Brake Recommendation?

[Cavilry6]

Howdy all!

While my bus has never had a brake issue, it is still running the original system from 1968. Before our upcoming road trip, I wanted to at a minimum do a major brake service. That said, now that I have a broken upper reservoir and the Chinese-quality replacement is leaking, I am considering upgrading.

The engine is stock, and likely will remain close to stock. Meaning, we don't do a lot of hard driving.

So, what do you think makes the most sense? Please fill out the poll above and feel free to lend any other tips/discussion.

Here are some options I am considering: http://www.wagenswest.com/partstore/index.php/disk...rakes.html

http://www.wagenswest.com/partstore/index.php/disk...stang.html

http://www.wagenswest.com/partstore/index.php/disk...n-kit.html
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1968 Westy Tin-Top

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[rockerarm]

I voted for the stock refresh. Did-assemble and inspect what is worn out (shoes, wheel cyl's, drums, etc). Research availability and costs. Shoes can be relined by a specialty brake shop with options on material.

When done with this and it is not sufficient then a respected member here installed the '71 and later master cyl and brake booster to work with the drum brakes. You can e-mail aeromech for advice.

If this still isn't enough you could upgrade to the later disc brake assy's, either the 71/72 or the 73 and later. You could also install the later rear brake assy's. With this the wheel bolt pattern changes.

[airschooled]

Perhaps consider the fact that once the tires are locked up, brake type doesn't matter. Invest in good tires. Invest in good adjustments. Invest in a good bleed.

Enjoy.
Robbie
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[richparker]

I used a '71 upper reservoir with good success, so far. Stock brakes are fine, I have 0 issues stopping with my OG set up. It has been gone through, more than one time.

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[Cavilry6]

Thanks for all of the input, everyone!

The brakes most certainly have never been an issue (in terms of stopping distance and such) nor has fade ever been a problem. I guess I am more concerned about safety in regards to if the stock system is prone to failure.

But I can already hear your response to that: "not as long as you maintain it properly."

I suppose the previous failure which resulted in the dented nose and my dad's brake failure (luckily when parked) on his 1964 Land Rover had me spooked. Haha.
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1968 Westy Tin-Top

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[busdaddy]

I voted stock (suprised?), if they have been fully serviced and are maintained properly they are more than adequate, if you have a weak leg the booster mod doesn't hurt.

But "fully serviced" doesn't mean just pull a drum and wash off with brake cleaner, strip each unit down to the bare backing plate and clean/free up/lube each little component, fresh cylinders and shoes as well if you have any doubts about what's there now. And replace all 4 flex hoses as well, even the best brakes can't do thier job if the fluid isn't getting to where it does it's thing.

15 minutes adjusting while you wait for the sump to drain at each oil change keeps them in top condition.
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[airschooled]

Ooooh, also worth nothing, is from 2015's annual "wrap up" thread, the four buses with the most miles on them ALL had stock four wheel drum setups.

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[aeromech]

Disc brakes are great. That's why ALL modern cars have them now, even on the rears. That said, people have converted their 1968-1970 bay window buses to have front disc brakes. The problem is that when you change one part it affects other parts. For instance, if you change the fronts to use say 1971 stock rotors then you have changed to the narrow five bolt pattern and now your front wheels don't match the back. They look funny. You can buy one of these expensive kits but I'd be willing to bet that there's some unmentioned detail somewhere that throws a fly in the ointment. Like Tom Powell's bus. He has front discs but runs bug wheels for some reason. So it has become a bastard in my eyes.

The booster mod I do to the original drum brake buses has worked well on at least four buses so far. I've never had a complaint. It gives easy pedal force and positive stops. Problem is you still have the extra maintenance required to keep the drum shoes adjusted unlike discs which are self adjusting.

Here's a quick parts list
1) 1971 Brazillian master cylinder $70 + lower reservoir and two bungs $25
2) 1971 aftermarket booster, new, about $160
3) Fabricate a metal plate to weld to the front beam for the booster to mount on.
4) 7 feet of Gates 15/32 power brake hose $20
5) Vacuum check valve $10
6) Rod from booster to brake pedal $10

Laastly, you'll need to find a way to tap into the intake manifold for vacuum.
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[vwible]

For the vacuum, could you tap into the crossover tube that's part of a Kadron dual-carb setup by a "T" connector set next to the 3-4 side intake manifold?
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1970 Tin Top Walk Through Bus

[aeromech]

Not sure, maybe
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Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
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[scrivyscriv]

I'm pretty sure posting in the bay forum is going to get a vast majority of votes for stock

Any particular reason in mind you'd want to modify the brakes, like higher horsepower or something fun in mind like track day?
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[TDCTDI]

[Tom Powell]

[wcfvw69]

My 1970 bus brakes were a joke when i bought my bus a few years ago. If you applied the brakes, the bus would pull massively to the right. I found a seized front wheel cylinder.

Since then, the brake system has been inspected and new front pads installed. I've also replaced the rubber brake hoses. I think the drum brakes are very effective now that everything has been refreshed and adjusted correctly.

Yes, disc brakes have many advantages over drums. However, the drum brakes don't require that much more maintenance.
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[Cavilry6]

[Tom Powell]

In the VW disc brake design for bay windows there is a proportioning valve which restricts pressure/flow to the rear OG brakes. These valves are a rare part now. There is also a vacuum operated brake booster. Lack of a booster does not change the stopping distance, but requires some leg strength. I've swapped ends three times going downhill on snow/ice. Each of the slides was initiated by letting off on the throttle. Never had any body damage. On snow/ice I've momentarily locked up the front wheels and started heading for the ditch, but getting off the brake stopped the slide. My OG front brakes were bad/grabby/weak and I decided to go disc in the front with a dual MC. The components of the kit were excellent, but I got a kit for 15" wheels FUR. A replacement kit for OG 14" is on order.

Aloha
tp

[MrVWGuy]

I converted to late beetle dual reservoir behind the driver seat in my 68 a few years ago & I just recently installed the Wgenswest babystang kit and loaded up the bus with my two teenage sons, my girlfriend, dog, & camping equipment and drove 500 miles to the Charlotte transporter show and I love my new brakes! I chose the babystang kit so I could retain my stock wheels. I love my new brakes!!

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[TomWesty]