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356a shocks and altered shock mounts
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tthoms
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PostPosted: Sun May 28, 2017 9:45 pm    Post subject: 356a shocks and altered shock mounts Reply with quote

I'm helping my dad get his 356 up and running for sale. I bought some KYBs to replace the "orginal" shocks, and 1) they don't fit, and 2) the shock mounts on the driver's side don't match the passenger side.

The front shocks fit on the top mount of the driver's side:

(Top, w/o bolt and nut)

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


(top, with bolt)

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


(bottom, w/o nut)

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


(bottom, w/nut)

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Passenger side, top

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Passenger side, bottom

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


I've been told that the driver's side top setup is original, and that's why the shock fits. Have the bottom mounts have been changed as well?

If the set up has been changed, any recommendations on shocks? The old shocks had rubber bushings which allowed for the difference in diameters of the mounts.

Thanks!
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MMW
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PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2017 5:41 pm    Post subject: Re: 356a shocks and altered shock mounts Reply with quote

Hard to really tell but are you saying the new shocks have a steel sleeve inside the rubber on the bottoms and don't fit the studs? I would bet that the bottom mounts have the steel sleeve from the old shocks stuck/rusted onto the mounting stud so they appear to be to large diameter. If so you can heat them up (the sleeves) and they should then slid off with some twisting and pulling. The new shocks should then slide on. Clean up well and grease first.
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Mic
1959 356 coupe
Missing the original engine 72488
Update - third pc. found!
Now just need the case halves.
1965 fenderless beetle
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tthoms
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PostPosted: Mon May 29, 2017 8:09 pm    Post subject: Re: 356a shocks and altered shock mounts Reply with quote

The new shocks have no rubber in the loops that I can tell, but the older ones did.

You're not the first to suggest that the old sleeves are still on the mounts. I've inspected the mounts, and the mounts appear to be one piece, and not a sleeve on a bolt, but. I'll heat one up and see if I can turn it.

My eyesight is not what it use to be.... Wink
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ensys
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 09, 2017 9:01 pm    Post subject: Re: 356a shocks and altered shock mounts Reply with quote

Mr.ttoms:

Easy answers first:

Top attach: Clearly, a P.O. broke the mount bolt off in the deep socket and welded on a bolt in its place. It looks as tho the welded bolt is the size of the orig. shoulder bolt, but that there is a sleeve stuck on it still.

Lower attach:

I second the sleeve theory. As I recall, that lower mount bolt is the same diameter as the threaded section. The question here is whether the take-offs had a rubber bush and a sleeve or not.

By the by, it's probably not a good thing that the new shock's lower mount has no rubber bush... Seems to me that the raw shocks transmitted directly to the cantilevered mount bolt will be very deleterious to the bolt's lifespan. The wise money would find a rubber bush to use.
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tthoms
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 10, 2017 4:14 pm    Post subject: Re: 356a shocks and altered shock mounts Reply with quote

ensys wrote:


Top attach: Clearly, a P.O. broke the mount bolt off in the deep socket and welded on a bolt in its place. It looks as tho the welded bolt is the size of the orig. shoulder bolt, but that there is a sleeve stuck on it still.

Lower attach:

I second the sleeve theory. As I recall, that lower mount bolt is the same diameter as the threaded section. The question here is whether the take-offs had a rubber bush and a sleeve or not.


The two previous posters were correct. The sleeves from the previous shocks had remained on the bolts. In case anyone else encounters this madness, here is what I did:

I soaked the sleeve ends with WD-40 and ATF fluid. I took a cold chisel, and marked a line along the length of the sleeve, rougly 1/16 th of an inch deep.
I was then able to attach vice grips, and pounding the vice grips with a rubber mallet, work them loose. Easier said than done, but it worked.
Regarding the aftermarket shock mount attached to the car, it was actually a 1/2" mount. I had a friend who is a machinist drill out the shock sleeve in the KYB shock to fit the SAE sized mount.
For the rear shocks, which had the top nuts on so tight that they stripped, i just worked the shock back and forth until the top portion of the shock metal bar fatigued and broke off. Not particularly elegant, but it worked.
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Starbucket
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 3:52 pm    Post subject: Re: 356a shocks and altered shock mounts Reply with quote

tthoms wrote:
ensys wrote:


Top attach: Clearly, a P.O. broke the mount bolt off in the deep socket and welded on a bolt in its place. It looks as tho the welded bolt is the size of the orig. shoulder bolt, but that there is a sleeve stuck on it still.

Lower attach:

I second the sleeve theory. As I recall, that lower mount bolt is the same diameter as the threaded section. The question here is whether the take-offs had a rubber bush and a sleeve or not.


The two previous posters were correct. The sleeves from the previous shocks had remained on the bolts. In case anyone else encounters this madness, here is what I did:

I soaked the sleeve ends with WD-40 and ATF fluid. I took a cold chisel, and marked a line along the length of the sleeve, rougly 1/16 th of an inch deep.
I was then able to attach vice grips, and pounding the vice grips with a rubber mallet, work them loose. Easier said than done, but it worked.
Regarding the aftermarket shock mount attached to the car, it was actually a 1/2" mount. I had a friend who is a machinist drill out the shock sleeve in the KYB shock to fit the SAE sized mount.
For the rear shocks, which had the top nuts on so tight that they stripped, i just worked the shock back and forth until the top portion of the shock metal bar fatigued and broke off. Not particularly elegant, but it worked.

ATF and Acetone works the best 50/50 mix, soak for 1/2 hour and it will be loose.
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MMW
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2017 4:44 am    Post subject: Re: 356a shocks and altered shock mounts Reply with quote

Glad you got it figured out.

As far as removing rusted sleeves, bolts, nuts etc. I find that heating with a torch works best.
_________________
Mic
1959 356 coupe
Missing the original engine 72488
Update - third pc. found!
Now just need the case halves.
1965 fenderless beetle
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