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Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop
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Whaanga
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 15, 2017 7:19 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Again, I'm posting to document my work. Prepped the fan side bearing seal. It cleaned up pretty well and I used the large washer from Bus Depot and a small block of wood to drive in the seal.


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Also replaced the rear main seal as well as the pilot bearing, Flywheel O ring,and felt ring.-

Set the endplay, attached the flywheel, clutch, and pressure plate. Attached the tranny and prepped for the installation


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Enlisted the help of two of my sons and set to work of installing the engine.

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Now everything is installed and ready for final adjustment and start up tomorrow.


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Xevin Premium Member
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:22 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Yep, the word Hypoid is what you want to see on the container.
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Tcash
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 10, 2017 2:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

It's good enough for mayor ratwell.
http://www.ratwell.com/technical/GearOil.html#stalube
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Whaanga
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 10, 2017 1:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Have had a hard time finding gear oil. Was driving through Ithaca on the way home to Rochester and saw a Napa parts store and this is what I found:
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It's labeled as GL4 but also mentions GL3. Did I buy the correct oil?
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THall
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 5:24 am    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Abscate wrote:
Advance should have it, or NAPA can order it for you


Yep, my local NAPA doesn't stock it, but when I asked they had some for me the next day.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 1:07 am    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Advance should have it, or NAPA can order it for you, too. I was able get my bizarre SAE140 oil for one Of my rides
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Whaanga
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 08, 2017 8:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

To document my work, I'm posting a few photos. I ordered the wrong pilot bearing so had to reorder a new part.

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Also, when I removed the flywheel (which I was able to have resurfaced) I discovered that there were only two shims - not three. Ordered several new shims in various sizes so I hopefully I can get the correct .003 - .005 setting.

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The new ones arrived today along with the pilot bearing so will install the bearing as well as check and adjust the endplay with the my new gauge.
Plus have a new main seal and will install that as well.

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I finished up the gas tank cleaning and its back in place, buttoned up and ready to go. New vapor joints, filler, neck, screen, spigot, and sending unit.


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Since I was waiting for the flywheel parts, I started putting the front side of the engine back together. Had to wrestle some of the tins back into place. but things are coming together.
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Just trying to find a place to purchase GL4 gear oil. Tried the local Napa place but no go.
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Whaanga
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PostPosted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop - Flaps & Tins Reply with quote

While I wait for some parts to come in the mail for the flywheel/clutch procedure, it's time to start assembling the 'front' of the engine. This whole thing started last fall when I discovered I did not have any cooling flaps. With great help from great folks on this site, I was able to purchase a set of flaps and a T-stat and was encouraged to drop the engine and tranny.

Today I put new seals in the oil cooler, new oil pressure switch, new engine mounts on the mustache bar, installed the interior cooling tins, installed the front and back halves of the fan shored, installed my new fan, and finally installed the long awaited and missing flaps.

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The smaller flap binds just a little on the rear fan shroud. Do I need to file down the part of the shroud so the flap can close all the way?




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On the large flap, should it cover the oil cooler completely? The tin below looks like it may be out of alignment. Also, I understand there is supposed to be some kind of a seal between the flap and the oil cooler but didn't see anything like this in the Bentley.



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Nice to see it coming back together.


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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2017 9:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Whaanga wrote:
More work today. Removed the fly wheel and found the main seal to be leaking.


There is always some oil behind the seal which will leak out when the flywheel is removed. You do obviously have a bit oil leaking out somewhere though.

Quote:
I have ordered a new one from GoWesty. The question is, how to I install this? The Bentley shows a very large and complicated tool for the 5 bolt flywheel installation. I doubt this is easily available for a guy like me.


I always just use a hammer to start it and then use a punch to get it in the rest of the way, should make a video showing my technique someday. Very quick and easy once you figure out how to do it.

Quote:
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It looks like the oil galley plugs are solid and not leaking. Should I clean up all this sludge and oil? or is this a normal state of how things look?


Yes clean everything up.

Quote:
Also, read that I need to replace the bolt plate - I looked on the Bus Depot site but could not find this part. Where might I purchase this?


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The part was readily available the last time I wanted one. Pick up the phone and call your parts supplier.

Quote:
I've read that there is supposed to be a felt ring but did not see one when I removed the flywheel. Is this found behind the main seal? If I don't have one, what is a good source?


The retainer is the harder part to find, again pick up the phone and call. You can also use a bearing with an integral lip type seal, it will go right in to the flywheel, but you then need to cut a recess in the back of the flywheel with a stepped drill bit to get clearance as the bearing will stick out of the flywheel an 1/8 inch or so.

Quote:
I also have a new pilot bearing to install. Being inexperienced, I check the one that's there and it is solid and all the rollers are in tact.

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I've read about pulling these out but it looks like there is a special tool as well. Any advise here would be appreciated.


The bearings wear out and can wreck your weekend or vacation when they fail. Not worth reusing if they have many miles on them. You can buy a cheap pilot bearing puller from Harbor Freight or maybe rent one from your FLAPS.

Quote:
Lastly, I found cracks in the flywheel so have located a new one. I will have my machinist shop look this one over, but from what I have read, I think mine is not salvageable.

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Thanks as always for advise and input.


Yes taking it into a machinist would be the best way to go.

Depending on how you use your vehicle upgrading to a 228mm clutch would be the way to go if you are buying a new flywheel and clutch kit. The only additional cost would be for a 091 bellhousing, matching starter, and a couple of longer studs and bolts.
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Whaanga
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PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2017 7:43 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

More work today. Removed the fly wheel and found the main seal to be leaking.
I have ordered a new one from GoWesty. The question is, how to I install this? The Bentley shows a very large and complicated tool for the 5 bolt flywheel installation. I doubt this is easily available for a guy like me.
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


It looks like the oil galley plugs are solid and not leaking. Should I clean up all this sludge and oil? or is this a normal state of how things look?

Also, read that I need to replace the bolt plate - I looked on the Bus Depot site but could not find this part. Where might I purchase this?


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I've read that there is supposed to be a felt ring but did not see one when I removed the flywheel. Is this found behind the main seal? If I don't have one, what is a good source?

I also have a new pilot bearing to install. Being inexperienced, I check the one that's there and it is solid and all the rollers are in tact.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I've read about pulling these out but it looks like there is a special tool as well. Any advise here would be appreciated.

Lastly, I found cracks in the flywheel so have located a new one. I will have my machinist shop look this one over, but from what I have read, I think mine is not salvageable.

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Thanks as always for advise and input.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sat May 27, 2017 1:46 am    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

My reason for wanting to replace a used clutch disc is that there are other failure modes beside just wearing out the lining. The springs can get fatigued and worn and the rivets can work loose. I almost always replace the pilot bearing whenever I have access as well.
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Whaanga
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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2017 10:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Here are a couple more photos of the clutch plate- of both sides.y

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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2017 5:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

I would replace the clutch disc no matter what, from the pictures it looks like it may have a bit of odd wear anyway. If the clutch cover and flywheel wear surfaces are fairly flat when you lay a straight edge across them they can be rerun. They will tend to get worn to a slight cone shape over time. Whether to replace any part or all of the clutch is subjective.

You can set an open end wrench or crescent wrench against the collar on the shift rod and beat on the wrench with a hammer. That should jar the two halves loose.
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Whaanga
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PostPosted: Fri May 26, 2017 4:47 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

I'm posting more photos to document my work and solicit any feedback and suggestions.

I removed the clutch plate to evaluate the parts and this is what I founnd:


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I think the pressure plate has life left in it and there is plenty of depths seen near the rivits. The cover needs cleaning and possibly to be replaced.
Not sure about he fly wheel. Will remove it and have it looked at by a local machine shop to check its soundness.

Also removed the nose cone to replace the ball and shift plate. Took the nose cone to the machine shop to get the mating surface perfectly flat per the instructions from Waddel. Being a noob, I was surprised that the gear oil came out and man, it's rank.

Do I need to remove the huge Allen Kay plug to drain and the refill?
Also, the old seal was made of paper and someone put a flywheel shim in there.


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Also cleaned and painted all the tin work.



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Lastly, have all new boots, gaskets for the shift rod tube but am having a hard time getting the two halves to separate. Any hints for how to do this?





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Whaanga
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PostPosted: Tue May 23, 2017 5:28 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

In prepping to put things back together, I discovered a small cotter pin attached to the tins that go directly above the block. What is the function of these two pins located directly above the intake manifold ports?
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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2017 1:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

So the tank looks ok? There was some rust in there and last year I had an issue with clogged fuel lines. Actually the old lines were in very poor condition and they had literally had fused closed.

All new gates baricade hoses and a fuel tank drain and I've not had one problem since.

Once I got the tank out last week, I poured in two litre's of cocacola and it cleaned most of the junk out of there.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2017 7:55 am    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Your tank looks good, I would not coat it. Doing so might cause problems that you don't have now.

You might consider replacing your engine mounts as the rubber tends to delaminate and crack with age. The one nut in your picture also looks loose.

You are just missing a couple of nuts and washers in your last picture. Those fasteners just hold the case together.

It is pretty normal for the block to be that dirty, though to have standing oil is not. I would scrape, wire brush, spray the block to clean it and try to figure out where the oil is coming from. Remove the nuts from the oil pump, clean around the studs well and then apply some silicone to the stud and surfaces where the nuts sit before replacing the nuts.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sun May 21, 2017 7:53 am    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Your tank looks good, I would not coat it. Doing so might cause problems that you don't have now.

You might consider replacing your engine mounts as the rubber tends to delaminate and crack with age. The one nut in your picture also looks loose.

You are just missing a couple of nuts and washers in your last picture. Those fasteners just hold the case together.
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Whaanga
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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2017 6:37 pm    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Some more work today. Forgot to post a photo of the interior of the gas tank.
It needs cleaning and POR 15 but it looks like it is not too far gone.
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Also removed the moustache bar to get acces to the lower portion of the engine for cleaning. There was a fair amount of oil and dirt built up. I don't think any of the galley plugs are leaking but noticed that all four nuts securing the oil pump were looser than expected - I gave each a 1/4 turn.



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Also, discovered two short bolts on the side of breather tower and above the dizzy that something mounts to but I have no idea what this would be.

I looked back in other photos of he engine and the mystery item was missing then as well.

What am I missing here?



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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Sat May 20, 2017 10:52 am    Post subject: Re: Seeking advice - 1st time engine/tranny drop Reply with quote

Whaanga wrote:
Not sure why it was stuck but glad it's off now.


Years of rust
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