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reithi
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2013
Posts: 30
Location: Kenya
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 Posted: Tue Nov 08, 2016 11:58 am Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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With an airtight scoop, the shroud will probably be unnecessary.
I will give it a try once I layout the coolant pipes....which is another project on its own.
Last edited by reithi on Thu Nov 10, 2016 1:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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cdennisg
Samba Member
Joined: November 02, 2004
Posts: 20271
Location: Sandpoint, ID
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| Posted: Wed Nov 09, 2016 12:57 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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This is great reading.
Subscribed!
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Ives676
Samba Member
Joined: June 20, 2013
Posts: 274
Location: Rogers, AR
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| Posted: Fri Apr 07, 2017 9:50 am Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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| reithi wrote: |
With an airtight scoop, the shroud will probably be unnecessary.
I will give it a try once I layout the coolant pipes....which is another project on its own. |
Any updates to share with us?
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1974 Riviera - Subaru EJ22
Build Thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=630031 |
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Convoy
Samba Member
Joined: March 17, 2011
Posts: 312
Location: San Clemente
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| Posted: Thu May 04, 2017 11:57 am Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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| Updates? |
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reithi
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2013
Posts: 30
Location: Kenya
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| Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 1:05 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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It's been a while since I last posted. I have been busy with work and other projects.
That said, I started with brackets to mount the radiator to the chassis. They are made from 1.8mm Galvanised Sheet off cuts that remained from the passenger floor. The brackets are folded half inch in opposite directions for increased strength and less flexing.
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reithi
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2013
Posts: 30
Location: Kenya
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| Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 1:16 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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Finally got the radiator mounted using the stock holes for the belly pan.
It is suspended with bushes between the radiator and chassis to dampen fan vibrations.
Last edited by reithi on Sun Aug 06, 2017 8:01 am; edited 1 time in total |
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reithi
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2013
Posts: 30
Location: Kenya
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| Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 1:20 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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Next up are coolant pipes.....I will first use plastic plumbing pipes and bends as templates for bending the stainless steel pipes.
Thanks for the support. |
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captincanuck
Samba Member
Joined: August 13, 2014
Posts: 730
Location: The Great White North
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| Posted: Thu Aug 03, 2017 7:40 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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| reithi wrote: |
| captincanuck wrote: |
So you aren't worried about reducing the surface area of your rad by sealing it up that tight? Looks mighty nice thou.  Will be interested to see how it performs |
Thanks Captincanuck.
Good question. Shroud or no shroud? Tough question. When the bus is moving the shroud with limit airflow. Without the shroud, the fan will have to work harder in traffic.
The plan is to fit it on the bus and see how it performs. If it doesn't work out, I will remove it. I guess since the scoop is airtight, it won't make a big difference. |
No shroud now I see? Your setup looks very close to mine and several others here so I will share somethings I have noticed that might make you want to reconsider your air flow setup.
On the go cooling is great. Fans never come on when on the highway or cruising around town.
Stopped if the fan does come on, it cools down the temp at an acceptable rate and then turns off. (No problem yet)
Where I think you will see a problem could be if the fan needs to come on when on the highway (AC on, climbing a mountain, crazy hot outside temps).
What I notice is that when the fan comes on, the air is deflected by the floor, forced back through the rad and out the front of the scoop.
This would obviously mess up your air flow at speed. (Unless you are leaving it with no floor, than it should work great  )
Give it a shot and see if you see the same thing happening. I will probably redesign mine over the winter, adding a shroud or redesigning to air in from the top and out the bottom with a pusher fan. No real traffic or much heat over 30C up here so hasn't effected me much yet.
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1979 Westfalia "FireFly" Subaru 2.2 with Subaru gears 5spd.
Build Thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=634777&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 |
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reithi
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2013
Posts: 30
Location: Kenya
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| Posted: Sun Aug 06, 2017 7:31 am Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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That sounds like hot air is recirculating through the radiator core. There are two ways to fix the problem.
1) Shroud
2) Scoop or deflector behind the radiator to direct hot air away from the floor.
I have the perfect hill to take it in a couple of weeks. It's about 5 miles long steep climb with no turns. |
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Bansheelos
Samba Member
Joined: February 27, 2012
Posts: 313
Location: NY/NJ
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vwwestyman
Samba Member
Joined: April 24, 2004
Posts: 5688
Location: Manhattan, Kansas, USA
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| Posted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:25 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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My radiator is scooped from below, with a puller fan above.
I've gut a chunk of plastic sheeting keeping air from blowing down through the radiator from above. It is just from the top edge of the radiator to the underside of the floor.
On my drive to and through Colorado this past week, it did well. Climbing up the passes at somewhat low speeds (following older buses) so high power, low airflow the hottest I saw the engine was about 212. Best I can tell, VW says 220 is the hightest as is "normal" for a TDI so that was pretty good. I did have the fan running up those climbs and sometimes turned the heater on.
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reithi
Samba Member
Joined: March 05, 2013
Posts: 30
Location: Kenya
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| Posted: Sat Aug 19, 2017 12:38 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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| vwwestyman wrote: |
| I've gut a chunk of plastic sheeting keeping air from blowing down through the radiator from above. It is just from the top edge of the radiator to the underside of the floor. |
That is the missing link on my setup Dave. I will have to drive it through torturous hills where I live before changing anything. |
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panel
Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2001
Posts: 1090
Location: Victoria B.C. Canada
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| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:33 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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What temps are you guys noticing your fans coming on ? I blew over my header tank overflow (on manifold) the other day while just idling in the driveway. I must still have bubbles in the system or just need a better rad. The one I have on there now is a Visteon-Sprint-Cup NASCAR-Oilcooler I turned into a radiator. 1.5" thick. Think I should go up to a 3" one ?
Old pic for ref:
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tristessa
Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2004
Posts: 3992
Location: Portland, OR
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| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 10:00 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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| Mine kick on around 90C/195F... |
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panel
Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2001
Posts: 1090
Location: Victoria B.C. Canada
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| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 8:18 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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| tristessa wrote: |
| Mine kick on around 90C/195F... |
You have one or two fans?
Tricks for bleeding ?
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My '65-Subaru EJ20 Turbo conversion |
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tristessa
Samba Member
Joined: April 07, 2004
Posts: 3992
Location: Portland, OR
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 7:26 am Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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| Two fans but they're wired in parallel to come on together. Never had any real trouble bleeding after I realized the front heater was higher than the motor and added an expansion bottle in the glovebox; fill the system, run it until the thermostat opens, shut it off to cool, top off. |
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Air_Cooled_Nut
Samba Member
Joined: March 27, 2004
Posts: 3040
Location: Portland, Oregon
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 9:26 am Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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| panel wrote: |
...I blew over my header tank overflow (on manifold) the other day while just idling in the driveway. I must still have bubbles in the system or just need a better rad. The one I have on there now is a Visteon-Sprint-Cup NASCAR-Oilcooler I turned into a radiator. 1.5" thick. Think I should go up to a 3" one ?
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My guess would be that you need a radiator, not an oil cooler.
I don't understand why you would even consider using a smaller radiator meant for oil than a larger radiator meant for engine water coolant 
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16863
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 3:43 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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| Air_Cooled_Nut wrote: |
My guess would be that you need a radiator, not an oil cooler.
I don't understand why you would even consider using a smaller radiator meant for oil than a larger radiator meant for engine water coolant |
wow...
yea, oil cooler designs are way, way different than that of a radiator. I would ditch that an buy a real radiator.
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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panel
Samba Member
Joined: December 02, 2001
Posts: 1090
Location: Victoria B.C. Canada
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| Posted: Mon Oct 16, 2017 2:48 pm Post subject: Re: Need Your Help- Underbelly Radiator Design |
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Thanks for the input etc.......like to get a 2 to 2.5" thick but might have to get a 3" as that seems the only one available. Should the 19 x 22 be ok then ?
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My '65-Subaru EJ20 Turbo conversion |
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Sloride
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Joined: February 09, 2002
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