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vw moses Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2012 Posts: 213 Location: independance,louisiana
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 9:42 am Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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thats easy for you, given your experinece(modok),i'm going to haft to do some reasearch. big time. we need a vw youtube channel that shows the proper procedures for things like that(without jokes,personal problems,etc.) _________________ Youtube@vw moses
73 thing-gone
66 beetle-gone
62 beetle-gone
57 beetle-gone
convertable-beetle-w/bugspray & screamer dist.(019) gone
"Where There's a Will There's a Way"
63 one of a kind beetle. 57 dash,double rear window--sweet! |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 12:30 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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DeathBySnuSnu wrote: |
I was a mopar guy back in the day and usta swear by the long rod theory. But now a days I dont find a lot of difference. Yes there is a difference but it is hard to quantify.
I will say this. A short rod motor seems to be less picky about being over cammed. Where a long rod is more specific and less forgiving on the cam grind. |
I ran a few diferent roller cams (around 284@50,.650 lift) and they seemed to work just fine with the long rod in the mopar&duel 830 hollys on tunnel ram...on the street.massive head work. as for piston side loading yes and ...kinda.well.. that also depends on the pin hight as to how the thrust is applied.real low pin and that rocks the shit out of it and tries to make the ring lands contact the cylinders..high pin and...oh so eazy on things. thats why they made a race block that was about an inch shorter so you could move the pin up high as the rod was already close to optimal length.....on the other hand my big block has a raise deck and simeessee bores.400" taller deck for....mo stroke,mo power, mo fun. big is good.bigger is better, biggest..hasent been found yet. our 632 was sort of based off this same block,but our 800+ci was a spread bore for oh somuch more fun. If I ever go big bore on this vw stuff I will probably move the bores appart some.
I have a pretty good form for figuring all this out eazely on the vw, it sure came in handy when I ..down sized |
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vw moses Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2012 Posts: 213 Location: independance,louisiana
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 4:47 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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did you use 2 of the spacers per side- eaallred? _________________ Youtube@vw moses
73 thing-gone
66 beetle-gone
62 beetle-gone
57 beetle-gone
convertable-beetle-w/bugspray & screamer dist.(019) gone
"Where There's a Will There's a Way"
63 one of a kind beetle. 57 dash,double rear window--sweet! |
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303epps Samba Member
Joined: May 16, 2010 Posts: 51 Location: British Columbia, Canada
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 4:55 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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"thats easy for you, given your experinece(modok),i'm going to haft to do some reasearch. big time. we need you to do a vw youtube channel that shows the proper procedures for things like that(with jokes,personal problems,etc.)
fixed it. |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 6:51 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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vw moses wrote: |
did you use 2 of the spacers per side- eaallred? |
I went about that the other way I reformed the tins where they were contacting the heads keeping them from fitting up to the shroud as normal. I also us a nylon/plastic split tube( marine cable covers, they come in lotsa sizes) it go's on the tins so they dont eat at the case as the oe tins do. I also dont use brest plate so those tabe are gone, nothing realy has to "line up" execpt for where I want it to. |
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vw moses Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2012 Posts: 213 Location: independance,louisiana
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Posted: Sun Dec 11, 2016 6:54 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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thats cool- any pics?-anyone? _________________ Youtube@vw moses
73 thing-gone
66 beetle-gone
62 beetle-gone
57 beetle-gone
convertable-beetle-w/bugspray & screamer dist.(019) gone
"Where There's a Will There's a Way"
63 one of a kind beetle. 57 dash,double rear window--sweet! |
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yamaducci Samba Member
Joined: March 30, 2010 Posts: 2335 Location: Mount Airy, Maryland
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 10:43 am Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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My 2498 is over an inch wider but I didn't want it looked all hacked up with shroud filler plate and tins that don't reach the case and leak everywhere so I widened the shroud on both sides and extended the tins. it was a lot of work but turned out great.
The black sharpie is where I added metal to each side.
_________________ -John Cox
My 2498 Turbo Re-Build Thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5578697#5578697
3rd Brake Light Safety Stars- I still have a couple with blue light left. Email me if interested. |
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vw moses Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2012 Posts: 213 Location: independance,louisiana
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 12:31 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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Nice!,thats the way to go. very clean look, thanks for sharing that, _________________ Youtube@vw moses
73 thing-gone
66 beetle-gone
62 beetle-gone
57 beetle-gone
convertable-beetle-w/bugspray & screamer dist.(019) gone
"Where There's a Will There's a Way"
63 one of a kind beetle. 57 dash,double rear window--sweet! |
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Eaallred Samba Member
Joined: May 18, 2003 Posts: 5756 Location: West Valley City, Utah
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 5:54 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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vw moses wrote: |
did you use 2 of the spacers per side- eaallred? |
I bought the rail used with this engine already in it, I only wish it was done that nice, lol. It's just a round spacer with a long bolt, huge gap. Something I need to address before next season. Just bought it a few weeks ago, got to take it out once. It seems to work "okay", but man it's an ugly gap. I'd like to keep a chrome shroud and cylinder tin in it, so i'm going to have to figure out how to tweak the cyinder tins enough to make it work/seal better.
I like what yamaducci has done. If I were to paint the shoud that's what i'd do as well. Very nice _________________ Eric Allred
You have to remember something: Everybody pities the weak; Jealousy you have to earn. |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Mon Dec 12, 2016 8:44 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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tube of 3m polyurathane works wonders. I also use it to stiffen up rubber motor mounts and such, works awesome. 3m or lifecaulk they have 2 colors and a few diferent dry times. |
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vw moses Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2012 Posts: 213 Location: independance,louisiana
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Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 12:24 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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the vw after-market needs to provide tins & shrouds for wider type 1 mtrs. for the strokers who have wider mtrs. that would be very helpful. _________________ Youtube@vw moses
73 thing-gone
66 beetle-gone
62 beetle-gone
57 beetle-gone
convertable-beetle-w/bugspray & screamer dist.(019) gone
"Where There's a Will There's a Way"
63 one of a kind beetle. 57 dash,double rear window--sweet! |
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yamaducci Samba Member
Joined: March 30, 2010 Posts: 2335 Location: Mount Airy, Maryland
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Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 12:44 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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I have been saying for years why not make cylinder that with larger fins and make tins and larger fans and larger shrouds. Now they finally make extra long cylinders that can be cut down so why not add more fin area? _________________ -John Cox
My 2498 Turbo Re-Build Thread: http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?p=5578697#5578697
3rd Brake Light Safety Stars- I still have a couple with blue light left. Email me if interested. |
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modok Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2009 Posts: 26789 Location: Colorado Springs
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Posted: Tue Dec 13, 2016 6:22 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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Yeah buddy. Give me a big ass head with 1/2" larger fins all the way round. I'll make it fit. All sorts of people are ALREADY spending hours fitting the tin anyway, and multiple companies making aftermarket tin too, and much of that fits poorly, and we already have accepted that. |
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vw moses Samba Member
Joined: April 17, 2012 Posts: 213 Location: independance,louisiana
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Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 7:02 am Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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custom tin work would be a market better served by a talented vendor who makes them on special order. it could be done. obviously no one
is doing it _________________ Youtube@vw moses
73 thing-gone
66 beetle-gone
62 beetle-gone
57 beetle-gone
convertable-beetle-w/bugspray & screamer dist.(019) gone
"Where There's a Will There's a Way"
63 one of a kind beetle. 57 dash,double rear window--sweet! |
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jason Samba Member
Joined: August 07, 2002 Posts: 3444 Location: Garage
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Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 7:30 am Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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I say use C pistons. I used C pistons and 5.5 rods. Mine is alot narrower than stock. I had to take off some from regular 94's and the tin. The 5.7 would put you close. Pistons may be more but how much is your time modifying everything. |
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KROC Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2006 Posts: 359 Location: Vancouver B.C.
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Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 9:36 am Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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Use this piston with your 86 crank and 5.7 Rods with regular length barrels and you will an engine that is VERY close to stock width, I build these all the time. |
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Brian_e Samba Member
Joined: July 28, 2009 Posts: 3292 Location: Rapid City, SD
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KROC Samba Member
Joined: February 20, 2006 Posts: 359 Location: Vancouver B.C.
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Posted: Wed Dec 14, 2016 8:46 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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Hi Brian, compression height is .945"
Cheers. Darren |
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Hustlers67 Samba Member
Joined: September 21, 2011 Posts: 263 Location: Sydney, Australia
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Posted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 3:45 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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What do people do to address the valve cover to body clearance issues with wider than stock engines?? |
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ach60 Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2001 Posts: 4139 Location: Santa Maria
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Posted: Thu Nov 16, 2017 7:41 pm Post subject: Re: how wide will mtr. grow with 86mm crank-5.7rods compared to 1600 |
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1) Turn the car into a Baja Bug
2) Get out a hammer, and make it fit
3) Cut, grind, fill, and paint
From Sstgermain
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There's not enough clearance between the valve stem and the body to slide the cover off. |
_________________ Good Luck
Al |
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