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Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion
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Thebeas
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 2:21 pm    Post subject: Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

Finally thought I was thru with my conversion, and I technically am...but now it has trouble starting.

You can hear it turn over once or twice, and it usually doesn't fire.

I have gotten it cranked and it ran fine, but it was by jumping it off last night.

Got a new battery today (not knowing how old my original was) and it still was really slow to turnover, but it did crank on the first try. but after turning but off and back on it wouldn't crank.

I have a battery at 12.6 volts, my starter is getting power on the post too. Its about the same. When cranked the battery voltage reads 14.3 so I think the alternator is fine.

What else could it be?

New Bosch starter from RMW.

New Battery.

Clean grounds on the tranny.

what could it be? New at this....so it could be something I'm obviously overlooking.
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chompy
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 2:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

When you say it wouldn't crank, do you mean the starter just clicks when you turn the key, or it doesn't seem like it has enough power to turn over fully?

You say you cleaned the grounds, but what you are experiencing sounds like a grounding issue to me. You will want to check the ground strap for the battery and replace it if it's old.
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Thebeas
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 2:33 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

not enough power to fully turnover.

Its a fairly new ground for the battery, but I'll double check.

Any other grounds?

and thanks...
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Syncro Jael
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 2:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

Try this. It will at least let you understand the electrical connections and some diagnosis.

I also have a Subaru and have had to go with a high torque starter. Mine is the GW starter, but the TDI starter spins the Subaru like no tomorrow.

http://www.gowesty.com/tech-article-details.php?id=33
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danfromsyr
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 2:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

your stock vanagon starter it NOT going to like turning over a Subaru motor.
the compression ratio is a ~20% higher..
a starter upgrade is the necessary (guess that's MHO) cost of a high compression conversion.

worse if you have an Automatic.
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Thebeas
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 2:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

cleaned up the battery grounds, same issue still occurs.

Could it be the alternator?

When I got this Donor car It ran just fine, but cranking it a day or two later the battery was dead. We jumped it off just fine.

Would that have anything to do with this problem?
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Thebeas
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 2:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

danfromsyr wrote:
your stock vanagon starter it NOT going to like turning over a Subaru motor.
the compression ratio is a ~20% higher..
a starter upgrade is the necessary (guess that's MHO) cost of a high compression conversion.

worse if you have an Automatic.


I did get the hi-tourqe starter from RMW when I bought the kit. Sorry, don't think I made that clear in the original post.
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Syncro Jael
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

From what I understand you can "Jump Start" it from another vehicle and it will start the van?

Once running the alternator is showing 14.3 volts? That is good.

You might just have a bad cell in your just purchased battery.

Go through and check all your wiring and connections. But if jump starting works, I would lean towards a bad battery again. It sounds like you are not getting enough juice to spin the starter.
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Thebeas
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

jump starting has worked....but doesn't always.

I'll start going thru the connections again. Sad
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

What is the battery voltage while you are cranking the starter?
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

ok, that's a plus...

have/had you cleaned the mating surfaces of the starter & bellhousing?
many often install an Aux ground cable right onto the starter bolts to the chassis..
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Thebeas
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:23 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

syncrodoka wrote:
What is the battery voltage while you are cranking the starter?


Well, I've drained the battery at this point. Just checked its at 12.2.

Turned the key and it went to 8.6-8.8
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

danfromsyr wrote:
ok, that's a plus...

have/had you cleaned the mating surfaces of the starter & bellhousing?
many often install an Aux ground cable right onto the starter bolts to the chassis..


I didn't, but it was all right out of the box.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

would replacing the ignition switch be my next step?
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 4:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

Have you looked at the ground strap from the body to the the nose cone of the Transmission? It is a braided cable and is often overlooked. Did you pull the transmission when you did the conversion?
Try a set of jumper cables from the negative side of the battery to the housing of the transmission. That will eliminate your ground issues if any. If a stick when you Bump start it, does it start right up?
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 4:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

i'm only inputting the facing surfaces that I'v had an issue with a new starter and the silver coat they spray on the aluminum portion.
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Thebeas
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 5:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

danfromsyr wrote:
i'm only inputting the facing surfaces that I'v had an issue with a new starter and the silver coat they spray on the aluminum portion.


I'm calling it a night. I'll try that tomorrow.

thanks for all the help
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 5:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

16CV's wrote:
Have you looked at the ground strap from the body to the the nose cone of the Transmission? It is a braided cable and is often overlooked. Did you pull the transmission when you did the conversion?
Try a set of jumper cables from the negative side of the battery to the housing of the transmission. That will eliminate your ground issues if any. If a stick when you Bump start it, does it start right up?


the braid itself it dirty, but where its bolted is clean as can be. I wire brushed those things down nice and shiny.

Tried the jumper cables, same story.

I appreciate the help.

I had a "spare" but clearly used ignition switch and it fired right up. Then the same story....just a slow turn then nothing.

I'll pick up a new switch tomorrow.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 7:04 pm    Post subject: Re: Slow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

2 or 4WD? I had my hot lead touching the tank strap. I drove it 150 Mi one day and stopped and came back out and it would not start.
The cable was pinched on top of the reversed manifold outlet and the tank strap. Can you say direct short?



Stacy
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 13, 2016 7:06 pm    Post subject: Re: Sow crank/turnover - New Subaru conversion Reply with quote

Thebeas wrote:
syncrodoka wrote:
What is the battery voltage while you are cranking the starter?


Well, I've drained the battery at this point. Just checked its at 12.2.

Turned the key and it went to 8.6-8.8

Yeah, that is waaay too low. Throw it on the charger overnight.
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