tranny going south, please advise

[platatomi]

Automatic, lost 3rd gear out of the blue today. 150k on my 2002 Jetta.

Am I right guessing this is a solenoid problem? Zero engagement in 3rd, it just revs.

Anyway, now I'm in the position of deciding whether to spend $1k, $2k or more on this car. It's really nice still, has a strong 24v VR6 under the hood.

Even if I do the solenoids, who's to say it doesn't fail again in some other way soon?

I really have always wanted a manual, and so have called some shops asking about doing a swap. They all said they won't touch it because of all the electrical and computer issues that crop up.


I see guides and stories online all the time of home mechanics successfully swapping a manual into these cars, why won't a shop do it? Are there any shops out there that will?
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'69 Beetle daily driver, fixing things as I go...

Update -

No longer daily driver but still fixing things...

[crsmp5]

cause a rent in la is $$ and to charge for the time required exceds value of car..

in a 80$/hr shop the swap done right is good $4k job with parts.. and 2k-3k is easy in parts.. it actualy cost less then buying a new tranny from vw and labor to instal it.. never seen a rebuilt one last.. this was in a tdi... we went 6 speed as it cost as much as 5 speed swap parts at the time.. and the owner loes his car and better mpg he has received.. he does enough miles that the swap will be paid for in mpg savings with in 2 years..
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[platatomi]

Wow, that makes sense. I had read just the opposite, that swapping to manual was cheaper since the tranny itself only costs 1k or less instead of 3 or 4 and that more than offsets the labor. Dang.
_________________
'69 Beetle daily driver, fixing things as I go...

Update -

No longer daily driver but still fixing things...

[crsmp5]

5 speed swap for a vr6 will not be cheap... vr6 is only few years for used parts.. 99-02 i think.. maybe 01.. so 2-3 years...

tranny, starter, clutch are vr6 specific.. rest of parts can be from a 4 banger... and correct 5 speed parts cost less then a new auto tranny from vw even with labor swap times 5 speed costs less.. but shop labor rate is the cost hurdle on that... no one wants to work for free when adding pedals up under the dash... the cost to swap the actul tranny would be same... its the under dash work that adds to labor time... but part cost is the "freed up cash" to pay that

now ever read bout timing chain tensoner issues on the vr6?? when tranny is out... the chain can be gotten to.. a smart im going to own it forever person would do chains/guids and if chain was to fail it bends valves... costs less NOW vs once failed.. but i am that guy who owns cars for life... but same token i build said car i plan to keep vs buying running cars... june ill have owned my coupe 21 years.. and it sat parked unused 12 years as it was paid for... just not needed.. what a "mid life crisis cure" to break it out for a 1st drive after parked so long
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[platatomi]

I can't do the chains right now, kind of need to get it running again fairly cheaply. The shop is recommending putting in a used automatic which I have to source.


I'm wondering which transmissions are compatible with my car? I guess since you mention vr6-specific parts for the manual that means the automatic needs to be vr6 specific too?

Looking on ebay how can I tell which transmissions will work?
_________________
'69 Beetle daily driver, fixing things as I go...

Update -

No longer daily driver but still fixing things...

[TDCTDI]

The only cars that had the VR6 & the automatic transmission would be the Golf & Jetta. Try looking on car-part.com. This is effectively the same thing that the junkyards used when they don't have a part in house.
http://car-part.com/cgi-bin/search.cgi
you will need to know what transmission code your car has (FCZ or EEF).

This will be the better option, the problem with you supplying the part is that you have no warranty with the shop if the part is bad, you just pay them to install your part, if it's bad, you get to pay them to do it again.

I would suggest one of the LKQ options as they are one of the larger salvage operations. If there is a warranty issue, they have several in their system & will ship another to you from one of the other yards. They may also provide a longer warranty (usually at an additional charge).
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Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.


GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!


An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.


Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it.

[crsmp5]

words like cheap and quick do not work on a vr6... yes vr6 specific and a "used one" will only make you sad... may have a smile fr a fw weeks... but like i said.. 5 or so hours more you can have a 5 speed which will not fail like a used auto will...

if you do not do all the wiring.. like back up lights, cruise.. its just adding 3rd pedal and clutch master into firewall.. ive even seen people keep the auto brake pedal vs changing it.. they just add the clutch into whats in car.. you will have to splice the starter wires for the netural/park switch.. but its just conjoining 2 wires vs running new wires

also have to drop the exhaust/cat to mid muffler connections to swap the shifter.. depending on how that is may be a issue.. but thats in the 5hr.. the getting back up lights/cruise to function properly... that dumbfounds people the most.. so ask for photo copy of the bently wiring sections.. take it home.. map it out with highlighters.. then show them the few connections that need made one day.. take them 10 min if they do not have to do that.. a guy who does it alot would have in memory... so hit up place like tdi club on auto to 5 speed swap wiring... vr6/tdi shoul be pretty close for auto functions
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[TDCTDI]

It's a good swap, the only problems that you might run into is that without having the ECM recoded (not possible on some of the 02 & newer cars) is that you will have a DTC code thrown for a "no communication with TCM" fault, which might cause issues with getting inspected.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.


GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!


An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.


Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it.

[Butcher]

I do not live in California but from my understanding, the entire idea of a swap would never be allowed to be on the road without some serious hoops to jump through.

The emissions test would fail because you certainly would have codes. The VIN would indicate you have an automatic so a good inspector will know that.

Before I would spend a dime or any more time on this, I would look into getting this vehicle road legal. No reason to swap it over and leave it in the garage.

[platatomi]

Damn, I had thought about failing inspections/emissions.


Is it possible to test the solenoids without removing them? The shop thinks the solenoids are fine and a mechanical failure is causing the loss of 3rd but the videos I've watched about this, people take out the solenoids and test the coil. The shop didn't do this so can they really know for sure?


It would suck to trash the transmission of it's just a bad solenoid.
_________________
'69 Beetle daily driver, fixing things as I go...

Update -

No longer daily driver but still fixing things...

[Butcher]

The resistance can only be tested. The resistance test could fail and that would be a reason to replace them. The resistance test could pass, but that does not mean the solenoid is working. The coil could be fine, but the coil may not lift the valve open [ie, not clicking].

[platatomi]

Can the resistance be tested without removing the solenoids?


Basically, given the abrupt loss of 3rd, does it seem like the solenoids are probably to blame? Either the coil or valve being bad?


The only other cause I can think of is the clutch pack for 3rd failing but that wouldn't be abrupt and absolute I wouldn't think.


Are there sensors to detect fluid pressure in the circuit for each gear? Maybe the shop is seeing good pressure for 3rd and rightly concluding that the solenoid is good?
_________________
'69 Beetle daily driver, fixing things as I go...

Update -

No longer daily driver but still fixing things...