Remote oil cooler mounting options

[oprn]

[vwracerdave]

To be honest Joe I don't run gauges any more. I do check from time to time with an inferred gun. You can run 230* oil temps for as long as you can drive till you run out of gas and it won't get too hot to damage the engine. An oil sump only cools the oil 3-4 degrees. Adding additional oil only increases the amount of time it takes to get the oil up to temp. On a 2 hour highway cruise if you had a 10 gallon sump oil temps would still be the same. The purpose of an oil sump is to prevent oil starvation on hard cornering or high RPM use. Oil sumps are not intended to cool the oil.

I strongly suggest everybody read what the oil companies say about using their products and not rely on what is written on a VW forum.

DO NOT confuse normal water temps of a water cooled engine with normal oil temps.
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2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK

[oprn]

Back in the late '50s and early '60s GM determined that 230 degrees F was maximum oil temp for the Corvair air cooled engine and they designed and installed a high temp switch to reflect that.

Oils no doubt have improved since then but personally I would not run an engine any more than that. 230 to me is get your foot out of the carb and 250 in my mind would be a "shut 'er down" and let's address this problem now!

[didget69]

The fan shroud looks to be an aftermarket 36hp clone version - I got dibs on it not having fins inside to direct the cooling air -

bnc
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I never found the need to impress people with any mechanic certifications, trophies or track wins... unless it was for Mom to post on the refrigerator door.

[wythac]

One question not yet asked; Do you notice a decrease in performance when you think the engine is hot? IF you are running hot, you would notice a change.

If there are no obstructions to airflow and you have already checked to make sure you aren't running lean and have plugs that are too hot, other than replacing those lower tins there's not much to be done...other than ruin your buggy summer by either worrying too much or pulling your motor to investigate.

Run it.

[oprn]

I am running a Manx clone right now with a 1600 DP stock with just Kadrons and an extractor. It has a stock dog house cooling system including thermostat and all engine tins. I have been checking the oil temp with a heat gun on the oil filter. By the time I stop the Buggy and go around back, the heat gun reads 160 to 166. No doubt it has lost a few degrees by the time I get there but not that much.

I am presently rigging up an industrial quality temp probe to leave in the dipstick hole so will have results on that in a day or two.

[didget69]

[joescoolcustoms]

I take the oil temp right before the oil enters back in the engine on the full flow line. When it gets to 210 and above, I notice a performance drop. The engine looses torque when pulling long grades above 210*F in my buggy.

When I drag raced a 1915cc engine turning 10.15 in the quarter mile, my oil temps never got above 140* F, which is where the oil temp gauge starts reading. That engine was 14.3:1 compression and turned 8500 rpm on the launch and 8000 rpm shift points.

Without a thermostat controlled fan blown secondary oil cooler, I would not be able to travel interstate speeds for very long. A week ago, I left the NC OBX and ran about 180*F oil temp until the Raleigh Durham NC area when air temps climbed from 75 at Nags Head to 95. The oil then ran around 195. When I was climbing the Blue Ridge mountains and the West Virginia mountains, the oil temp rose to 210. As I entered the valley I live in, it dropped to 190. (It does decrease over several miles going down the otherside of the hill)

Just typical for my engine. Gauge is well within the 3% stated on temp accuracy. Engine is very tried and true with three trips across the North American continent and tomorrow on the way to work will flip over 49,000 miles on it. I run Brad Penn 30 wt. oil in it.

Just my two monitored experiences with VW oil temps. All others will vary I am sure.




BUT the OP already stated why his is running hot. He is missing the cooling tins under the cylinders. All other attempts to correct anything with coolers sufferers the basic cooling fact that the air is not being used like the VW designers figured out how to cool the engine with. Without fixing that basic problem, all the talk of oil temps is spent internet space, including my stuff above.
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Bad News Racing 2018 NORRA 1000 3rd in Class
Best Day Ever Racing 2022 NORRA 1000 2nd in Class and first All Female team to complete the race

Everyone is gifted. Some just do not open the package.

Looks like it was painted with a live chicken,polished with a brick and buffed with a pine cone

[vwracerdave]

Discussing engine temps in Dunebuggies also needs to include rear tire size and transaxle gearing in the conversation. It is normal to install larger and taller rear tires in Fiberglass Dunebuggies with the larger wheel opening body styles. The VW engine has an operating window around 3200-3800 RPM for the best cooling of the factory fan & shroud. Run lower RPM's and you can have increased cylinder head temps. Run higher RPM's and you can have increased oil temps. Generally speaking engine load effects head temps. Engine RPM effects oil temps. I see too many people that get caught up in the "Freeway Flier" transaxle craze and with taller rear tires end up overheating their engines thinking they can drive down the highway turning 2600 RPM's. You need to keep the engine in it's happy spot between 3200-3800 RPM's as the fan & shroud was designed to perform it's best cooling. One of my favorite suggestions is to get 2 sets of rear wheels. Smaller tires for city driving and stop light racing, then a taller set for long road trips and highway cruising.

A Dunebuggy with an exposed engine in an open body style should run cooler than a engine in a full bodied vehicle with an enclosed engine compartment. A VW engine with dual carbs should run slightly cooler head temps than a single carb engine. A VW engine with dual valve springs will run hotter oil temps than a engine with single springs.

VW sold tens of millions of vehicles with air cooled engines and none of them had an extra auxillary oil cooler installed. Back in the 70's I drove a stock VW over 100,000 miles and never had any overheating issues with completely stock engine. rebuilt it and drove another 75,000 miles.

What I do on the drag strip with my full race engines is not included in any conversation I have regarding a street driven VW. I have a street driven Dunebuggy (and Ghia) that is raced but I also have a drag race only Dunebuggy that never sees the streets.
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2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK

[oprn]

Got the temp indicator installed tonight and took it for a run on the highway. After 15 miles at 60 mph and 72* F ambient temperature the oil was at 175* F.
It seemed to be stabilized there but a longer run would no doubt show a somewhat higher temp as would a warmer day. (Interesting that my temp gun didn't show any more than 166* under the same conditions measuring the oil filter can!)

My sensor is a 100 ohm RTD down the dipstick hole, The ambient sensor is the same but mounted under the dash out of the sun. It will be interesting to see how speed, load, ambient temp and different oil weights effect the oil temp! I may even try different tire sizes as some suggest to see how it effects temps.

The base line here is a Manx copy, 1600 DP with Kadrons and extractor running rear tires about 1 1/2" shorter than stock, dog house cooler and all original tins. Oil presently is 10W30 and pressure at speed was 34 psi, 12 psi at idle after the run.

[oprn]

[wythac]

If/when an older bus overheated, it was because the driver required it to operate beyond its design limitation, which wasn't for 65-70mph on a US interstate. Heavy load, too high of revs.

50-55 is/was a good speed in a bus for managing oil temps and cooling. When I upgraded mine to a 1776, I added a doghouse , thermostat block and cooler with a fan. Even with those mods, 60-65 was about it before I would reach the point where the cooling system couldn't keep up.

Same motor (not just identical, but the SAME) is used now in my buggy with no external cooler and it works fine

[didget69]

[vwracerdave]

[oprn]

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[didget69]

[MrGoodtunes]

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[oprn]

This morning the ambient temp was 58* F and after 15 miles at 65 mph the oil temp was 164* F and stable. That is with a trailer behind.