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UK Luke 72 Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011 Posts: 2867 Location: Little Britain
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:59 am Post subject: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Finally some progress on these builds so here goes.
Used AS41 line bored first over and thrust cut. Hoover can oilway mod
94mm AA Slipper skirts 'B'
AA stock length cylinders
CB 82mm crank
Forged lightened flywheel
Scat HD gland nut
Kennedy stage 1 and daiken disc
CB 5.4" H beams with 5/16 ARP2000 bolts
Web 86b on EP12 billet with Scat lightweight lifters with grooved oilways
CB adjustable straight cuts
Silver line double thrust cam bearings
Silver line mains and rod bearings
Shadek 26mm oil pump
Mofoco 42x37 050, hand ported (wedge) and run by a friend in his VW sportsman class last year... Freshened up for this build
50cc chambers
New valves lapped in
Scat retainers and keepers gapped
Bugpack 1.4:1 rockers and shafts
Stateside vw single springs @1.50" 111lbs @0.550” 263lbs
Smith Bros aluminium pushrods
Jaycee tubes
1 5/8" sidewinder
Shooting for 0.050” deck for ~10.8:1 Cr if that doesn't play ball I'll put an 86C in and dual springs
I think the ports may be a little large but after years of this, that, houses, motorbikes, life yada yada its time I just got something built
Pics incoming once I work out how to host on here...
As always thoughts, comments and suggestions all welcome
Luke |
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c.ruber Samba Member
Joined: January 23, 2005 Posts: 634 Location: Mid TN
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:06 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Very much like my engine, but I think if you are gonna run it daily your compression ratio is a little too high. I run my CR at 9.6:1, with 93 octane and running my IDAs a little rich. I don't drive my car daily, but do enjoy the power it makes. _________________ ...and progress is not intelligently planned... |
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UK Luke 72 Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011 Posts: 2867 Location: Little Britain
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:11 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Yeah its gonna get built and we'll find out... Crank trigger and then fuel injection will look after me hopefully it'll be built up and run in with carbs and a distributor then converted. |
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Alstrup Samba Member
Joined: July 12, 2007 Posts: 7183 Location: Videbaek Denmark
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:02 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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1. 10,8 and the 86b is pushing it, even on V power. Dish the pistons and go back to 10-1. Or cut the heads a little more to 11-1 and go 86C
2. When the ports are on the large side you want to advance the cam a little to aid in keeping good flow in the mix. 2 degrees does wonders. But if the ports really are wedge port size and volume, I would swop the intakes with 44 mm and of course correct the bowl and no more. It depends a lot on the port volume. For instance CB Wedge ports ans 42 mm inlet simply does not work well for anything but a lot of rpm. (Unless you go turbo, then it is a totally different ball game.)
If you are in doubt take a look at the CB mini wedge and also the Tims stage II. The port volume must be no more than that or you start to loose both power and especially torque in the driving rpm.
T |
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UK Luke 72 Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011 Posts: 2867 Location: Little Britain
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:31 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Thanks T I was hoping you'd see this,
I guess I won't know for sure until mock up what the CR actually comes out at so until then I won't do anything...
I like the idea of 86c more than dropping CR for the 86b though |
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ALB Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2008 Posts: 3480 Location: beautiful suburban Wet Coast of Canada
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:45 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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You mentioned that it'll be driven daily- does that mean to work? How far? What kind of traffic? _________________ On a lifelong mission to prove (much to my wife's dismay) that Immaturity is Forever!! |
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Bad bug Samba Member
Joined: March 11, 2006 Posts: 1119 Location: Jamaica
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:47 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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I will be doing a oxyboxer for daily driving in my car with this same cam with only 9.5:1 compression. |
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UK Luke 72 Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011 Posts: 2867 Location: Little Britain
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:33 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Yeah sometimes to work, 2 miles away with very little traffic. Down to the shops, Santa Pod etc etc..
I have other cars so it's not a problem to have this off the road at all. Equally if it is a bit of a dog to drive with the wedged heads I can afford to get it back in the garage and fix it.
I want it to rip from idle up... Thinking perhaps the 86c isn't the best idea..
Belzona in the ports maybe |
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jfats808 Samba Member
Joined: December 10, 2007 Posts: 5022 Location: oahu hawaii
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Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 7:33 pm Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Alstrup wrote: |
1. 10,8 and the 86b is pushing it, even on V power. Dish the pistons and go back to 10-1. Or cut the heads a little more to 11-1 and go 86C
2. When the ports are on the large side you want to advance the cam a little to aid in keeping good flow in the mix. 2 degrees does wonders. But if the ports really are wedge port size and volume, I would swop the intakes with 44 mm and of course correct the bowl and no more. It depends a lot on the port volume. For instance CB Wedge ports ans 42 mm inlet simply does not work well for anything but a lot of rpm. (Unless you go turbo, then it is a totally different ball game.)
If you are in doubt take a look at the CB mini wedge and also the Tims stage II. The port volume must be no more than that or you start to loose both power and especially torque in the driving rpm.
T |
X2. 11.2/3 on 92 pump gas on the 86c. It still amazes me how cool the engine runs. _________________ 2276 IDA's 86C 11-1 DD !
2017 48 Trijet DRLA's W125
Rockstar Suzuki wrote: |
You might as well put 10 year build in your bullshit sig, as it will NEVER run. Also your a dick |
You can always learn something new, even from a fool.
Check your oil levels routinely! |
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UK Luke 72 Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011 Posts: 2867 Location: Little Britain
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 12:12 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Is there any danger of the 86c being a bit limp at the bottom and will it be fine with the 15/8" exhaust? |
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richierich Samba Member
Joined: December 23, 2004 Posts: 888
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 5:10 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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UK Luke 72 wrote: |
Is there any danger of the 86c being a bit limp at the bottom and will it be fine with the 15/8" exhaust? |
I'm running an 86c on the street and i don't think its limp at all lower down....love it. Motor is a 2387 with 10.5 -1 and i run it on V-Power Plus with no problem... |
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andy198712 Samba Member
Joined: December 05, 2010 Posts: 1209 Location: Cornwall - UK
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 6:54 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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I have a 2110 with 9.3:1 and i run the 86B, it pulls hard from idle... i run super fuel but doubt i need to.
used to use it daily and was fine, commute was 5 miles each way, but 70 mile weekend commutes in it too and was fine, and that later were with a 34pict 3 which was dog shit.
on GSXR ITBs its fine.
i run 1mm deck.
power feels pretty linear to be honest, IE strong everywhere! _________________
Alstrup wrote: |
I like 5,5inchers in the rear at least. |
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theDrew Samba Member
Joined: May 17, 2011 Posts: 1155 Location: Camas, WA
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 9:28 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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that thing will rip! enjoy it.
If you dont have your exhaust yet....pm me, I'm selling my sidewinder setup. _________________ Turbo 2276 MS3X build http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=673125
1985 Vanagon Campmobile w/ 2005 EJ25 |
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ALB Samba Member
Joined: August 05, 2008 Posts: 3480 Location: beautiful suburban Wet Coast of Canada
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 9:54 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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According to James Beahm's header size chart, 1 5/8" is good to 6450rpm on a 2276, so it's borderline for the 86B definitely not enough for the 86C. _________________ On a lifelong mission to prove (much to my wife's dismay) that Immaturity is Forever!! |
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UK Luke 72 Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011 Posts: 2867 Location: Little Britain
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 11:21 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Cheers Richie rich, good feedback. I think tbh I'll keep the 86b... Idk, I guess it depends what these guys say about the heads, deck, etc etc...
The parts listed are all sat on the dining room floor lol, I have the exhaust although thanks for the offer... Good point on the sizing being on the small sized for an 86c...
Ah too many decisions!
Good to hear you're still going well Andy... I may need to ghetto mod a 34pict3 in the same way you did to run mine in on... Don't fancy buying IDAs just for a can burn |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 1:07 pm Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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I wood doo some chamber work,, a lot of chamber work to those heads,(those chambers leave a lot to be disired) and bring deck to about .040 and around 10.~10.5 cr. and use a 30 mm oil pump as you are sending more oil to the heads with the hoover vac can mod, so you need more flow. make sure the geo is right ( probably have to cut the rocker blocks on the shafts to lower the rockers around .050") to get proper geo with lash caps. and make sure the springs can handle the real time lift, not the card math lift as most of those type rockers are more ratio than you think and there also a variable ratio. more lift more ratio, and rockers that are too high have even more ratio....and harder on guides too. good luck and have fun. |
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UK Luke 72 Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011 Posts: 2867 Location: Little Britain
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:05 pm Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Right, pictures...
The first machinist I used did the full flowing... A little different but as far as I can tell should still work well.
Crank, adjustable straight cut gears, flywheel, Smith bros pushrods and single springs.
VW Speedshop crank trigger kit
Heads, stripped and one vapour blasted
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UK Luke 72 Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011 Posts: 2867 Location: Little Britain
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:09 pm Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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More of the heads
AA Slippers
Web cam 86b. EP12 billet so not pre clearanced
1 5/8"
Headstuds... Will stick to 8mm OG headstuds I think
Rods, 5.4", VW journal
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andy198712 Samba Member
Joined: December 05, 2010 Posts: 1209 Location: Cornwall - UK
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Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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Nice parts!
When you cut the push rods, measure the internal step (you'll see what I mean when you look) make sure that's deep enough for the tip other wise you won't seat the tip and can't get it out..... learnt that one
So drill the step deeper if needed (may not need to) _________________
Alstrup wrote: |
I like 5,5inchers in the rear at least. |
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UK Luke 72 Samba Member
Joined: September 07, 2011 Posts: 2867 Location: Little Britain
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Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 3:58 am Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily |
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I think I'll take the pushrods up to Danny at Reichspeed for cutting, its not a job I enjoy in the slightest and he only charges £30 for the lot... Point noted though, I remember you saying about the one you knackered
Next time you need any machine work check him out... First guy had his issues, Danny's was perfect. |
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