My Detroit sandrail/pleasure craft... or "Carmela's Concession"

[Dark Earth]

I don't know if this will help, but here's another link ...

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=502694&highlight=
_________________
My Build: '69 Baja - Dark Earth Version

~I'm almost done. I just lack finishing up.~

[dennismcd707]

so I have it straight ........... I will need to fabricate 'both' an adapter (for attaching to type 1 Beetle spring plate) and a no hop set-up? Two things? It's funny, one thread leads me to another thread, which leads to another..... and on and on. Which is cool. The alternative is.....................nothing. Which sucks. I've been told I'll be happy with the Type 1 swing axle set up in my rail, and I'm sure I will be. (A Hoot, right Jeff?)

The RGB's are still on ice, while I figure some things out. Meanwhile .... mobility first! Yesterday I ordered a Kennedy Stage 1 pressure plate, new clutch, skid plate, rear bumper, and my rear wheels arrived too. Piece by piece. (It's also supposed to get into the 50's today. It's still frickin' February, what in the hell is happening in Michigan?

Ahhh..... my wheels are here.

[dennismcd707]

Wow, plasma cutters aren't cheap. I didn't know what a plasma cutter was until 5 minutes ago. What kind of scenario would I need to justify a tool like that? Besides owning another cool tool, it would definitely be a welcomed addition to a growing 'collection' of cool tools. But .... I don't know why a bench vise is still escaping me. Maybe because I've not been outside, staring at my work bench 'WITHOUT A VISE ATTACHED TO IT'. There's kind of an empty space for one, and when I'm out there, I always think to myself "I'm gonna order a vise when I get inside" ...... and then I don't.

This whole sand rail/pleasure craft (Hi Dad!)/Carmela's Concession project, .... one door opens into the next, and into the next, and into the next, and on and on. (And that's certainly not a complaint. It's just me finding something 'MORE' to do with my life after the age of 50. All because of the air cooled VW itch!!) ..... Welding, electricity, carpentry, dirty hands (again), and like I said, "One door opens into the next, and into the next, and on and on!", and I'm happily 'MORE THAN' okay with that.

Who wouldn't be?


.

[heywebonya]

Start looking for an old conference table or industrial tables to build on. I use old restaurants table stands as a grinder stand and just mounted a section of 2"x 12" about 16" long that is portable stand that I beat on all the time. They are super solid and cheap (~ $5 each at auctions)

Regarding the transmission selection - a running swing axle beats a theoretical RGB everyday!

I want to see you successful and this requires a running buggy! (plus, once the wife rides in the buggy- it is easier to justify more stuff)
_________________
If I knew what I was doing; I wouldn't be building a buggy!

[dennismcd707]

A running swing axle is much better than a theoretical RGB set-up ANY DAY! Man, how profound! And it couldn't be any more true! Thanks for the vote of confidence Jeff. Success is easier with help from others ....... IMHO (humble my ass)

Thanks for the tip on the metal tables. I'll keep an eye out. I'll be in Lansing next week for the buggy builders show. Bringing the wife, a wheel barrel, and a wad of cash. Maybe Carmela can get an idea of what "might be".

Sad Note: My cat Tab died yesterday. He was already blind due to high blood pressure, but otherwise pretty healthy. Suddenly, while I was at work yesterday, my wife noticed him lying in a weird position and not breathing. She starts crying, and suddenly he starts gasping for air. She rushed him to the vet, but we ended up putting him down. I spent some good quality time with him in the morning before I went to work, so I have that memory. He was happy and purring, and now he's sleeping. By Tab buddy.

.

[dustymojave]

Note that those RGB adapters shown earlier in this thread will adapt RGB axles to Bug spring plates, they will not work with a no-hop kit.

The axle tube needs to rotate in relation to the spring plate for the no-hop to work.

Bug swingaxle is fine.

Really wide wheels like the old ones are great for sand dunes and paddle tires or Terra Tires. For most other offroad use, the 8" rims and 31x10.50s are way better.

Regarding a skidplate...HELL YES! Even for deep mud or deep sand dunes. What is available off the shelf was designed in the 1960s to be attached to the torsion housing area of the pan under the shifter coupler at the front, to a steel motor mount in the middle, and to the back of the engine case at the back

DON'T DO IT!!!!!!!

Not "don't do" the skidplate. Because you definitely SHOULD do the skidplate. Just don't attach the skidplate to the engine. If you bang the skidplate with it attached to the engine, it will just break the engine case. The skid should be attached to an engine cage. Like a Baja Bug bumper cage.

But since your buggy frame was custom built in someone's garage, you can't just go out and buy a bumper cage to fit it off the shelf. You could buy one that bolts to the stock motor mount bolts that go into the back ends of the motor mount yokes. Your frame is good for that. The upper tubes of the bumper would normally mount to the upper rear shock mounts, which your car still has. But the shocks in place there mount to the frame above and the shocks get in the way of the bumper cage mounting to the stick upper mounts. A "firewall mount" bumper MIGHT fit to your frame. IF it does, then you would need to fabricate some mounts to make the connection.

Sometimes aint nothin' ever easy!
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.

[dennismcd707]

.......more 'stuff' arrived yesterday, and more will be arriving today (video editing software, GoPro accessories, more GoPro accessories, tachometer, loctite, dual circuit master cylinder, and a brake fluid reservoir. Plus, even more GoPro accessories. )

Thanks to all (as per usual) for all tips and comments. Here are a couple of shots taken with my new gopro camera. Set at wide angle for effect, I had to resize it. The shrinkage factor was 60% .... and it's still pretty sharp. I took a chance on the rear baja bumper. I figured it can give me ideas on how to fabricate, or at least it might even give me something to attach. We'll see. Can't wait for the warm weather!! (not "JUST" talkin' baseball either)

[heywebonya]

Dennis,

What is on your "To Do" list? periodically I put together a punch list to get perspective on what needs to be done versus what I wish.

There is a risk that you will have a buggy shop full of parts, but no buggy. Begin with the end in mind - Stephen Covey.

Stay awesome - I wish you lived closer to Kalamazoo!
_________________
If I knew what I was doing; I wouldn't be building a buggy!

[dustymojave]

Did that bumper come in 2 pieces?

If it came as one, which is normal, in the middle would be the worst place to cut it to narrow the upper mounts. If that is why it's in 2 pieces now...
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.

[71StandardReduction]

[cbeck]

Here is what happened the first time I used mine. Only cost 4 pushrods/tubes/exhaust vs whole engine?

_________________
My cut in half and rebuild thread
www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=647779

[dennismcd707]

My tires showed up today, which means it’s official. My tires and rims are bought, checked off the list, and doing a wonderful job of making my basement smell like a tire store. I went with 31 x 10.5 x 15 Mud Claw “EXTREME MT” mud terrains for the back and of course the already purchased 235/75/R15 Falken “WILD PEAK” all terrains for the front.

Still goin’ to town after the friendly FedEx delivery guy left, the postman dropped off an Empi dual circuit master cylinder for me. And as I’m writing this, I’m also expecting the UPS man any minute to be abandoning his parcels labeled Mr. Dennis in Eastpointe MI. Inside the brown taped up box I expect to find a 2 inch VDO oil pressure gauge. Lastly, I think another FEDeX vehicle should be pulling up to the curb out front with his package. Inside I hope to find two missing Auto Meter gauges (tach & oil temp) that were re-shipped to me from Appletree Automotive. If they arrive like I expect them to, I’m then able to check ‘em off the list, just like the tires.

I also made a pretty important decision regarding my engine building. (take note Jeff, I can harness that ol' ADHD sometimes) I’ve decided to just concentrate on building my 1760 engine first, stick with the plan of “mobility first”, and go back and put the other two engines together later, when I have more time. I guess you could say reality caught up with me a little bit, and I came to realize (again) that certain things need to take time. The rail and everything that comes with it ….. takes time, and I hate rushing through stuff. I just know that I’ll be playing around while building those 3 engines, and my mind would be elsewhere. (namely in the garage, holding a wrench, looking for a clean rag,……or a band-aid)

I’ve got so much going on with the rail, it sometimes feels like my mind is being spread really thin ....... with all the ideas and planning. It’s ‘ALMOST’ overwhelming. I'm gonna work on that list Jeff, and see where it should be modified or adjusted. With everybody's help, of course. Let me make it cohesive and I'll post it.

So, having said that, I started to get the engine ready, and let me tell you. I felt so good just relaxing, getting stuff ready, taking a few last measurements, and running upstairs to answer the doorbell every 15 min. I tell ya, doing just this one engine, and devoting 100% of my time and energy to just this one assembly process, I think I made a really smart choice. I felt good after doing a final de-burring and inspection, so I gave the case a bath in warm soapy water (dish soap). Here’s my little buddy Bailey checkin’ out the bubbles, and reeling in his new pet position at the ol' McDermott household: TOP DOG CAT

Now, I’ve finally got some dialogue started with the guy who’s rebuilding my transmission. I’m so thankful I get to be a part of this trans rebuilding process. The plan is….. he’s gonna tear it down, see what it’s got in it, and then we’re gonna discuss modifications and pros and cons of skipping certain things in the rebuilding process. Beefing up certain things, leaving others alone. I’ll go into detail when it’s all happening, but my rail is becoming closer to being mobile, and let me say it again. I’m just excited to have the process started. This is fun. OH………….my tow bar should be here next Monday or Tuesday.

Supposed to get 2 to 3 inches of snow tonight. Oh….. yea yea, the Baja style Rear Bumper Cage thing. Yes, this is how it came, shipped to my doorstep, wrapped together in cellophane. Richard, you say that’s not good? Welding it won’t help with the safety factor, am I right? (weak, right in the middle, right where it needs to be STRONG LIKE BULL!)

.

[dennismcd707]

As I'm sitting here, winding down from getting all frustrated during the engine building session (can't figure out how the cam bearings get installed ) ..... I came up with this pretty thorough list of what needs to happen before I can start making a habit of going out and squirtin’ dirt. I left out a few things that have to get done, but just not before I make her mobile. (RGB’s, front disc brakes, actually ….. ‘ANY’ front brakes, stereo, running lights, etc.)

1 - steel brake lines from master cylinder out to everything – NOT YET PURCHASED
2 - emergency/hand brake system – NOT YET PURCHASED
3 - install dual circuit master cylinder
4 - rear shocks – NOT PURCHASED YET
5 - mount & balance wheels & tires
6 - install fuel cut off valve – NOT YET PURCHASED
7 - re-plumb gas tank
8 - install at least one of each, brake light & headlight – PURCHASED NOT YET
9 - install complete wiring system/harness
10 - install battery and ignition switch/on-off button – NOT PURCHASED YET (BATT)
11 - install clutch and throttle cables
12 - paint it black you devil (I see a red door and I want to paint it black)
13 - design & install instrument gage cluster
14 - install gear shifter and rod mechanism
15 - find at least one used comfy driver’s seat and seat belt system (NOT YET PURCHASED)
16 - replace steering dampner & remove sway bar
17 - grind smooth torsion housing where it was removed from donor car/cut in half
18 - get at least one working transmission
19 - reinforce frame horns
20 - install skid plate and rear bumper/engine cage
21 - finish at least the 1760 stroker, last thing to buy for it…………….? Safety cage for the fan belt and pulley. I’m thinking chrome :2gunfire:

I still have quite a bit to do, don't I Jeff?

[dustymojave]

If black is black...I want my baja back. If gray is gray, I want it back today. Whoa, whoa.

Cam bearings just slip in place. If you got the less expensive single thrust bearing set, then only one side of the gear end cam bearing gets a bearing shell with thrust flanges on it. Make sure that the bearings on one side get the pins to keep them from spinning.

That sleeve in the bumper cage should be 6" long, 3" each side of the seam. Then 1.5" away from the seam on each side, there should be a 3/8" to 1/2" diameter hole through the outer tube for a rosette weld. They tack in a 4" piece and expect the external seam weld to hold it together. My way is strong enough for the FAA to approve it for aircraft. Their way is WAY WEAK and CHEEZY! And did they tell you that welding was required to complete it? If not, they've engaged in false advertising.

BTW...If/when you weld it together, use a pair of chain type vice grips (or cheap HF imitations) to hold the 2 pieces to a piece of angle iron to keep the tubes straight.
_________________
Richard
Offroading VW based cars since 1965
Tech Inspection 1963 - 2012 SCCA/SCORE/HDRA/MORE/MDR +
Retired from building Bajas, Fiberglass Buggies and Rails in the Mojave Desert. Also Sprints & Midgets, Dry Lakes, Road Race cars. All types New and Vintage
SoCalBajas Member
Kicked Cancer's A$$...1st and 2nd round...Fight ain't over yet.

[dennismcd707]

The cam bearings 'would' just slip in place, if only the little tabs on the suckers were in the correct position. Richard, they are not. I've been told that I have to grind down the tab on one of the 2 thrust bearings. WTF? Does Mahle just assume that everyone who buys a set of DBL THRUST stock cam bearings for a stock D.P. 1600 case knows that the tabs are not correct? Is Mahle saving money by not including instructions on how to modify their product to actually make it work the way it was designed to? Again, WTF?

I'm still pretty pissed off. It made me feel pretty stupid, number 1. Number 2, why would anybody sell something that has to modified, and then not tell you? Oh, wait......... that happens all the time, doesn't it? My baja style bumper cage was not advertised as "cut in two, must be welded together again". If it were, I'd have still bought it, but it's another example of how lost I am some times WITHOUT PROPER FRICKIN' INSTRUCTION!!!

I'm really not good at figuring stuff out. What I'm better at is ........ following directions. The cam bearings (even in the frickin' books) did not mention anything about the tabs being there for inconvenience and confusion.

The world is my oyster, and I'm stuck dealing with high blood pressure over cam bearings and the lack of proper instruction. Like I said, I'm still pretty mad. Cam bearings? Uh........ could it get any simpler to confuse Dennis?

[oldschool5er]

Just make sure you check the cam thrust is correct after you lay the cam in the saddles, the cam bearing thrust surface sometimes also need smoothed down to get it correct. You can tap the cam a little back and forth once to seat the thrust bearing before you check clearance. The bearings are made to a specific size but cases can be different in the thrust saddle and sometimes even the cam surface, so it is not a perfect world. I am including a pic to show what NOT to do. He even got one half of the bearing shell and tang in the wrong place putting them backwards and into the oil channel on one side. This customers motor lasted 50 miles before it blew and I had the pleasure of fixing another mechanics butcher work. You can mod the bearings corner if a small portion of the corner protrudes into the channel. Installing double thrust cam shells were not a stock setup but an old race mod turned in to a standard procedure that not everybody uses. I don't think the manufacturer includes instructions just because when you grind the tang down you are effectively changing the way they manufactured it and they don't want to condone doing it. Also that extra thrust bearing can be boxed in by an aftermarket source outside of the manufacturer. But it is a common way to do it with no issues as long as you CHECK the running clearance by putting the cam in both sides of the case to measure thrust.

_________________
HRE in Westerville,Ohio

Full machine shop with all types of CNC. Rapid prototyping available, CNC Plasma cutting, 3D printing and Laser engraving.

[dennismcd707]

I appreciate all the tips and help. Going forward, I'll know that anything that I buy (either brand new aftermarket stuff or brand new VW stuff) ........... I can't assume it's going to fit or work without modification, and I shouldn't act like it's the end of the world when something doesn't fit right. Two lessons, one mistake.

My tow bar (Smitty built) arrived yesterday, along with 2 new fuel pumps. Boy, I've certainly got the 'collection' goin' on at the ol' homestead!

Looking forward to Sunday and the Michigan Buggy Builders Show in Lansing. I'm hoping to find some close ratio 3rd and 4th gears for my trans, as well as anything else that might either come in handy or be relevant to my building plans. Or, if I can't find anything to buy, just looking at buggies and rails should be lots of fun. Porn for the soul on a Sunday in Lansing. Is that legal?

[oldschool5er]

Yep going there also. I normally sell stuff there but I am buying this time for another Vintage racer restore. Sellers get in early and swoop in on the good stuff so I am hoping to find good stuff left by the public opening.
_________________
HRE in Westerville,Ohio

Full machine shop with all types of CNC. Rapid prototyping available, CNC Plasma cutting, 3D printing and Laser engraving.

[heywebonya]

Dennis,

Great progress and the list helps keep it in perspective.

Where did you order tires from? They are great looking - are you planning to mount them yourself?

I am not going to the buggy show, too easy to buy too much!
_________________
If I knew what I was doing; I wouldn't be building a buggy!

[dennismcd707]

I ordered the tires through Amazon. My brother-in-law runs a bump shop, so we'll hopefully mount 'em after hours over there. It's been a while, but I think I could still do it in my sleep, from my days in the service station. If he's too busy, then just a local tire store. I bought them online because it's convenient, but I suppose I should throw some money back into the community and go to the local tire store for the mounting and balancing, we'll see.

I heard about the good buys that are lost to the public because of vendors who get there early and buy buy buy. That's too bad, but it sounds like there will still be some cool stuff to buy. I hope so anyway.