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67ctbug
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2016
Posts: 3624
Location: CT
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 Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 3:58 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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And who needs 4 pairs of the same scissors!?! The only different looking ones are those neon yellow ones.
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| KentPS wrote: |
...or the PO envied the terrorists' bus in "Back to the Future".  |
| mukluk wrote: |
| He's fine, just waiting for the dragon in winklepickers to move out of his lane. |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:27 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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| 67ctbug wrote: |
| And who needs 4 pairs of the same scissors!?! The only different looking ones are those neon yellow ones. |
actually...they are all different. You just can't see what the difference is. While I would never use a pegboard ......I do have six pairs of scissors. Two are exactly the same.
But one of those is tagged to cut ONLY fine cloth (specifically screen printing mesh of 305 threads per inch and up....its expensive), the other is for general cutting of crap......then there are the Fiskers soft touch.....which can cut anything from plastic to tin......titanium nitride plated blades too......then my short handled, short tipped for intricate work like gaskets......my pinking shears.....like those yellow ones in the picture but mine are nicer.
Then my 2" long, gold plated Genger thread cutting scissors. $40....and so razor sharp I have niipped myself on occasion. Nice for cutting magnet winding wires and stainless threads.
Yes.....its sad ahout Sears. They actually were the first to produce a digital, touchscreen based complete catalog back in about 1990-1991....looking forward to non store based sales. I was involved around the fringes of the design while working as a designer in Atlanta right after I got out of college.
They spent millions. The software and design companies involved produced cutting edge effects and techniques.....but at the time....graphic design and interface technology was moving so fast.....that every two months.....what had already been created was out of date.
They gave up in 1993. They should have waited to start. They would have been ahead. I have seen dozens of companies back in that time period go out of business spending money chasing the digitization genie in the early days of it....and the Internet.
In search of sales dollars.....Sears first dropped goods quality ....with their house brands. Then they dropped house brands......and then reduced all quality of all goods.
At some point they had no more or less to offer ...quality or range......than lots of other stores.
The model to be....the be everything store was what became outdated first.
Many marketing studies have already shown that if they would have cut themselves down by about 50% in scale......only offer what it is you are the very best known for and can do top notch......they would probably have survived.
Those items would be.....the Levis store. I still buy my jeans there because they have the best range and you can try them on.
Anything Craftsman.....but actually keep the quality up......and the warranty and repair centers....something no one but snap-on has.
Housewares....and keep the quality up.
Sears tire and battery.
All else....clothing, shoes, furntiture, appliances, electronics.......they cannot compete. They can never be cheap enough and warranting crap quality is a losing battle.
Make the stores 1/4 the size and back to free standing....and they may have survived with the items listed above. Specialize and be the best at it.....warranty and service first. Ray
Last edited by raygreenwood on Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:32 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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coad 
Samba Scapegoat
Joined: September 12, 2002
Posts: 7552
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 4:27 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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| 67ctbug wrote: |
| And who needs 4 pairs of the same scissors!?! The only different looking ones are those neon yellow ones. |
Not the same. SAE, Metric, BSW (British Standard Whitworth), and BSF (British Standard Fine). He must work on MG's.
You'd know this shit if you hung out at someplace cool like Garage Journal. |
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67ctbug
Samba Member
Joined: January 24, 2016
Posts: 3624
Location: CT
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:24 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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^^^^^
 How can you tell all that from a photo of scissors!?! I didn't see that photo in the garage forum?? Unless I'm not catching sarcasm(it's typed you really can't tell). What I did see though was on page 3 somebody stole a photo of a Hazet tool board from thesamba.
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'67 Beetle L41
'74 Westfalia
'69 Plymouth "Adam-12"
'63 Ragtop
'73 914
'72 Dodge Wrecker
Go Cubs!
World Series Champions 2016
| KentPS wrote: |
| ...or the PO envied the terrorists' bus in "Back to the Future". |
| mukluk wrote: |
| He's fine, just waiting for the dragon in winklepickers to move out of his lane. |
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79SuperVert
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2002
Posts: 9758
Location: Elizabeth, NJ & La Isla Del Encanto
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 5:53 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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Sad if they go. We bought a stove from them recently, and a tile cutter, and got good prices and quality products. They also have been selling Lands End products for the past few years, and those are quality goods, too.
I feel better about going to Sears than to a Home Depot or a Harbor Freight, but the latter stores are closer to me and so I usually go there before going to a Sears.
I understand that what has allowed Sears to last this long, is the value of their extensive property holdings. I'm told that is their biggest asset by far.
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Cali_Army_Guy
Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2015
Posts: 2094
Location: Stockton, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 6:33 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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Meh. Never cared for Sears. Besides, now that there's Amazon there's no need to leave the house and deal with the awful human population.
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Zundfolge1432
Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2004
Posts: 12468
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 7:40 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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what's wrong with having your tools organized? The outline around the tool is called shadow board. Idea is to identify missing tools and identify by shape. This is widely used in military and Fortune 500 companies and dates back to a program called continuous improvement. It's meant to speed up production by placing everything within easy reach of the operator, this also is a form of standardization as multiple work stations can be configured the same so that that people can be moved around without wasting time trying to figure where things are.
About Sears my sister worked there in mid 70s and get this. The sales jobs came with medical benefits and pension. I liked the place and spent my time going through the record section, as in 33rpm vinyl. My mother ordered all our clothes from the catalog. They also sold gasoline and if you got a fill up and all 3 numbers came up the same it was free. That's right kids less than 10 bucks to fill a car. They had it all including rebuilt Vw engines. Yes you could order engines from the catalog as well as most of the consumable parts if you were a DIY type. I always liked their policy on tools and recently bought a 1/2 inch drive ratchet at estate sale for 3 dollars, it did not work. Sears replaced no questions asked with new. RIP Sears we will miss you.
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 8:20 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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Shadow boarding is alao seriously overused totally....stupidly... .in "5S" processes gone mad in a great many engineering based companies I go into....so much so that it actually is a detraction to efficiency, changeover time and ergonomics.
The misuse is where it gets its negative connotations. Otherwise.....when used as a general organisation and storage tool its superb. Ray |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 8:26 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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| 67ctbug wrote: |
^^^^^
How can you tell all that from a photo of scissors!?! I didn't see that photo in the garage forum?? Unless I'm not catching sarcasm(it's typed you really can't tell). What I did see though was on page 3 somebody stole a photo of a Hazet tool board from thesamba. |
All of the british and metric crap....he's just funnin you. But from the picture....unless its just a really poor picture.......the first and third Orange handled ones....have black teflon coated blades. I would suspect the first one in line the one that never cuts shit that will nick the blades (that is how ai would do it). The second one is "pinking shears"....used for cutting cloth for anything from upholstery work to sewing. The last two...long and short of the same type with non teflon coated blades.
Whoever's picture that is....does a lot of fabric and pattern work. May be from an upholstery shop.
Ray |
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TheDon
Samba Member
Joined: July 14, 2005
Posts: 498
Location: Windermere
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 8:30 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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I grew up using craftsman tools and thats all I really own. I only bought made in the USA tools and when that became difficult or impossible at the store I would just buy from sellers on garage journal or find what I can at estate sales.
Sears did this to themselves, they could have been amazon.com but I guess these things happen for a reason
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KTPhil
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 34021
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Thu Jan 05, 2017 11:07 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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It's not just Sears. In fact, they are the last survivor of a slew of similar "one stop" stores. Sears, JCPenneys, Montgomery Ward ("Monkey Ward"), and several other minor players.
The competition started with K-Mart and a slew of other stores (Gemco, Fedco, Macys, others), and got hypercompetetive with Wal-Mart, and they just could not compete.
So I guess it is inevitable. Still sad. |
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Zundfolge1432
Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2004
Posts: 12468
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 5:28 am Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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| raygreenwood wrote: |
Shadow boarding is alao seriously overused totally....stupidly... .in "5S" processes gone mad in a great many engineering based companies I go into....so much so that it actually is a detraction to efficiency, changeover time and ergonomics.
The misuse is where it gets its negative connotations. Otherwise.....when used as a general organisation and storage tool its superb. Ray |
Looks like you might have seen this school of thought before. Perhaps you are acquainted with Taylorism,six sigma,lean management and other flavor of the month corporate control tools. What it all boils down to is working the the shit out of fewer people to improve the bottom line. |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 8:23 am Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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| Zundfolge1432 wrote: |
| raygreenwood wrote: |
Shadow boarding is alao seriously overused totally....stupidly... .in "5S" processes gone mad in a great many engineering based companies I go into....so much so that it actually is a detraction to efficiency, changeover time and ergonomics.
The misuse is where it gets its negative connotations. Otherwise.....when used as a general organisation and storage tool its superb. Ray |
Looks like you might have seen this school of thought before. Perhaps you are acquainted with Taylorism,six sigma,lean management and other flavor of the month corporate control tools. What it all boils down to is working the the shit out of fewer people to improve the bottom line. |
your last sentence.....would make the perfect T-shirt slogan for when I go into painfully....destructively lean......customer facilities. Like this......
"(Insert company logo)......."what it all boils down to is working the shit out of fewer people to improve the bottom line"
The five dots between the logo and the slogan are important for effect. Underneeth it.....a graphic of a coiled up whip......
Ray |
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super74beetle
Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2007
Posts: 97
Location: DEtroit, Michigan
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 9:44 am Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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I have a large Sears store less than 2 miles from me and have for my entire life. I was in it maybe 2 years ago for some tools.
One of the things I always liked about it was it had entry doors on all 4 sides. You can park nearest the department you are going to shop in, no need to park far away and use the same, single door that other large stores have. Tools at the South doors, clothing at East doors, auto repair at West doors etc.. This saved walking through the entire store to get to one thing.
When I was a kid (I'm 58 now) the Sears store had a full-service candy counter staffed continuously. At that counter they also made freshly roasted Cashew peanuts and there was nothing like the aroma when they were being cooked. I'm told the candy counter is now gone.
I now mostly drive past the Sears to go farther to Home Depot or Lowes. I know that HD and Lowes have everything I need around the house and I know where it is in the store. No need to go to Sears now, unfortunately. I do hate having to go in the one set of doors and exit out the set at the other end of the stores but that's the way it is now.
I've had Sears, Hudson's, Montgomery Ward, Arlans, J.C. Penny, Kresge's, A&P, Neisner's, and probably a few more I forgot all within a few miles of me all my life.
Makes me want to go to the Jack-In-The-Box...oh hell, that's a cellphone shop now.
Progress I suppose but I sometimes long for the old stores.
Dennis |
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raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21520
Location: Oklahoma City
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:16 am Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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Oddly....I got a 40 page Montgomery Ward catalog in the mail on Wednesday 
I thought they were totally gone...and physically they are. I had not even realized they were strictly an online store. Its been so longsince I even paid any attention to the name.
http://www.wards.com/custserv/custserv.jsp?pageName=retailstores
Ray |
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KTPhil
Samba Member
Joined: April 06, 2006
Posts: 34021
Location: Conejo Valley, CA
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:46 am Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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Radio Shack works that way, too. Online you can still order stuff, but the last of the stores closed this month in our area.
Maybe that's how some brands will survive? Maybe they become a segment inside Amazon, who seems to have the best supply and delivery processes. Amazon becomes the mall, and others become "department stores"? |
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Sharp64
Samba Member
Joined: August 27, 2015
Posts: 5304
Location: Central Florida
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 10:56 am Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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| VOLKSWAGNUT wrote: |
Sears Roebuck and Co.. has no one to blame but them selves.. and the millions that had no loyalty and decided to feed the Walton family and other mass supply outlets..
Sears did price themselves right out of business and will die as the generations that knew them the best and the way there were... die as well.
Sad.. the Sears with their BIG catalogs were some of the best in their day..
Im one.. that would rather spend a little more.. than to fight the people and shop at Wallhellmart and the like.. avoid it as best I can..
Its simply another sad demise of great American companies..
If you wont support something.... most times.. it simply goes away..
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I've been preaching the same thing for years. I avoid Walmart at nearly all costs if I can. Unfortunately, I also don't really shop Sears much either excepting the outlet sometimes. I did wander through one a couple of weeks ago but it's just depressing nowadays.
I think Sears has had issues for years. While they had a great reputation for Craftsman and Kenmore, unfortunately they were also expensive. Or at least perceived as such. I did have one bad experience with them years ago when I called to get an estimate for a fence. They came out and literally were like 5 times higher than the quote I got from someone else. The Sears salesman kept trying to tell me his fence would last twice as long as the competitors. When I asked if it was 5x as much shouldn't it last 5 times as long he just stared blankly at me.....
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Cusser
Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006
Posts: 31379
Location: Hot Arizona
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 12:52 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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I actually have bought some stuff from Sears in the past 15 years, they are only 1.5 miles away from me (Paradise Valley Mall). And for a time they had the tool shop at Thunderbird & Tatum, even closer.
So I bought (tool shop) refurbished 19.2 volt cordless drill set, fast charge, 2 batteries (NiCad). After a few years batteries can't hold a charge longer than a couple of days. Worst thing is the drill chucks, not a Jacobs chuck, and hand tightened, they always loosen. On one I replaced the chuck with a key-type Jacobs chuck from Harbor freight, better now. Best thing is one kit included a stubby drill, handy.
In 2005 I bought a $900 lawn tractor from local Sears, was supposed to be delivered from the Prescott branch, I chose a delivery day on the computer. Two days before that, they said their trucks were full and no one wanted to work overtime, so we rented a trailer and picked it up ourselves. I've learned to be my own mechanic on that, Sears charges like $100 for an on-site looksee, and gives a repair estimate.
Previous to that I bought a $180 lawn mower from Sears, had it refurbished by them at their set price (about $80), now have learned to be my own mechanic. I think I bought that before Internet and liked that parts lists were pretty complete.
About a decade ago I bought a $100 tile saw there (was seduced by Craftsman name), didn't like the plastic "fence", hoped it was some space age material. So even though I was being careful with that, it broke in 5 minutes. I swapped that for the last one there, even lubed the end to try to prolong its life, that broke within 1/2 hour, got my refund. Bought a tile saw from Home Depot for $100 that has been used for like 4 rooms and kitchen counter on same blade, plus water level can be checked and added without taking the guard off like on the Sears one.
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crofty
Judas of the North
Joined: August 09, 2000
Posts: 19672
Location: Land of Whine and Phonies
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 1:10 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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| KTPhil wrote: |
OSH carried them for a while, too.
One of the draws of buying Sears/Craftsman was the easy replacement parts access. Order online, and pick up at a local parts-only shop. They often sold refurbished power tools there, too. Great deals and quick service. I expect those outlets to close now.
Sad. |
Still do. They are now owned by Lowes btw.
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c21darrel
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Joined: January 22, 2009
Posts: 8211
Location: San Dimas
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| Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2017 1:19 pm Post subject: Re: Sears Circling the Drain |
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I worked for Sears in around 1980. I worked at the Parts and repair Center in Covina. It was the place people could come buy replacement parts for their washing machines and anything else Sears sold. We sent out 30-40 repair guys in their trucks to do the repairs at peoples homes. Most of the techs back then were in their 50-60s and had been there 25+ years...only a few guys in their 20's. Even though it was Sears it was very much a mom & pop type operation. They let me park my Karmann Ghia on a sidewalk right next to the shipping/Receiving door instead of out in the parking lot ( I was the whole Shipping and Receiving department lol). Even back then I could see the writing on the wall and quit after 8 months or so. I think the building is a dance studio now.
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