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Glenn Mr. 010
Joined: December 25, 2001 Posts: 76937 Location: Sneaking up behind you
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Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 3:11 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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This is why I like chromoly pushrods... loose zero. No feeler gauge needed. _________________ Glenn
74 Beetle Specs | 74 Beetle Restoration | 2180cc Engine
"You may not get what you pay for, but you always pay for what you get"
Member #1009
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heimlich VWNOS.com
Joined: November 20, 2016 Posts: 6616 Location: Houston, Texas
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Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 3:37 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Glenn wrote: |
This is why I like chromoly pushrods... loose zero. No feeler gauge needed. |
What? What are used instead? Is there no adjusting? |
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wcfvw69 Samba Purist
Joined: June 10, 2004 Posts: 13389 Location: Arizona
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Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 3:50 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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I also want to pat the OP for a nice write up.
Well done. _________________ Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc
Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.
**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche fuel pumps or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche distributors or I can restore yours** |
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Frodge Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2006 Posts: 1991 Location: Dump
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Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 4:42 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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I don't have chromoly pushrods. My guess is to use the .006 and double check with a .005 and .007. Should the .005 be totally loose with 0 drag? I would think the angle has to be perfect wither way. This is something I would love to be walked through in person once. Then I'd have it. |
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Tim Donahoe Samba Member
Joined: December 08, 2012 Posts: 11740 Location: Redding, CA
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Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 5:05 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Frodge, I corrected my post to mention.006.
You don't need someone to be there with you when using the feeler gauges. Either the .006 goes in the slot, or it doesn't. "A slight drag", is a slight drag. If the .006 fits and the .007 doesn't, then you got it. So, as mentioned, you can actually forget about the slight drag.
Tim _________________ Let's do the Time Warp again!
Richard O'Brien |
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rockerarm Samba Member
Joined: December 16, 2009 Posts: 3552 Location: Los Angeles
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Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 7:00 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Hmmmm. It has been mentioned that a "slight drag" is the standard here. A feeler gauge or a set of them is a basic precision tool. They are not in the same category of a wrench or hammer. If forcing a .007" bade into a .006" clearance results in a damaged tool, shouldn't that raise an internal red flag?
If your replacing your feeler gauges more than your chisels please evaluate your standards. |
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Frodge Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2006 Posts: 1991 Location: Dump
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Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 7:03 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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My point was that you could set your valves to .004 and not be able to get a .007 in. So not being able to get a .007 in doesn't necessarily mean you're at .006. Which is why I would think you should try to get the .005 in and see how it feels. |
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Tim Donahoe Samba Member
Joined: December 08, 2012 Posts: 11740 Location: Redding, CA
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Posted: Mon May 15, 2017 7:31 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Sorry, folks. I corrected my previous post, mentioning a "slight drag" to a slight drag when inserting the .006 feeler blade. Initially, I mentioned it was all good if, after this, not being able to get the .007 feeler blade in.
So let me phrase it more clearly: adjust the valve so that a slight drag is felt when inserting a .006 feeler blade. Then attempt to insert a .007 feeler blade. If the .006 blade fits in, but the .007 doesn't fit in, then it's all good. You're at .006.
And I have never been able to insert a .007 feeler blade into a .006 slot. In fact, how would anyone do that? I suppose you could "cram" the .007 between the valve and the rocker screw, but that would certainly not fall within the definition of "a slight drag".
Tim _________________ Let's do the Time Warp again!
Richard O'Brien |
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Frodge Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2006 Posts: 1991 Location: Dump
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Posted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 4:52 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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I have a question about valve lash in general. Let's say you adjust your valves perfectly. The next time you would do that is in 3000 miles, correct? So my question is, let's say a valve is tightening up, or several are, or one or several are loosening. Is there a way to know this if valves are loosening or tightening (excwpt dropping a valve) in between the time you adjust and the next interval? |
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Zundfolge1432 Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2004 Posts: 12467
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Posted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 5:33 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Frodge wrote: |
I have a question about calve lash in general. Let's say you adjust your valves perfectly. The next time you would do that is in 3000 miles, correct? So my question is, let's say a valve is tightening up, or several are, or one or several are loosening. Is there a way to know this if valves are loosening or tightening (excwpt dropping a valve) in between the time you adjust and the next interval? |
If a valve were tightening up this is a good indicator that it is stretching. When it is weakened enough the head will separate from the stem. If it happens at idle or low speed its bad but is usually repairable. At high speed its catastrophic and the damage is widespread. Valves that loosen between adjustment indicate a soft, worn or improperly heat treated adjuster or a valve tip that is pounded. I was screwed over by a person that adjusted the valves on my bus loose. So loose you could hear it. After a few hundred miles the stems were damaged and I had to run lash caps. There's nothing mysterious about valve adjustment once you've done this a few times its old hat. Tight valves make no noise |
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Frodge Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2006 Posts: 1991 Location: Dump
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 5:01 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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I just adjusted my valves last night myself, first time me doing it alone. Took a while. Some of the slots in the adjusters looks like someone had slipped with maybe too small of a screwdriver. I know this is specific question, but screwdriver tips usually have sizes, is there a specific size that fits in there just right? Just curious, as I don’t have a huge collection. If different size screwdrivers but will gladly pick up the appropriate size if there is one. |
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Cusser Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006 Posts: 31379 Location: Hot Arizona
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 8:34 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Frodge wrote: |
I just adjusted my valves last night myself, first time me doing it alone. Took a while. Some of the slots in the adjusters looks like someone had slipped with maybe too small of a screwdriver. I know this is specific question, but screwdriver tips usually have sizes, is there a specific size that fits in there just right? Just curious, as I don’t have a huge collection. If different size screwdrivers but will gladly pick up the appropriate size if there is one. |
I just happen to have a VW adjustment screw here. So I went out and measured three different brands of good-fitting screwdrivers, one was Stanley brand. True 1/4 inch blade fit well with both those screwdrivers. With Sears Craftsman, both 1/4 and 5/16 inch fit well. Don't take this personally, but length might be an issue with the 5/16 inch screwdriver !
Note that once the locking nut has been loosened, typically the adjustment screw with the slot will screw in or out readily. _________________ 1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297 |
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Frodge Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2006 Posts: 1991 Location: Dump
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 8:49 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Thanks Cuss. A couple of my screws were tight after loosening. I took those out and scrubbed the threads with a toothbrush and kroil. A lot better. I may get a whole new set next time. We’ll see. The thing about the aftermarket is I’ve read they are really soft and don’t hold up. I’m going to try and gently file the edges of the slot next time and really clean them off. First time adjustment for me took too long to get overly perfect with the screw slots. |
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Cusser Samba Member
Joined: October 02, 2006 Posts: 31379 Location: Hot Arizona
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 9:54 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Frodge wrote: |
The thing about the aftermarket is I’ve read they are really soft and don’t hold up. |
I don't know anything about this.
All I know is that the replacement adjuster and locknut set I bought in April (3 of each for $12.50) were Kolb from an Ebay retailer. _________________ 1970 VW (owned since 1972) and 1971 VW Convertible (owned since 1976), second owner of each. The '71 now has the 1835 engine, swapped from the '70. Second owner of each. 1988 Mazda B2200 truck, 1998 Frontier, 2014 Yukon, 2004 Frontier King Cab. All manual transmission except for the Yukon. http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335294 http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/album_page.php?pic_id=335297 |
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Frodge Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2006 Posts: 1991 Location: Dump
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 10:07 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Cusser wrote: |
Frodge wrote: |
The thing about the aftermarket is I’ve read they are really soft and don’t hold up. |
I don't know anything about this.
All I know is that the replacement adjuster and locknut set I bought in April (3 of each for $12.50) were Kolb from an Ebay retailer. |
Just keep your eye on them. I read that the end that contacts the valve stem is too soft and mushrooms. I don’t know about that particular adjuster, but I think the ones on aircooled.net are the closest to oem.
While we are in the subject of heads, do those springs that hold the rockers in ever need to be changed? Or do you change them when they bust? |
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mark tucker Samba Member
Joined: April 08, 2009 Posts: 23937 Location: SHALIMAR ,FLORIDA
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Posted: Sat Jul 07, 2018 3:07 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Ive seen many, too many oe rockers that were coked up and no oil could pass.many thrown away because we couldent get the gally clear of the coked oil. thus the reason for sloting the lifter bores to get more full tyme oil to the rockers&valves. I still dont agree with this adjustment procedure.but you cant fix some things..... and my way is faster eazer and more better. |
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Frodge Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2006 Posts: 1991 Location: Dump
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Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:57 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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What is the correct procedure or solution when you get a tight valve adjustment screw. I’ve seen them get stuck in the rocker assembly making them hard to turn..... |
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Zundfolge1432 Samba Member
Joined: June 13, 2004 Posts: 12467
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Posted: Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:40 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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Frodge wrote: |
What is the correct procedure or solution when you get a tight valve adjustment screw. I’ve seen them get stuck in the rocker assembly making them hard to turn..... |
If it was too tight I’d carefully back it out take it over to a bench vise soak it with Kroil get it moving then reinstall. Things that are stuck like this tells me engine is coked up and or someone is skipping valve adjustment. It’s not a bad idea to just keep a spare set of rockers ready to bolt on. |
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Frodge Samba Member
Joined: October 04, 2006 Posts: 1991 Location: Dump
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Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 7:04 am Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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What do you mean engine is coked up? How do you rectify this? It runs well, so I’m not sure what I need to do. I’ve owned this car since 2005 and I just did a valve adjustment a couple days ago for the first time by myself. I’ve paid mechanics to supposedly do it in the past. I thought the adjustments were done by mileage, no? It takes me a long time to go 3000 miles in this car. Another thing, what if you go to adjust the valves and they don’t need any adjustment? That would mean you’re not turning the screws anyhow to break them free each time. All the valves were very close to perfect. Between .006 and .007. Not sure what would make the adjusters stick. It was maybe 2 or 3 out of the 8.
I am unsure how the heads get lubrication. Does the oil come down the push rod tubes? Does oil go up to the rocker and valves? I know, dumb question. But I have no knowledge. How do those screws get coked? I change my oil and have done adjustments when supposed to be done.
mark tucker wrote: |
Ive seen many, too many oe rockers that were coked up and no oil could pass.many thrown away because we couldent get the gally clear of the coked oil. thus the reason for sloting the lifter bores to get more full tyme oil to the rockers&valves. I still dont agree with this adjustment procedure.but you cant fix some things..... and my way is faster eazer and more better. |
What do you mean the rockers were coked and no oil could pass? Can you explain where? I know, I’m an idiot.
Also, when you lock those nuts down, I snugged them down with my 13mm pretty good while lying on my back. Don’t know how tight to really make them but didn’t want them coming loose.
Finally, are you supposed to change the clips at all that keep the rockers straight? I didn’t really do anything to them when I was in there. |
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67rustavenger Samba Member
Joined: February 24, 2015 Posts: 9767 Location: Oregon
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Posted: Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:16 pm Post subject: Re: Valve adjust easy with pics |
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This is an example of "coke" in an engine. When they get real hot the oil gets cooked into "coke." The "coke is like a heavy carbon deposit. When gets on threads like valve lash adjusters, they get a little hard to turn without breaking the "coke" loose from the threads(turning the adjuster nut with a wrench).
https://www.flickr.com/photos/145859457@N08/42376784895/
BTW not my picture. I hate third party hosting sites when posting on the samba. _________________ I have learned over the years.
Cheap parts are gonna disappoint you.
Buy Once, Cry Once!
There's never enough time to do it right the first time. But there's always enough time to do it thrice.
GFY's Xevin and VW_Jimbo!
Last edited by 67rustavenger on Fri Jul 13, 2018 5:05 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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