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Official Fuel injection questions thread
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beanlover
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 20, 2019 6:18 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

busdaddy wrote:
unitedracing wrote:
I've said it a hundred times lately, but do you know how old ALL the fuel and vacuum lines are? If not ,replace them before doing anything! A fuel line that "looks" fine means nothing. When I bought mine, it had vacuum leaks at the intake to plenum hoses on the intake manifold. Also injector seals were rock hard and leaking and the gasket/insulator combo at the head to intake connection point were cracked and leaking. I could go on haha

Exactly!, 40+ years of neglect requires major remediation, the smoke machine helps with the job, but in the end every rubber part and gasket is suspect, change them all and be done with it for years to come.


Thanks to you both for repeating this even though you've said it so much! Being brand new to the FI bugs I haven't paid any attention to information related to them until now so I haven't seen this.

Because of this I'm going to make this my next step with the engine...thank you!! Makes complete sense but it's not something I thought of because my other, carbureted bug doesn't suffer from extreme vacuum sensitivity (and I replaced the few lines it actually had already).
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Ithomson
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PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 4:01 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

Howdy folks!

Does anyone have a list of hose/pipe diameters and lengths for the l-Jet engine setup? My 76 is in need of a few replacements including the pipes running from the intake boot to the engine (crank case breather) Many thanks.
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Mr. Nice Guy
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 8:06 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

I have a question for you fine airheads...

I have a '79 Convertible / FI...

Has anyone successfully replaced the distributor with an electronic/point-less version? If so, which model?
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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 10:23 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

Mr. Nice Guy wrote:
I have a question for you fine airheads...

I have a '79 Convertible / FI...

Has anyone successfully replaced the distributor with an electronic/point-less version? If so, which model?

The short answer is yes, some have gotten away with it, but some have experienced mystery issues that only going back to the points solved.
Long answer is found here: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=700644&highlight=waveform
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 10:26 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

Ithomson wrote:
Howdy folks!

Does anyone have a list of hose/pipe diameters and lengths for the l-Jet engine setup? My 76 is in need of a few replacements including the pipes running from the intake boot to the engine (crank case breather) Many thanks.

I'm sorry to say there's no "list" I'm aware of, most owners go to their FLAPS and look over the wall of radiator hoses for something that can be adapted.
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AlmostHeavenWV_VW Premium Member
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 1:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

busdaddy wrote:
Ithomson wrote:
Howdy folks!

Does anyone have a list of hose/pipe diameters and lengths for the l-Jet engine setup? My 76 is in need of a few replacements including the pipes running from the intake boot to the engine (crank case breather) Many thanks.

I'm sorry to say there's no "list" I'm aware of, most owners go to their FLAPS and look over the wall of radiator hoses for something that can be adapted.


Would this be helpful to you?
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=600276
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mrmdls
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 8:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

Looking for some thoughts on an issue I've noticed with my 75 bug at idle. Long story short, the car had sat since 1992 before I got it running about a month ago. Still have to go thru the brakes prior to getting it on the road.

My bug will start right up when it's cold, I have to give it a little throttle, for a couple seconds before it settles down to idle, otherwise she will stall. If I don't give it some throttle when starting cold, it'll stall 3 or 4 times when I attempt to start it before it settles down to idle. My idle speed is 1000 rpm.

When the engine is hot, it'll also idle at 1000 rpm, I can bring the throttle up, and release it, and it'll still idle at 1000 rpm. Once the engine is warm and I let it sit for about 10 minutes or so, if I start it the idle will jump up to 1200 rpm and if I bring the throttle up and release it, it'll still idle at 1200 rpm.

I took a look at the cylinder head temp sensor, and the previous owner had broken/cracked the tapped area where the sensor was located by the cylinder head at cylinder #4. He had run a thermocoupled wire for the sensor to a connection on the flange by the heat exchange and muffler.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2019 9:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

mrmdls wrote:
Looking for some thoughts on an issue I've noticed with my 75 bug at idle. Long story short, the car had sat since 1992 before I got it running about a month ago. Still have to go thru the brakes prior to getting it on the road.

My bug will start right up when it's cold, I have to give it a little throttle, for a couple seconds before it settles down to idle, otherwise she will stall. If I don't give it some throttle when starting cold, it'll stall 3 or 4 times when I attempt to start it before it settles down to idle. My idle speed is 1000 rpm.

When the engine is hot, it'll also idle at 1000 rpm, I can bring the throttle up, and release it, and it'll still idle at 1000 rpm. Once the engine is warm and I let it sit for about 10 minutes or so, if I start it the idle will jump up to 1200 rpm and if I bring the throttle up and release it, it'll still idle at 1200 rpm.

I took a look at the cylinder head temp sensor, and the previous owner had broken/cracked the tapped area where the sensor was located by the cylinder head at cylinder #4. He had run a thermocoupled wire for the sensor to a connection on the flange by the heat exchange and muffler.


You need to get the head temp sensor repaired, so that it is in the correct spot and working as designed.

Second, you have a vacuum leak.
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mrmdls
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2019 3:54 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

Thank you for the reply VW_Jimbo! You confirmed what I was thinking concerning a vacuum leak. I am thinking that the leak probably is coming from my manifold boots, as I did not replace them when I got her running.

The temp sensor is going to be a bit difficult. The PO totally cracked the tapped area for the sensor in such a way that the area is not usable. I'm thinking I'll have to tap another hole to install the sensor. Any thoughts on another location for the sensor?
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 4:34 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

Spent some time on the bus forums last night, and I believe I found a good location to install the cylinder head temp sensor. The casting on the right side head should be the same, so I should be able to install the sensor on the right side with no issues. I'll be looking at that when I finish work this afternoon.
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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 9:44 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

That will work, anywhere in the rocker box area will do, if you go through into the oily side you'll need some sealer or a copper ring under the sensor.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 9:48 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

mrmdls wrote:
Spent some time on the bus forums last night, and I believe I found a good location to install the cylinder head temp sensor. The casting on the right side head should be the same, so I should be able to install the sensor on the right side with no issues. I'll be looking at that when I finish work this afternoon.


The issue then is the wire harness. And the location would be up against the firewall. Sounds like a hard spot to get into and do a good job. It may be worth it to get a helicoil or a timesert and repair the current location. I have never repaired those threads using that method, so I am unaware of any possible side effects. Like if the sensor would see a cooler or hotter temperature. Just a few thoughts.

If it were me and was in search of the cheapest way. I think that I would drop the engine. Strip it down so that area is available for machining. Either go buy the tools to heliarc and tap it, OR take it a local welder and have them heliarc it. Then tap it myself. Or after having it welded, take it to a machine shop and have them tap it.

If money were no object, and mileage is low on the engine. I would get a set of rebuilt heads for an FI engine.

Good luck!
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mrmdls
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 12:53 pm    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

Thank You busdaddy and VW_Jimbo both of you have given me something to think about before I proceed getting this squared away.

Unfortunately, I don't know the history of the engine before it got parked due to failing a smog test. I do have receipts where the PO used some smog pro's company for a couple of years prior to failing a smog.

Even with this problem with the cylinder head temp sensor, I've been pleasantly suprised by the engine. It has been running quite well for having sat all these years...I have a brand new DP longblock that I was just itching to put in however the way the FI engine seems to be running, that would be such a waste.

I did a little more reading tonight concerning the sensor on the bus forums, and basically with the wire that leads to the sensor (which in my case is not connected because of the damaged area) connecting it to ground will cause the ECU to think the engine is fully warmed up. This would cause or possibly cause a lean condition.

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=578003

edited 10:28pm CST to add link concerning sensor
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:06 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

AlmostHeavenWV_VW wrote:
busdaddy wrote:
Ithomson wrote:
Howdy folks!

Does anyone have a list of hose/pipe diameters and lengths for the l-Jet engine setup? My 76 is in need of a few replacements including the pipes running from the intake boot to the engine (crank case breather) Many thanks.

I'm sorry to say there's no "list" I'm aware of, most owners go to their FLAPS and look over the wall of radiator hoses for something that can be adapted.


Would this be helpful to you?
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=600276


Many thanks, that’s just what I was looking for Smile
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2019 10:44 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

This is the DUMB FI questions thread, right???

So, the 77 just won't idle for at least 10 miles first thing in the a.m. Last time it totally failed we had to send out the ECU for a rebuild. It idled before this.

Is there an actual idle adjustment I can set? Driving with right on gas, left on brake until I can reliably use hand brake and switch back to left on clutch is bothersome at 0530, to say the least.
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2019 11:44 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

unclewede wrote:
This is the DUMB FI questions thread, right???

So, the 77 just won't idle for at least 10 miles first thing in the a.m. Last time it totally failed we had to send out the ECU for a rebuild. It idled before this.

Is there an actual idle adjustment I can set? Driving with right on gas, left on brake until I can reliably use hand brake and switch back to left on clutch is bothersome at 0530, to say the least.


Sounds like the Auxiliary Air Regulator is not doing its job. You need to confirm if it is working.

Remove it from the engine. Be very careful not to damage the hoses. Put it in the freezer. The vane should close almost completely. Then allow it to warm up. It should open to more than half way.

Cold, like just out of the freezer.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Warmed up
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2019 10:46 am    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

VW_Jimbo wrote:
Sounds like the Auxiliary Air Regulator is not doing its job. You need to confirm if it is working.


I was going to come back here today and say "Yes, yes I DID ask, in the FI thread, if I could adjust my way out of a vacuum leak" But maybe the above makes more sense. Would the AAR also make it take 3-5 consecutive start attempts before it really fires in the morning?
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2019 12:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

unclewede wrote:
VW_Jimbo wrote:
Sounds like the Auxiliary Air Regulator is not doing its job. You need to confirm if it is working.


I was going to come back here today and say "Yes, yes I DID ask, in the FI thread, if I could adjust my way out of a vacuum leak" But maybe the above makes more sense. Would the AAR also make it take 3-5 consecutive start attempts before it really fires in the morning?

Maybe, try holding your foot on the gas pedal slightly and see if it starts faster. The AAR simulates that automatically when it's working.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2019 1:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

busdaddy wrote:
unclewede wrote:
VW_Jimbo wrote:
Sounds like the Auxiliary Air Regulator is not doing its job. You need to confirm if it is working.


I was going to come back here today and say "Yes, yes I DID ask, in the FI thread, if I could adjust my way out of a vacuum leak" But maybe the above makes more sense. Would the AAR also make it take 3-5 consecutive start attempts before it really fires in the morning?

Maybe, try holding your foot on the gas pedal slightly and see if it starts faster. The AAR simulates that automatically when it's working.


I pressed the gas to the floor twice and then it at least fired, but didn't stay running for a few attempts. I'm always afraid of flooding a vehicle when I do too much throttle, from my previous days with a troublesome motorcycle. . .
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busdaddy
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2019 2:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Official Fuel injection questions thread Reply with quote

unclewede wrote:
busdaddy wrote:
unclewede wrote:
VW_Jimbo wrote:
Sounds like the Auxiliary Air Regulator is not doing its job. You need to confirm if it is working.


I was going to come back here today and say "Yes, yes I DID ask, in the FI thread, if I could adjust my way out of a vacuum leak" But maybe the above makes more sense. Would the AAR also make it take 3-5 consecutive start attempts before it really fires in the morning?

Maybe, try holding your foot on the gas pedal slightly and see if it starts faster. The AAR simulates that automatically when it's working.


I pressed the gas to the floor twice and then it at least fired, but didn't stay running for a few attempts. I'm always afraid of flooding a vehicle when I do too much throttle, from my previous days with a troublesome motorcycle. . .

Not to the floor, just cracked a little. And pedal application won't flood FI.
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