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2276/86b beetle daily
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 3:59 am    Post subject: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Finally some progress on these builds so here goes.

Used AS41 line bored first over and thrust cut. Hoover can oilway mod
94mm AA Slipper skirts 'B'
AA stock length cylinders
CB 82mm crank
Forged lightened flywheel
Scat HD gland nut
Kennedy stage 1 and daiken disc
CB 5.4" H beams with 5/16 ARP2000 bolts
Web 86b on EP12 billet with Scat lightweight lifters with grooved oilways
CB adjustable straight cuts
Silver line double thrust cam bearings
Silver line mains and rod bearings
Shadek 26mm oil pump

Mofoco 42x37 050, hand ported (wedge) and run by a friend in his VW sportsman class last year... Freshened up for this build
50cc chambers
New valves lapped in
Scat retainers and keepers gapped
Bugpack 1.4:1 rockers and shafts
Stateside vw single springs @1.50" 111lbs @0.550” 263lbs
Smith Bros aluminium pushrods
Jaycee tubes
1 5/8" sidewinder

Shooting for 0.050” deck for ~10.8:1 Cr if that doesn't play ball I'll put an 86C in and dual springs Very Happy

I think the ports may be a little large but after years of this, that, houses, motorbikes, life yada yada its time I just got something built Very Happy


Pics incoming once I work out how to host on here...

As always thoughts, comments and suggestions all welcome Smile

Luke
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c.ruber
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:06 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Very much like my engine, but I think if you are gonna run it daily your compression ratio is a little too high. I run my CR at 9.6:1, with 93 octane and running my IDAs a little rich. I don't drive my car daily, but do enjoy the power it makes.
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 4:11 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Yeah its gonna get built and we'll find out... Crank trigger and then fuel injection will look after me hopefully Smile it'll be built up and run in with carbs and a distributor then converted.
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Alstrup
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:02 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

1. 10,8 and the 86b is pushing it, even on V power. Dish the pistons and go back to 10-1. Or cut the heads a little more to 11-1 and go 86C
2. When the ports are on the large side you want to advance the cam a little to aid in keeping good flow in the mix. 2 degrees does wonders. But if the ports really are wedge port size and volume, I would swop the intakes with 44 mm and of course correct the bowl and no more. It depends a lot on the port volume. For instance CB Wedge ports ans 42 mm inlet simply does not work well for anything but a lot of rpm. (Unless you go turbo, then it is a totally different ball game.)
If you are in doubt take a look at the CB mini wedge and also the Tims stage II. The port volume must be no more than that or you start to loose both power and especially torque in the driving rpm.

T
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 5:31 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Thanks T I was hoping you'd see this,
I guess I won't know for sure until mock up what the CR actually comes out at so until then I won't do anything...
I like the idea of 86c more than dropping CR for the 86b though Twisted Evil
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ALB
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:45 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

You mentioned that it'll be driven daily- does that mean to work? How far? What kind of traffic?
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Bad bug
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:47 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

I will be doing a oxyboxer for daily driving in my car with this same cam with only 9.5:1 compression.
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 11:33 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Yeah sometimes to work, 2 miles away with very little traffic. Down to the shops, Santa Pod etc etc..

I have other cars so it's not a problem to have this off the road at all. Equally if it is a bit of a dog to drive with the wedged heads I can afford to get it back in the garage and fix it.

I want it to rip from idle up... Thinking perhaps the 86c isn't the best idea..

Belzona in the ports maybe Very Happy
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jfats808
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 14, 2017 7:33 pm    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Alstrup wrote:
1. 10,8 and the 86b is pushing it, even on V power. Dish the pistons and go back to 10-1. Or cut the heads a little more to 11-1 and go 86C
2. When the ports are on the large side you want to advance the cam a little to aid in keeping good flow in the mix. 2 degrees does wonders. But if the ports really are wedge port size and volume, I would swop the intakes with 44 mm and of course correct the bowl and no more. It depends a lot on the port volume. For instance CB Wedge ports ans 42 mm inlet simply does not work well for anything but a lot of rpm. (Unless you go turbo, then it is a totally different ball game.)
If you are in doubt take a look at the CB mini wedge and also the Tims stage II. The port volume must be no more than that or you start to loose both power and especially torque in the driving rpm.

T


X2. 11.2/3 on 92 pump gas on the 86c. It still amazes me how cool the engine runs.
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 12:12 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Is there any danger of the 86c being a bit limp at the bottom and will it be fine with the 15/8" exhaust?
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richierich
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 5:10 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

UK Luke 72 wrote:
Is there any danger of the 86c being a bit limp at the bottom and will it be fine with the 15/8" exhaust?


I'm running an 86c on the street and i don't think its limp at all lower down....love it. Motor is a 2387 with 10.5 -1 and i run it on V-Power Plus with no problem...
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andy198712
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 6:54 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

I have a 2110 with 9.3:1 and i run the 86B, it pulls hard from idle... i run super fuel but doubt i need to.

used to use it daily and was fine, commute was 5 miles each way, but 70 mile weekend commutes in it too and was fine, and that later were with a 34pict 3 which was dog shit.
on GSXR ITBs its fine.

i run 1mm deck.

power feels pretty linear to be honest, IE strong everywhere!
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theDrew
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 9:28 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

that thing will rip! enjoy it.

If you dont have your exhaust yet....pm me, I'm selling my sidewinder setup.
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 9:54 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

According to James Beahm's header size chart, 1 5/8" is good to 6450rpm on a 2276, so it's borderline for the 86B definitely not enough for the 86C.
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 11:21 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Cheers Richie rich, good feedback. I think tbh I'll keep the 86b... Idk, I guess it depends what these guys say about the heads, deck, etc etc...

The parts listed are all sat on the dining room floor lol, I have the exhaust although thanks for the offer... Good point on the sizing being on the small sized for an 86c...

Ah too many decisions!

Good to hear you're still going well Andy... I may need to ghetto mod a 34pict3 in the same way you did to run mine in on... Don't fancy buying IDAs just for a can burn Very Happy
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mark tucker
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 1:07 pm    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

I wood doo some chamber work,, a lot of chamber work to those heads,(those chambers leave a lot to be disired) and bring deck to about .040 and around 10.~10.5 cr. and use a 30 mm oil pump as you are sending more oil to the heads with the hoover vac can mod, so you need more flow. make sure the geo is right ( probably have to cut the rocker blocks on the shafts to lower the rockers around .050") to get proper geo with lash caps. and make sure the springs can handle the real time lift, not the card math lift as most of those type rockers are more ratio than you think and there also a variable ratio. more lift more ratio, and rockers that are too high have even more ratio....and harder on guides too. good luck and have fun.
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:05 pm    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Right, pictures...

The first machinist I used did the full flowing... A little different but as far as I can tell should still work well.
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Crank, adjustable straight cut gears, flywheel, Smith bros pushrods and single springs.
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VW Speedshop crank trigger kit
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Heads, stripped and one vapour blasted
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:09 pm    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

More of the heads
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AA Slippers
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Web cam 86b. EP12 billet so not pre clearanced
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1 5/8"
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Headstuds... Will stick to 8mm OG headstuds I think
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Rods, 5.4", VW journal
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andy198712
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2017 3:44 pm    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

Nice parts!
When you cut the push rods, measure the internal step (you'll see what I mean when you look) make sure that's deep enough for the tip other wise you won't seat the tip and can't get it out..... learnt that one
So drill the step deeper if needed (may not need to)
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UK Luke 72
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2017 3:58 am    Post subject: Re: 2276/86b beetle daily Reply with quote

I think I'll take the pushrods up to Danny at Reichspeed for cutting, its not a job I enjoy in the slightest and he only charges £30 for the lot... Point noted though, I remember you saying about the one you knackered Very Happy

Next time you need any machine work check him out... First guy had his issues, Danny's was perfect.
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