Intermittent ABS + ESP lights, and related questions

[IdeaNerd]

I am occasionally getting ABS and ESP warning lights (both at the same time), on one of our Weekenders. Sometimes just turning off the car and starting it up again fixes it. Curious if anybody has any experience with that.

Related to that, I'm long overdue for getting a scan code reader. Any specific recommendations?

Lastly, while looking up info on the ABS and ESP (Electronic Stability Program) systems in the Eurovan owner's manual, I came across a reference to EDL (Electronic Differential Lock). I had just read about EDL in Tom Sheppard's Four-by-four driving book recently (I'm still wrapping my head around off-road technologies -- not much background there). Do the 2001-2003 MV Weekenders come with an EDL integrated with the ABS system?

[gakali]

Probably a bad speed sensor but a scan will tell you soon enough. Hopefully you don't need a clockspring/steering angle sensor

OBDeleven looks interesting. Keep in mind that any new full function scanner will have very limited use on our vans compared to modern vehicles.

Yes the EDL is integrated into the ABS/ESP system. Not a true mechanical diff. lock just a software thing.
_________________
Why do it? Because you can.

1999 Eurovan
2003 A4 Avant 1.8T Quattro
1992 W201 190e 2.3 Mercedes
2006 W220 S600 V12 Twin Turbo 5.5 Mercedes

[Scottn59c]

[BUGSTUFF]

Initially, I would have said to check your brake light switch. But since you said that it's intermittent and sometimes solves itself when shutting off and restarting, I'd say try replacing your ignition switch.

And, just for kicks, check both your battery voltage when not running and your alternator voltage when running.

As for a code reader - get something that is VW-specific. I have this one:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/U281-OBD2-AirBag-ABS-SRS-A...SwYIxX3e7N

The technology in the EV is pretty basic, so you don't really need some ultra-fancy code reader.

Good luck!!!
_________________
Kirk

Northeast IL VW Association - www.nivaclub.org
www.facebook.com/nivaclub
Volkswagen Club of America - www.vwclub.org

[jjvincent]

This is a perfect example to get something that is more than a generic OBD-II reader. So far this has been suggested:

1. Clock spring
2. Brake Switch
3. Ignition Switch
4. LF ABS Sensor
5. RF ABS Sensor
6. LR ABS Sensor
7. RR ABS Sensor
8. Alternator

Without being able to log into the ABS unit, it's just a shotgun approach. You could replace all 8 items and it will be fixed but just look at how much that would cost.

A few things:
If it's a front ABS sensor (i.e. a bad wire) then replace both, not just the one that's failed. If it's a brake light switch, buy two (they are cheap) and save one for when it goes out again. Clock spring is lots of money and if it's bad, do a search because you'll find out the bad news. Ignition switch is no big deal. The EV has a design from the early 70's and they fail every once in a while.

In conclusion, do yourself a favor and bite the bullet, buy some reader.

[IdeaNerd]

[jjvincent]

I have only used the VCDS. That's because I have three VW's and do way more than just checking codes plus I like to support small business (especially local). My new Alltrack is 100X more complex over a EV. So for the price conscious consumer, there are probably others that have used a cheaper product that would get you what you are looking for.

[gakali]

Launch Easy Diag. Pay for full diagnostic access for the makes you want and load the app on a cheap tablet and/or your phone.
_________________
Why do it? Because you can.

1999 Eurovan
2003 A4 Avant 1.8T Quattro
1992 W201 190e 2.3 Mercedes
2006 W220 S600 V12 Twin Turbo 5.5 Mercedes

[Joshwa]

I use vcds also, but I've got multiple era obd2 vw vehicles also.
_________________
93 Weekender TDI conversion (AHU)
93 MV TDI conversion (1Z)
Weekender rear cot
Late model cabin air filter on 93
Euro spec bumper install on 93

[jjvincent]

One thing that is nice about the VCDS is that if you do have other VW's or looking at having another newer car in the household, a VW/Audi product is much more attractive. That's because you are not stuck when something goes wrong when you have a different brand of car. If an ABS light come on with a jaguar, you are going to have to take it to the dealer. There is other software out there for other cars but it's way more limited as compared to the VCDS.

One other thing that is pretty cool is with newer VW's they have a module for everything and you can do some pretty cool mods to them. Just on my Alltrack, I've changed how the tail lights work, the headlights, everything to close (all windows, sunroof) when I hit the lock button, the NAV system to where you can actually change things on it while driving (they lock out many options when driving because they don't want you to crash but it's a pain when you have a passenger (like me) messing with it on a trip.

When my older son turns 16 and buys a car, it's going to be a VW just because I know I can scan the car whenever it has a check engine light on. Just being able to adjust the dynamic injection pump timing after doing a timing belt on my TDI was the real reason why I bought it in the first place back in 2000.

One other thing that is nice with the VCDS is that in about 20 minutes you can set the rediness codes (it takes about 20 minutes to do it on a Eurovan). So, if you live in an area where they do emissions, you can check to make sure there's no codes and the rediness is set. So, if you have an O2 sensor problem, change it and clear the codes, it'll take you at least 2-3 days to reset the rediness codes. With the VCDS, it's built right in to reset them quickly.

Only tweaks I can remember doing to the EV is setting the idle, changing the clock to a 24h clock, turning off the brake pad light (there's a broken wire somewhere and I can't find it) and you can change how the lights blink when locking/unlocking.

It's up to you. If you just have a EV and don't want a light on, then there are cheaper alternatives out there.

[IdeaNerd]

Thanks for the input, everyone! Very helpful.

[IdeaNerd]

I ended up getting the Autel MD802 based on @Abscate's positive experience with his Autel plus needing something for more than just Audi/VW vehicles.

All of this is a totally new world to me (as I read someone else say of themselves here recently: "I'm mechanically inclined but not a mechanic"). It's interesting though, and already feels better having a tool that can "talk and listen" to the vehicle and get useful data out of it. I welcome any links to excellent "noob scanner user" learning resources.

On the specific "intermittent ABS + ESP lights simultaneously" issue, prior to buying the Autel I took it to a reputable German automotive shop in town that has experience with Eurovans. They did their own diagnosis and ended up replacing the brake switch. The issue seemed solved at first, but alas it has been intermittent since the beginning, and it showed up again not long after.

So, cracked open the Autel box today, figured out how to connect it, scanned the ABS system, and it yields two codes:

The brake lights do work currently, though I've not been able to test that yet while this intermittent dual-warning-light issue is happening.

I found the 00526 code (Brake Light Switch) in the Bentley manual ABS/EDL On Board Diagnostic section, and the 01435 code here, which in turn led to this single sequential codes list. (Is there a better list/resource?)

The -G201 flag (code? sub-code? what's the right term?) seems to indicate it's a pressure sensor issue. What's "-lost23"?

I'll likely have the actual repair done by our mechanic, but want to learn and understand as much as I can along the way. Thanks in advance for any and all help and useful advice.

[IdeaNerd]

Update: ABS & ESP lights caught in the act, brake lights do work.

Also noticing that the gear selector lockout switch/relay seems louder than I've notice before. No idea if that's related (due to brake switch), but adding it in as information just in case.

[jjvincent]

I'd make sure the break light switch was adjusted correctly upon installation. Every switch comes with instructions on how to do it. If it was done wrong, then best to get another switch. Solve that problem first.

[IdeaNerd]

Thanks @jjvincent -- I appreciate the input!

[Hawkridesdirt]

Thanks for posting this as I am having the same intermittent issue. Please let us know what the final soulution is.

Toby Hawk
03 Eurovan MV
04 Land Rover Discovery II SE7
02 Land Rover Discovery II SE
97 Land Rover Discovery I SD7

[Abscate]

[fkahlert]

Maybe its a stupid comment but how old is the battery.

When ours started aging, we had ABS / ESP lights, beeps on startup that were not there before and a variety of other weird things happening (including of course the immobilizer acting up).
Battery "seemed" still ok.

Once we replaced the battery all issues were gone.
Just saying -

Florian 03 MVWK

[IdeaNerd]

Took it to the shop today and he thinks it was the switch so he replaced it again no charge. We'll see if that takes care of it. I'll update again if it doesn't.

[IdeaNerd]

Well, it's baaaaack. Just updating this thread to let whoever it might help know that this did not fix the intermittent problem. I haven't had a chance to scan it or look into it any further, but will update when I know more.