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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12846
Location: North Carolina
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 Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:26 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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Cheapest thing to do is to create an exhaust leak & see if it performs better, if so, then you know that it's a back pressure issue. If it is then maybe you have a beetle type stock muffler laying around & toss that on, it's got twice the exhaust port, run it around the block with the apron off & see if it helps. You have changed everything EXCEPT the exhaust, no?
Anytime I have ever heard a vehicle get louder and NOT go any faster when the accelerator is depressed, it's either due to overadvanced cam timing or a restriction in the exhaust.
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Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
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wcfvw69 
Samba Purist
Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13389
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:28 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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Well hell.. Maybe it's time to buy Colin a plane ticket for a late season itinerant visit.
I'm not sure there's anyone more versed in all things VW buses than him..
_________________
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Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.
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Last edited by wcfvw69 on Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:40 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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TDCTDI
Samba Advocatus Diaboli
Joined: August 31, 2013
Posts: 12846
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:37 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| Tram wrote: |
Read my fingers: THE. EXHAUST. IS. NOT. PLUGGED.
Damn.  |
But if it's not a NOS VW muffler then maybe it's just a restrictive aftermarket POS & you've been chasing your tail & replacing everything else because of it.
_________________
Everybody born before 1975 has a story, good, bad, or indifferent, about a VW.
GOFUNDYOURSELF, quit asking everyone to do it for you!
An air cooled VW will make you a hoarder.
Do something, anything, to your project every day, and you will eventually complete it. |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:38 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| TDCTDI wrote: |
Cheapest thing to do is to create an exhaust leak & see if it performs better, if so, then you know that it's a back pressure issue. If it is then maybe you have a beetle type stock muffler laying around & toss that on, it's got twice the exhaust port, run it around the block with the apron off & see if it helps. You have changed everything EXCEPT the exhaust, no?
Anytime I have ever heard a vehicle get louder and NOT go any faster when the accelerator is depressed, it's either due to overadvanced cam timing or a restriction in the exhaust. |
Actually, the roaring louder symptom stopped completely when I changed the trans. It's now revving better, rolling freer, and will hit 60 rather than 50 then a struggle to hit 55.
But it's topping out at just above 60.
When I saw that other post about the stock exhaust robbing power and lopping 10 MPH off the top end I was just thinking "That's this Bus!"
I wish I DID have a different exhaust around to try but all my parts stash is Type 3 and that dog won't hunt on a Bus.
If I'm going to have to pull this mother apart AGAIN I'm going with an NOS West German muffler and resonator. If I could find a header that didn't sound obnoxious and had a REAL preheat I wouldn't mind it but I'm not sure this exists.
Yep, changed everything except the exhaust, heads, and cooling tin.
So this "VW" muffler is a fuckin' Jopex. Swell.
Damn Columbo the Bus...
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wcfvw69
Samba Purist
Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13389
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:43 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| Tram wrote: |
So this "VW" muffler is a fuckin' Jopex. Swell.
Damn Columbo the Bus... |
The only issue I saw with this Jopex muffler is the fresh air elbows don't line up for shit at the heater boxes. The muffler fit well and lined up nicely with heat risers. Oh, and the factory paint burned off rather quickly but in dry Arizona, I don't care. 
_________________
Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc
Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.
**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche fuel pumps or I can restore yours**
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:50 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| wcfvw69 wrote: |
| Tram wrote: |
So this "VW" muffler is a fuckin' Jopex. Swell.
Damn Columbo the Bus... |
The only issue I saw with this Jopex muffler is the fresh air elbows don't line up for shit at the heater boxes. The muffler fit well and lined up nicely with heat risers. Oh, and the factory paint burned off rather quickly but in dry Arizona, I don't care. |
Yeah, and GEX occasionally builds a good engine.  I specifically ordered a stock muffler to avoid aftermarket bullshit and because that's what the customer wanted. In fact, I never even knew Dansk was now Jopex. I've never seen a Dansk or Ernst or Leistritz with VW part numbers stamped like that, so I thought it was an original. I guess I need to get out more.
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wcfvw69
Samba Purist
Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13389
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:09 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| Tram wrote: |
| I guess I need to get out more. |
Clearly! Gosh!
I don't know what I was thinking. I should of bought an NOS German muffler just so the fresh air cubes lined up correctly with the heater boxes. Hell, I may still do that too though this muffler is ok for now.
_________________
Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc
Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.
**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche fuel pumps or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche distributors or I can restore yours** |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:50 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| wcfvw69 wrote: |
| Tram wrote: |
| I guess I need to get out more. |
Clearly! Gosh!
I don't know what I was thinking. I should of bought an NOS German muffler just so the fresh air cubes lined up correctly with the heater boxes. Hell, I may still do that too though this muffler is ok for now. |
And the funniest part of that is that the fresh air tubes on this one line up perfect. In fact, earlier my wife and I were out playing with our old Garmin GPS checking the speedo in it on a highway run and she was aghast at how good the heat is in it- she even made me shut it off. 
It's like the guy in the stock exhaust swap says. If only I could get another 10 MPH out of it I would be damn happy. The Type 3 distributor cleared up the boat anchor acceleration.
This actually makes total sense if these new "stock" Malaysian exhausts are restrictive. Vacuum signal can't be anywhere close to correct if the engine has asthma. No wonder the stock distributor sucks. Or would that be "blows" in this case?
"Uh... just one more thing."
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D/A/N
Samba Member
Joined: August 13, 2010
Posts: 2227
Location: 11222
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:53 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| So who sells a known good exhaust? Bus Depot? Other? |
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 6:20 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| D/A/N wrote: |
| So who sells a known good exhaust? Bus Depot? Other? |
About that... Check yer email...
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Mon Nov 13, 2017 8:07 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| wcfvw69 wrote: |
| Tram wrote: |
| I guess I need to get out more. |
Clearly! Gosh!
I don't know what I was thinking. I should of bought an NOS German muffler just so the fresh air cubes lined up correctly with the heater boxes. Hell, I may still do that too though this muffler is ok for now. |
Do me a favor... seriously. Could you measure the ID of your tailpipe?
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 11:54 am Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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OK, so any feedback from the Bay group on what is a suitable exhaust for this Bus? We need one reasonably quiet with heat risers that isn't a choker for a SP 1600, bone stock.
I've located a candidate at Bus Depot that looks good but I'd like to know if anyone has experience with their European stock mufflers. Other suggestions appreciated too.
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Spike0180
Samba Member
Joined: June 06, 2015
Posts: 2269
Location: Detroit, Michigan
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:05 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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Find a real German NOS. If you want heat risers and quiet.
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Current State: Projects never truly end...
Location: Grosse Pointe, Michigan
Other cars: 2003 F150, 2003 Jetta GLI vr6-6sp
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:10 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| Spike0180 wrote: |
| Find a real German NOS. If you want heat risers and quiet. |
Been looking... found a good candidate that says it's for 1971- 73 Bus but the pics are of a stale air 1200 when I look closely.
Yeah, I know '72 on is a Type 4 engine but 1600 was available in Europe to the end of production so I didn't question that too much.
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:25 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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Here's another thing. It seems that around the early 1990s there was indeed a "part number consolidation"... my research suggests that the correct part number should be a 211 251 051 F , but that one is impossible to find outside of Europe, it seems. Everyone including the sellers of the NOS mufflers lump 1963-71 together in one group.
It seems impossible that a muffler that's correct for a 1200 is also correct for a 1600. It seems to me that I recall 1200 being its own thing and 1500-1600 being a different P/N.
UNLESS the NOS ones were made to 1600 flow specs and retrofitted back to 1200, which is typical of what VW used to do with parts.
Maybe I am overthinking this and I should just assume that anything NOS VW that has a tag saying it fits 1963-71 is OK and just go for it. Can you tell I'm in the "once- bitten- twice- shy" zone on this Bus?
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airschooled
Air-Schooled
Joined: April 04, 2012
Posts: 12721
Location: on a bike ride somewhere
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:32 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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Not sure if this helps, but 70 mph is doable on flat ground with this guy. (1584 single port, 30pict3, 205t, stock Resolit cam.) I haven’t pushed it above 72 though; I feel like it would max out at 75. No VW part number, but it did have the Liestritz Sound Star sticker on it when I found it on eBay years ago. The VHT ceramic coat has about 50k miles and one lap of the country on it.
Robbie
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:55 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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| asiab3 wrote: |
Not sure if this helps, but 70 mph is doable on flat ground with this guy. (1584 single port, 30pict3, 205t, stock Resolit cam.) I haven’t pushed it above 72 though; I feel like it would max out at 75. No VW part number, but it did have the Liestritz Sound Star sticker on it when I found it on eBay years ago. The VHT ceramic coat has about 50k miles and one lap of the country on it.
Robbie
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06/ 76 build date. Those were the days, brother. That's top quality shit right there.
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wcfvw69
Samba Purist
Joined: June 10, 2004
Posts: 13389
Location: Arizona
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 12:57 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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Tram-
Bugcity-
https://bugcity.com/shop/shop.htm?-session=BugCitySess:4BA7038C1b33923894wP274BF44A
Muffler, Bus Type II, 66-71, Nos German Leistritz HJS
Item#: 211251051EGR
Exit designed for left side.
Search under NOS muffler- The link is not working.
_________________
Contact me at [email protected]
Follow me on instagram @sparxwerksllc
Decades of VW and VW parts restoration experience.
The Samba member since 2004.
**Now rebuilding throttle bodies for VW's and Porsche's**
**Restored German Bosch distributors for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored German Pierburg fuel pumps for sale or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche fuel pumps or I can restore yours**
**Restored Porsche distributors or I can restore yours** |
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richparker
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2011
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Location: Durango, CO
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Tram
Samba Socialist
Joined: May 02, 2003
Posts: 22711
Location: Still Feelin' the Bern- Once you've felt it you can't un- feel it.
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| Posted: Tue Nov 14, 2017 2:17 pm Post subject: Re: The Bi- Coastal Bi Polar Bus. |
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That thread doesn't seem to have any real conclusion... or am I missing something?
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