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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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 Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 8:02 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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if you are using a 200mm clutch (beetle kit) better go buy a stage 2 clutch and pressure plate.. the 200mm isn't gong to hold back the HP with the heavy weight of a bus..
but fwiw the 228mm stock bay/van clutch has been sufficient for the stock 150~190(stage 1ecu) in my heavier vanagon swap.
the 1.8T will rev happily all day, and it's a far quieter motor (pending what you do for exhaust of course) so it's really not much bother..
on one trip I blew 4th gear 300miles from home.. returned in 3rd gear and had to watch the rpms as it'd like to creep up on me.. engine was/is just fine there..
I am curious to your statement that the passat immobilizer only disables the starter circuit.. as that's a big plus. anyplace to read/verify that.. else just let me/us know once you've got this up running..
thanks.
Dan in Syracuse.
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2017 7:09 pm Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| danfromsyr wrote: |
if you are using a 200mm clutch (beetle kit) better go buy a stage 2 clutch and pressure plate.. the 200mm isn't gong to hold back the HP with the heavy weight of a bus..
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I know, it's not ideal but I've already got this stuff & I'm not going to drop a bunch of money in it. Besides, if I wait until the clutch is fully engaged & slowly roll into the throttle & not drive like a dick, the 200mm clutch will be OK.
Next up was replacing the timing belt & water pump, I'm glad I did because the hydraulic tensioner damper had failed which is the cause of premature belt failure. While I was at it, I eliminated the nonessential ancillaries & corresponding brackets.
While I had the belt & water pump off, I machined the cooling fan bearing carrier and power steering pump bracket off the alternator bracket (just kidding, I gots mad skills with a sawzall though.).
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Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16863
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 7:18 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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I'm sure you know, but you can ditch all of that b/s t belt stuff and run the 1.8t belt and a 16v tensioner. iirc, you'll need the 16v tensioner stud as well
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| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 1:25 pm Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
| I'm sure you know, but you can ditch all of that b/s t belt stuff and run the 1.8t belt and a 16v tensioner. iirc, you'll need the 16v tensioner stud as well |
Yes sir, there again, it was stock that I had laying around, I used to go through ten of these kits a week, now, not so much.
The power steering pump pulley doesn't have the correct offset & the bolt pattern has a different diameter than the water pump so I sourced a pulley from a VR6 so I can drive the water pump directly.
Outer diameter is close enough so the water pump should turn at close to it's original speed.
And the offset is perfect.
Here is the how the water pump is driven now.
The timing covers will be reinstalled, I was just making sure everything fit correctly.
When I get around to building a CCW 1.8t, all I have to do is install the serpentine belt on the other side of the water pump (with a shorter belt.).
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Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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ach60 
Samba Member
Joined: May 14, 2001
Posts: 4139
Location: Santa Maria
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| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2017 9:31 pm Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| TDCTDI wrote: |
| In retrospect, I really wish that I would have just started going this route instead of screwing with the original aircooled. |
What a horrible thing to say. 
| TDCTDI wrote: |
When I get around to building a CCW 1.8t, all I have to do is install the serpentine belt on the other side of the water pump (with a shorter belt.).
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I'm guessing with that small of contact area, that that belt will slip?
But what confuses me is my New Beetle 1.8t has the water pump in the block driven by the timing belt, with the plastic impeller that breaks off.
Your Passat looks like what my Rabbits had with the Water pump driven by a V-belt.
Are all Passat 1.8t's like that?
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Al |
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dub01
Samba Member
Joined: September 21, 2016
Posts: 29
Location: Wrightsville, Pa
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| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:22 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| ach60 wrote: |
I'm guessing with that small of contact area, that that belt will slip?
But what confuses me is my New Beetle 1.8t has the water pump in the block driven by the timing belt, with the plastic impeller that breaks off.
Your Passat looks like what my Rabbits had with the Water pump driven by a V-belt.
Are all Passat 1.8t's like that? |
The first two 1.8T engine codes in the Passat were AEB and ATW. They had the external water pump like all of the older inline fours. All of the transverse 1.8Ts had the internal pump that you're talking about. It was a design update, as the old pump setup dates back to 1974. |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 6:48 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| ach60 wrote: |
Are all Passat 1.8t's like that? |
No, only the 1998-2000 Passats (& 1997-1999 Audi A4) had the "transitional" AEB & ATW engines.
*** WARNING!!! READ THIS!!!***
For anyone interested in doing this swap WITH THE PASSAT 18.t, be sure that the donor had a MANUAL TRANSMISSION. Passats with automatic transmissions had a different crankshaft that is not compatible without removal & machining.
The water pump doesn't require as much friction to turn it but my thought is to increase the contact surface by either reusing the bearing from the cooling fan as an idler or maybe a tbelt idler from a TDI or 2.8 at the lower alternator bolt.
And here it is from a side angle.
But the redneck R&D will continue as needed.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Tcash
Samba Member
Joined: July 20, 2011
Posts: 12844
Location: San Jose, California, USA
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| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 9:40 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| Is the Water pump going to work, turning in the opposite direction? |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2017 10:27 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| Tcash wrote: |
| Is the Water pump going to work, turning in the opposite direction? |
Sorry for the confusion, eventually I plan to convert the engine to run backwards so that I can use the Passat 5-speed. By running the belt on the other side , the pump will run normally. I will NOT be doing this at the moment, just looking at how to make it work while I'm here.
This is how it will be running when installed (I still have to replace the hose to the turbo overrun valve.).
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Sun Oct 15, 2017 10:49 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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So I decided to ponder the cooling system & decided to use the radiator, cooling fans & fan control module from a Jetta since I can't use the mechanical fan from the Passat.
Since the radiator is wider than the frame rails, I decided to run it lengthwise between the rails. I plan to install it at an angle with the leading edge higher than the rear with the front just behind the first crossmember.
I decided that the larger main fan would limit how far up between the rails that I could tuck the radiator so I removed the shroud & rotated it 180* with the only modification necessary being a mounting tab.
Once trimmed...
I could now reinstall it
In this configuration, I can now use the original drain petcock as a port to bleed the air out of the high point of the radiator
The hoses now will fit up between the cable & linkage tubes.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Tue Oct 17, 2017 4:01 pm Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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Today I spent a couple minutes getting ready to yank the engine.
I removed the rear bumper & apron and removed the air filter & engine harness.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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soissisc
Samba Member
Joined: April 04, 2007
Posts: 634
Location: Western Pennsylvania
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| Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2017 9:16 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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I am curious how the 1.8T will fit into the early bay. I have a Passat waiting to give it up for the conversion, but I am thinking of just going all out and CCW from the get go. I have a couple 5 spds laying around too. The electronics will be a learning experience for me too. I am following your progress with great interest.
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Mark
68 Westy
92 Jetta (oh it is retired)
99 Eurovan
05 NBC
06 Audi A3
72 Westy (I am going to fix it up) |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2017 7:16 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| soissisc wrote: |
| I am curious how the 1.8T will fit into the early bay. I have a Passat waiting to give it up for the conversion, but I am thinking of just going all out and CCW from the get go. I have a couple 5 spds laying around too. The electronics will be a learning experience for me too. I am following your progress with great interest. |
Thanks for your interest, several people have done the 1.8t (or variations there of) in the bay bus, I hope this transition helps others with theirs (or at least a "what not to do").
Today I removed the engine from the Crusty Pig, and by some weird extension of the mechanic's Murphy's Law, "any time that you needeth to work on a fuel system, the tank shalt be full, unless you need to test drive the vehicle, at which point the owner must bringeth the vehicle in on vapours"
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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skills@eurocarsplus
Samba Peckerhead
Joined: January 01, 2007
Posts: 16863
Location: sticksville, ct.
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| Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2017 9:14 pm Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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I couldn't imagine a 1.8T in a bus without the engine access hatch. me thinks you're going to want to kick a puppy when you have to do anything to it.
that said, it's a bit of a pain with the Subaru to access some stuff in an early bay, but totally doable for sure. I would hate to pull the engine to do a finger gasket or ECT. that right there would piss me right off
I would look into an air to water intercooler. but, that's me. your under hood temps are going to be insane with the turbo/manifold under the deck. if I push my APR tuned A4 hard on the stock intercooler, it will pull boost due to heat soak. I have used a NX intercooler spray kit on other applications with a programmer to freeze the IC on hard pulls.
_________________
| gprudenciop wrote: |
my reason for switching to subaru is my german car was turning chinese so i said fuck it and went japanese....... |
| Jake Raby wrote: |
| Thanks for the correction. I used to be a nice guy, then I ruined it by exposing myself to the public. |
| Brian wrote: |
| Also the fact that people are agreeing with Skills, it's a turn of events for samba history |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2017 8:08 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| skills@eurocarsplus wrote: |
I couldn't imagine a 1.8T in a bus without the engine access hatch. me thinks you're going to want to kick a puppy when you have to do anything to it.
that said, it's a bit of a pain with the Subaru to access some stuff in an early bay, but totally doable for sure. I would hate to pull the engine to do a finger gasket or ECT. that right there would piss me right off
I would look into an air to water intercooler. but, that's me. your under hood temps are going to be insane with the turbo/manifold under the deck. if I push my APR tuned A4 hard on the stock intercooler, it will pull boost due to heat soak. I have used a NX intercooler spray kit on other applications with a programmer to freeze the IC on hard pulls. |
Yes, I will need to (eventually) make an access hatch, one thing at a time. I don't plan to do any chip tuning so I shouldn't have as big of a problem with heat soak due to the increased charge pressures, as long as I can get fresh air flowing through the intercooler. I plan on using the Passat auxiliary cooling fan to draw fresh air drawn through the bus's passenger side air intake vent which will also be positioned so that it forces that air over the intake manifold side of the engine to keep the engine bay heat down.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Tue Oct 24, 2017 2:44 pm Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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Today I decided to start construction on the engine carrier bar. I started with a trip to a big box hardware store to get a 10' section of 1" schedule 40 pipe & some steel plate.
I then cut off a 48" section to prep for bending.
Due to the fact that my cheesy bender has a tendency to kink & deform the pipe past a certain # of degrees, I decided to fill the pipe to keep the deformation to a minimum.
I then found an old brake pad to weld the cut end shut.
Hmm, why does the shop suddenly smell like overheated brakes? 
While looking for a place to lean the pipe to fill it, I realized that the Crusty Pig was willing to lend a hand.
I decided to use what I had on hand, about 5#s of black powder... just kidding, I used some aluminum oxide sand blasting media.
Now all I have to do is get an end cap to close off the other end.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Wed Oct 25, 2017 3:26 pm Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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So I picked up an end cap today & I also got a 3/4" plug. After tamping down & refilling the pipe a few times, I ground the plug down a bit to get it to fit the pipe without binding (so I can get it out later.).
Then I inserted it onto the media in the pipe.
I then drilled & tapped the end cap so I could tighten the plug to keep compression on the media.
Then I stuffed the 1.8t into the Crusty Pig so I could start fitting the engine support bar.
Then I started measuring, bending, & checking the fit of the pipe.
After all the maneuvering & bending I ended up with this...
Now I just have to fab up the mounts & hangers & glue it all together.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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coolerthanelvis
Samba Member
Joined: June 30, 2003
Posts: 924
Location: San Diego, CA
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| Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 10:51 am Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| TDCTDI wrote: |
Yes, I will need to (eventually) make an access hatch, one thing at a time. |
Why reinvent the wheel? Use a Type3 hatch. They're quite a bit bigger than the late bay access hatch.
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=2056142
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Shawn
SV2s member #420
'68 Westy
"Do or do not, there is no try."
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Fri Oct 27, 2017 4:26 pm Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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| coolerthanelvis wrote: |
Why reinvent the wheel? Use a Type3 hatch. They're quite a bit bigger than the late bay access hatch.
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I wasn't going to "make" an access panel but had planned on possibly using one from a Vanagon but I do like that TypeIII one a lot better, thanks. (And after seeing how tight the 1.8t is in there, I'll have to do it sooner than later (Just to avoid punting puppies, kicking kittens & stomping baby seals, Thanks Skills  ).)
So I played with the carrier bar some more & got it too fit the way I liked & started making the mount tabs & tacked them in place.
Then, after checking fit, I ran a bead on them.
Here is the carrier bar in it's final shape without the gussets & body brackets.
I still have to trim the one bracket to make it a bit more visually appealing.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12849
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Sun Oct 29, 2017 5:41 pm Post subject: Re: 1968 Deluxe resurrection |
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So... I uncapped the carrier bar & dumped the blast media back in my cabinet & cut the brake pad off the other end.
Then I bolted it to the engine so I could get measurements to make the frame mounts.
Then I turned my attention to the body mounts, I like to ensure that there's a mechanical fit instead of just relying on a weld to suspend an engine so after taking measurements, I used a hole saw to bore a 1 1/4" hole in the steel stock.
Then cut it to length & checked for fit
That concludes today's Crusty Pig update, stay tuned for the next installment of redneck engineering 101.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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