlooked. |
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ALB Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2008 Posts: 3483 Location: beautiful suburban Wet Coast of Canada
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 4:37 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Mr.Duncan wrote: |
That's why I HATE when a customer gives me an EMPI HEAD
100% blocked. Not even joking.
Useless.
(well you can drill them to make them flow again) |
You get what you pay for. So many VW owners are such cheap asses; the junk replacement parts that we have to put up with is because so many people will pick the cheap sh*t (that sort of works) every time instead of the properly engineered out of the right material with proper machining and heat treat. The industry is in a sorry state and we only have ourselves to blame. If we collectively stopped buying crap from Empi (and others) and demanded oem quality (or better) it wouldn't be this way. Yeah, stuff would cost a little more, but you'd only have to buy it once. There's no value in buying something twice (or even 3 times). But so many of you just don't get it...
As usual, just my 2 1/2 cents (I'm Canadian, eh). Al _________________ On a lifelong mission to prove (much to my wife's dismay) that Immaturity is Forever!! |
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Dan Ruddock Samba Member
Joined: October 25, 2012 Posts: 3594 Location: Sarasota, in my adopted state of Florida
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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The exhaust of the cooling system is just as important as the intake. If the airspeed is too high around the head because most of the head is plugged up the air does not have enough time to pickup the heat as effectively.
This is common sense folks.
Dan |
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richparker Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2011 Posts: 6983 Location: Durango, CO
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 8:43 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Erik G wrote: |
Danwvw wrote: |
It's hard to believe that drilling out gaps between fins alone could make such a difference. Was there something else also done? |
really?
good casting new CB
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Just had these in my had today, they were unbelievably clean. The intakes looked smaller then ones on the 044 super mags. Looked like the redesigned intakes allowed for larger air openings. I'm sure they will provide low temps with great performance. The new logo also looks great!
As far as cleaning up casting for better air flow. Seems like that's how it is unless you have the Panchito. _________________ __________
’71 Westy build
Adventure thread
’65 Deluxe Build
’63 Deluxe Build |
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Danwvw Samba Member
Joined: July 31, 2012 Posts: 8892 Location: Oregon Coast
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Posted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:06 pm Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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There sure are some misconceptions of the laws of thermodynamics here on the samba. This is not the first time I've run into odd thinking when it comes to head temperature. But Yes not talking about holes If they drilled holes and got lower head temps then that's real data.
(This head first photo below) I would think would run cooler in the center than the others above:
Why? Because the cold intake manifolds are cast with more direct contact to the rest of the head than the other two above.
Now that being noted! look at the area around the exhaust ports. This is where heads are the hottest so air movement through and around those exhaust ports is really important. And this would make the Panchitos and the Stock heads the winners for perhaps more uniform cooler temperatures. Air moving between the intakes would make little difference. Well it may help a little when coming off the freeway and coming to an idle when there is little evaporative cooling in the intakes. And unless your in a rocket ship or doing Mach 2 or something air moving around the surface is going to cool more the faster it is moving. I would bet that the stock head cools best. longer fins! (At least they look longer to me and maybe follow the curve of the chamber better) but without holding a Panchito 44 I can't be sure. Someone needs go get some data about the Panchito heads and post it. So much depends on how rich or lean the engine is running though it may make fin cooling not as big a factor as the main jetting being a little too lean causing heating.
Below are stock vw 311 heads and I will be happy to post more photos and measure the fins on them if anyone is interested.
More on them here: Are these 311 heads any good?
_________________ 1960 Beetle And 1679cc DP W-100 & Dual Zeniths! |
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DesertBob Samba Member
Joined: February 09, 2004 Posts: 1245 Location: Goodlettsville, Tennessee
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Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2016 6:22 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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What are the best tools to use to clean up the flashing? My heads are really ugly. _________________ All it takes is a little imagination, some mechanical ability, and neighbors who mind their own business
74 Super Beetle (German Look Project)
Full Flow 1776 with 36 Dells, 4 wheel drilled and slotted disc brakes, Porsche 7x17 Turbo Twists, Topline Maxx Struts, Camber kit, 7/8" Front Sway bar, Rear Sway bar, Urethane bushings all around. |
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Glenn Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 76939 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2016 6:44 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Are they really that nice out of the box or is that a "beauty" shot?
Because i've never received a Whopper that looks like the picture in their ads.
_________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare |
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mondshine Samba Member
Joined: October 27, 2006 Posts: 2770 Location: The World's Motor Capital
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Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2016 7:21 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Glenn-
That's because the food stylist that assembled that Whopper makes 5-10K a day!
Very different than the kid with pimples on his face who makes yours.
They will go through cases of buns, for a "perfect one", then super glue on extra sesame seeds where they're skinny.
A case of tomatoes might yield 5 perfect slices...
Well you get the idea |
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Glenn Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 76939 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2016 7:41 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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mondshine wrote: |
Glenn-
That's because the food stylist that assembled that Whopper makes 5-10K a day!
Very different than the kid with pimples on his face who makes yours.
They will go through cases of buns, for a "perfect one", then super glue on extra sesame seeds where they're skinny.
A case of tomatoes might yield 5 perfect slices...
Well you get the idea |
Did they do the same with the head?
Just asking. _________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare |
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Erik G Samba Member
Joined: October 16, 2002 Posts: 13281 Location: Tejas!
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Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2016 8:06 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Glenn wrote: |
mondshine wrote: |
Glenn-
That's because the food stylist that assembled that Whopper makes 5-10K a day!
Very different than the kid with pimples on his face who makes yours.
They will go through cases of buns, for a "perfect one", then super glue on extra sesame seeds where they're skinny.
A case of tomatoes might yield 5 perfect slices...
Well you get the idea |
Did they do the same with the head?
Just asking. |
cherry picked maybe, but the 2 I have seen looked like that. Looks like richparker above had his hands on a set and says the same _________________ Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery! |
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Pat D Samba Member
Joined: March 10, 2004 Posts: 414
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Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2016 8:09 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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That picture is from an off the shelf Panchito Glenn, they all look just as clean as that one. _________________ Pat, Im too fast slow me downs! |
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Glenn Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 76939 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Thu Aug 04, 2016 8:34 am Post subject: Re: Hot VW's Article Titled "Cooling Solution" |
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Pat D wrote: |
That picture is from an off the shelf Panchito Glenn, they all look just as clean as that one. |
Awesome.... nice to see QUALITY parts are still available. _________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
#BlueSquare |
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