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Fenix
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Joined: October 05, 2016
Posts: 468
Location: St Louis
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 Posted: Tue May 30, 2017 11:58 pm Post subject: Alternator conversion question. |
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So the generator in the zombie is dead. Tried to reflash it hoping that sitting for 20 yrs without a battery just caused it to loose magnetism.
In looking I found that I have an alternator stand and chrome alt/gen plate under the blue dress up cover. Other than the alternator and a warning light what else would I need to convert to an alternator.
Also, local advance auto has rebuilt Bosch al82 alternators in stock for 76.99 + $23 for a core. Is that a reasonable price? |
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jeffinohio
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Joined: February 02, 2017
Posts: 197
Location: Scio Ohio
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 4:23 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Nothing but some wire.You use the same light that is in your speedo for the gen.No need to add another light.Very easy conversion.I replaced the wire from the alt to the battery with a heavier one because I installed a 75 amp alt.If you put the Bosch alt in,I believe they are 50 amp,the original wire should be fine.I am sure you will get others chiming in with good advice.Go for it.
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Howard 111
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Joined: July 09, 2005
Posts: 1827
Location: Virginia
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 4:57 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Like Jeff said, it's a very easy conversion, and will totally eliminate the shortcomings a generator presents. Welcome to the modern world of auto electronics! 
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Fenix
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2016
Posts: 468
Location: St Louis
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 5:28 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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| jeffinohio wrote: |
| Nothing but some wire.You use the same light that is in your speedo for the gen.No need to add another light.Very easy conversion.I replaced the wire from the alt to the battery with a heavier one because I installed a 75 amp alt.If you put the Bosch alt in,I believe they are 50 amp,the original wire should be fine.I am sure you will get others chiming in with good advice.Go for it. |
It's in a rail and the PO removed all the warning lights and crushed the light openings closed...so that was why I added the light. I know the alt needs an exciter of some sort with about 100ohms of resistance. I was going to add a warning light with a buzzer. I was planning on a full rewire. Current wiring is all red 12 guage wire to everything, and not a single fuse. Most of the wires are even scorched at the connectors to the switches.
They said it is 55amp. Since I only have the basic electric draw of the street legal lights a 20" LED bar and 2 4" LED rear lights that should be enough...unless my math is off. No radio, CB, remote oil fans, or quad Hella off-road HIDs. Just a simple oldschool 70's rail buggy mixed with modern off-road lights. |
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jeffinohio
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Joined: February 02, 2017
Posts: 197
Location: Scio Ohio
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 6:02 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Sounds like you have it figured out.That alt will be plenty for what you will be running from it.FWIW..If you are doing a rewire,I would for sure add a fuse box.One short,and you will burn it down out in the middle of nowhere.Also,I would use a 8 or 10 gauge wire form alt to battery with a protective sleeve around it for obvious reasons.
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Dale M.
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Joined: April 12, 2006
Posts: 20379
Location: Just a tiny bit west of Yosemite Valley
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 6:46 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Add some fuses...
Basic alternator wiring is...
IF you have "run on" issues after conversion...
Need idiot lamp... Anything (not LED) from FLAPS...
Dale
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jeffinohio
Samba Member
Joined: February 02, 2017
Posts: 197
Location: Scio Ohio
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 6:49 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Never knew about the run on deal...good info.
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Fenix
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2016
Posts: 468
Location: St Louis
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 7:33 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Fusses were planned from the get go as was a full rewire. I never trust old wiring in any type of custom I build or purchase. I always do a full rewire with a harness I trust or design myself. I already have two block capable of 30 amps per terminal. The 8 bank block and a 4 bank universal relay block will be for the "On Road" systems. The 6 bank fuse block and individual relay pigtails will be for the "Off-Road" systems.
Dale,
I was told that as long as I wire a 100ohm resistor parallel to the LED I can use and LED for the warning light. Is that not correct? The recommendation was from a company that restores VW speedos and converts them entirely to LED, so they could be blowing smoke.
Thanks for confirming the diode. I saw your other wiring post and was thinking a diode might work. I already have several extra for the planned harness since it will have the "trailer" wiring to the brake and turn signals. |
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vwracerdave
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Joined: November 11, 2004
Posts: 15308
Location: Deep in the 405
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 8:09 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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| Fenix wrote: |
Also, local advance auto has rebuilt Bosch al82 alternators in stock for 76.99 + $23 for a core. Is that a reasonable price? |
This is not a Genuine Bosch Alternator. For that price you are getting a China rebuild. A real Bosch AL82N Alt. cost around $200. Be very careful what you are buying.
If you are running a stock mechanical fuel pump you may have to change the pump and push rod. Gen and Alt use different fuel pumps. If you are running a stock carb you may need to grind the Alt housing a little for clearance .
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Fenix
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2016
Posts: 468
Location: St Louis
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:32 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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| vwracerdave wrote: |
| Fenix wrote: |
Also, local advance auto has rebuilt Bosch al82 alternators in stock for 76.99 + $23 for a core. Is that a reasonable price? |
This is not a Genuine Bosch Alternator. For that price you are getting a China rebuild. A real Bosch AL82N Alt. cost around $200. Be very careful what you are buying.
If you are running a stock mechanical fuel pump you may have to change the pump and push rod. Gen and Alt use different fuel pumps. If you are running a stock carb you may need to grind the Alt housing a little for clearance . |
Its technically a CarCraft (owned by Advanced Auto but specialize in vintage parts) There is actually a standard Advanced Auto across the street. They still have their own service center that rebuilds vintage starters, generators, alternators, and even some distributors, Turn brake drums and rebuild master cylinders.
They claim its a Bosch and they supply the vintage Porsche restorer a 1/2 mile away. They are the ones that said "Handy's" would have OEM rebuilt starters, generators, and 1975+ alternators. They told me to go in and ask for a rebuilt OEM alternator for a 1975 standard beetle...so that's what I did. The $23 core is only because I am turning in my German generator with no exchange it is a $75 core charge. They will only accept German manufactured generators and starters as cores.
I will measure the distance on the fuel pump. It is straight like the generator ones but different enough that it is not exactly a generator one. Its an oddball VW brazil pump that uses an aluminum not polymer base/flange, has a metal pump arm (probably because it has a 25lb spring in it), and puts out 9-12 psi when not regulated down. |
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Dale M.
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Joined: April 12, 2006
Posts: 20379
Location: Just a tiny bit west of Yosemite Valley
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:50 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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| Fenix wrote: |
Fusses were planned from the get go as was a full rewire. I never trust old wiring in any type of custom I build or purchase. I always do a full rewire with a harness I trust or design myself. I already have two block capable of 30 amps per terminal. The 8 bank block and a 4 bank universal relay block will be for the "On Road" systems. The 6 bank fuse block and individual relay pigtails will be for the "Off-Road" systems.
Dale,
I was told that as long as I wire a 100ohm resistor parallel to the LED I can use and LED for the warning light. Is that not correct? The recommendation was from a company that restores VW speedos and converts them entirely to LED, so they could be blowing smoke.
Thanks for confirming the diode. I saw your other wiring post and was thinking a diode might work. I already have several extra for the planned harness since it will have the "trailer" wiring to the brake and turn signals. |
This is document (sort of) that I have for using led for "ALT" lamp...
Dale
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Luft kühl
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Joined: January 21, 2009
Posts: 1178
Location: Allentown, PA
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 10:32 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Since an incandescent bulb will light with polarity in either direction, it will warn you of both a failure to charge, and overcharging.
If you use an LED with a resistor wired in parallel, you will not have any warning should an overcharging condition ever occur.
Is the possibility of cooking your battery worth it, just to have some stupid LED ? |
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Fenix
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2016
Posts: 468
Location: St Louis
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 10:56 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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| Luft kühl wrote: |
Since an incandescent bulb will light with polarity in either direction, it will warn you of both a failure to charge, and overcharging.
If you use an LED with a resistor wired in parallel, you will not have any warning should an overcharging condition ever occur.
Is the possibility of cooking your battery worth it, just to have some stupid LED ? |
Would the voltage gauge not show that? |
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Luft kühl
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Joined: January 21, 2009
Posts: 1178
Location: Allentown, PA
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 11:08 am Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Yes it would if you happened to notice it.
Stock VWs did not come with voltage meters, and you did not previously mention that you have one. |
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Fenix
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2016
Posts: 468
Location: St Louis
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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| vwracerdave wrote: |
| Fenix wrote: |
Also, local advance auto has rebuilt Bosch al82 alternators in stock for 76.99 + $23 for a core. Is that a reasonable price? |
This is not a Genuine Bosch Alternator. For that price you are getting a China rebuild. A real Bosch AL82N Alt. cost around $200. Be very careful what you are buying.
If you are running a stock mechanical fuel pump you may have to change the pump and push rod. Gen and Alt use different fuel pumps. If you are running a stock carb you may need to grind the Alt housing a little for clearance . |
Here is the spec sheet for the alternator:
Line | Part # R110566A
Limited Lifetime Warranty
UPC: 190037030740
Remanufactured55 Amp Bosch Unit
New Or Remanufactured: Remanufactured
Amperage (A): 55 Amp
Pulley Belt Type: V-Belt
Pulley Included: No
Number Of Pulley Grooves: 1
Voltage Regulator Type: Internal Regulator
Voltage (V): 12 Volt
Fan Type: External |
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Fenix
Samba Member
Joined: October 05, 2016
Posts: 468
Location: St Louis
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 9:32 pm Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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| vwracerdave wrote: |
| Fenix wrote: |
Also, local advance auto has rebuilt Bosch al82 alternators in stock for 76.99 + $23 for a core. Is that a reasonable price? |
This is not a Genuine Bosch Alternator. For that price you are getting a China rebuild. A real Bosch AL82N Alt. cost around $200. Be very careful what you are buying. . |
Not sure where you are buying your parts...but from what I can tell most VW specific shops are making a killing on it. RockAuto has the complete New Bosch conversion kit for $255
https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/volkswagen,196...+kit,12783
Or new alternator only for $228
https://www.rockauto.com/en/catalog/volkswagen,196...rator,2412 |
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kreemoweet
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Joined: March 13, 2008
Posts: 3899
Location: Seattle, WA
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| Posted: Wed May 31, 2017 10:23 pm Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Amazon.com, new genuine Bosch AL82N, $159.00.
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Fenix
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Posts: 468
Location: St Louis
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| Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2017 10:12 pm Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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So they have the Bosch and Motorola (in house) rebuilds both for $77 and dropped the core charge to $11 dollars now that they had a chance to look over my current generator. Both include the limited lifetime warranty.
Is there a benefit / preference to either one? |
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mikedjames
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Location: Hamble, Hampshire, UK
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| Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 12:10 pm Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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| Luft kühl wrote: |
Yes it would if you happened to notice it.
Stock VWs did not come with voltage meters, and you did not previously mention that you have one. |
I had a battery connector work loose and the light came on warning of overvoltage. It was 20 volts on the voltmeter across the battery leads.
I was glad I did not have an LED or an run on diode just an OG style 1.2 watt filament bulb as a warning lamp.
Or I would have fried the stereo and other electronics.
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Pruneman99
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| Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 1:30 pm Post subject: Re: Alternator conversion question. |
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Idk why people want to wire in LED's for the warning lights. The little bulbs cost like 2 bucks, or if your not running the speedo, a little incandescent light can be found at any FLAPS in the help section for less than 5. The wiring is as simple as it gets using one wire as two way street if you will. Less wires, less fuss, just easy.
Actually that was one of the reasons I got my bug so cheap. No matter what the PO did, he couldn't get the car to charge. Multiple alternators, rewiring, etc. I just pulled the stupid LED he put in the speedo with hot glue, replaced with a regular bulb, presto. |
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