Author |
Message |
jtauxe Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2004 Posts: 5780 Location: Los Alamos, New Mexico
|
Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:34 pm Post subject: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
In restoring my Mexican single cab to its original factory configuration, I am compelled to honor the wiring to the headlights. Since this truck was built to European specifications, it had the extra grey wire into the headlight buckets for the "parking lamp" -- a small extra bulb that lives outside the main bulb cluster, and which provides the feature of having lights on the vehicle when parked, which is apparently standard in some countries.
In this photo through the front of the headlight, you can see the white rubber penetration that holds the parking lamp:
Here is is from the back side:
I found the cool H4 headlights with the extra lamp at BusDepot, and went to mount them, when -- hold on. These won't fit in the housings. As you can see, the white rubber penetration wants to occupy the same space as the ring on the housing:
Now, it could well be that the headlight housings are not original. Or, if they are, some other sort of parking lamp was in the headlights.
I am thinking of modifying the housings to accept these headlights by cutting them to clear the white rubber. Something like cutting out along the pencilled line here:
But I'd really rather not cut on these. Ideally, I would learn that indeed the Euro housings are different, and wouldn't someone like to sell a pair to me?
Short of that, out comes the Dremel tool... _________________ John
"Travelling in a fried-out Kombi, on a hippie trail, head full of zombie..." - Colin Hay and Ron Strykert
http://vw.tauxe.net
1969 Transporter, 1971 Westfalia, 1976, 1977, 1976, 1977, 1971, 1973, 1977 Westfalias,
1979 Champagne Sunroof, 1974 Westfalia Automatic, 1979 Transporter, 1972 Sportsmobile, 1973 Transporter Wild Westerner, 1974 Westfalia parts bus, 1975 Mexican single cab *FOR SALE*, 1978 Irish 4-door double cab RHD
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
otiswesty Samba Member
Joined: November 21, 2006 Posts: 1730 Location: Portland
|
Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2017 7:45 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
The european headlights have a mounting ring that is integral to the headlight. It is all one unit.
The US version has a separate mounting ring with the 3 depressions to hold any standard headlight.
You will need to clearance your mounting rings if you want to run those lights. No biggie. _________________ 1978 Sage Green P22 Westfalia
1989 T3 Syncro Single cab
Just a regular guy |
|
Back to top |
|
|
busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51128 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
|
Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:15 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
Seems all your questions are already answered here John: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=684259&highlight=
From the looks of what you are trying to fit you opted for the cheapo Whoknowswhattheyreallyfitbutaslongasthere'sastrongmarkupwhocares?sincethestupidcustomerwillfallforit lights instead of the real Bosch or Hella lights meant for a bus. You may have barely saved enough to justify the Dremel time, but 10-20 years later are those Asian attempted facimilies going to look as good as the real deal still does after all these years? Not only are you sacrificing fit, the quality is probaby suspect, and years later when the supply of the genuine ones has completely dried up you'll be kicking your ass and throwing in sealed beams because they are the only option.
I think you are making a mistake, YMMV. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
notchboy Samba Member
Joined: April 27, 2002 Posts: 22449 Location: Escondido CA
|
Posted: Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:58 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
Yep. You are not dealing with the OG European parts for which you wish to turn your bus back to Like they said ^^^^ _________________
t3kg wrote: |
OK, this thread is over. You win. |
Jason "notchboy" Weigel
1964 1500 S
1964 T34 S Convertible
1977 Westfalia Camper pop-top |
|
Back to top |
|
|
jtauxe Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2004 Posts: 5780 Location: Los Alamos, New Mexico
|
Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:23 am Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
busdaddy wrote: |
Seems all your questions are already answered here John: https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=684259&highlight=
From the looks of what you are trying to fit you opted for the cheapo Whoknowswhattheyreallyfitbutaslongasthere'sastrongmarkupwhocares?sincethestupidcustomerwillfallforit lights instead of the real Bosch or Hella lights meant for a bus. You may have barely saved enough to justify the Dremel time, but 10-20 years later are those Asian attempted facimilies going to look as good as the real deal still does after all these years? Not only are you sacrificing fit, the quality is probaby suspect, and years later when the supply of the genuine ones has completely dried up you'll be kicking your ass and throwing in sealed beams because they are the only option.
I think you are making a mistake, YMMV. |
Are you saying that I am making a mistake...
- trying to fit the integrated parking lamp headlights into this truck?
or
- trying to modify these mounts to accept those headlights?
or
- buying the cheapo integrated parking lamp headlights?
or
- moving away from sealed beams lights in the first place?
or
- attempting to return the truck to its factory configuration? _________________ John
"Travelling in a fried-out Kombi, on a hippie trail, head full of zombie..." - Colin Hay and Ron Strykert
http://vw.tauxe.net
1969 Transporter, 1971 Westfalia, 1976, 1977, 1976, 1977, 1971, 1973, 1977 Westfalias,
1979 Champagne Sunroof, 1974 Westfalia Automatic, 1979 Transporter, 1972 Sportsmobile, 1973 Transporter Wild Westerner, 1974 Westfalia parts bus, 1975 Mexican single cab *FOR SALE*, 1978 Irish 4-door double cab RHD
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51128 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
|
Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 10:23 am Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
Your mistake is using the wrong parts IMO. If I had your truck I'd want the Euro lights for sure, but I would source a pair of the correct OGVW parts and do it right. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
jtauxe Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2004 Posts: 5780 Location: Los Alamos, New Mexico
|
Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 10:49 am Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
I agree. This is the time to make this factory correct.
What that tells me, then, is that the headlight mounting rings were probably replaced with some '73 or earlier version at some point in the past. These are not going to work without modification, and, as you point out, they would still be "wrong". _________________ John
"Travelling in a fried-out Kombi, on a hippie trail, head full of zombie..." - Colin Hay and Ron Strykert
http://vw.tauxe.net
1969 Transporter, 1971 Westfalia, 1976, 1977, 1976, 1977, 1971, 1973, 1977 Westfalias,
1979 Champagne Sunroof, 1974 Westfalia Automatic, 1979 Transporter, 1972 Sportsmobile, 1973 Transporter Wild Westerner, 1974 Westfalia parts bus, 1975 Mexican single cab *FOR SALE*, 1978 Irish 4-door double cab RHD
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
otiswesty Samba Member
Joined: November 21, 2006 Posts: 1730 Location: Portland
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
notchboy Samba Member
Joined: April 27, 2002 Posts: 22449 Location: Escondido CA
|
Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 3:53 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
Your parts are for sealed beam US spec type bulbs - used here, Canada and Mexico. The one otiswesty shows is the euro spec type. _________________
t3kg wrote: |
OK, this thread is over. You win. |
Jason "notchboy" Weigel
1964 1500 S
1964 T34 S Convertible
1977 Westfalia Camper pop-top |
|
Back to top |
|
|
busdaddy Samba Member
Joined: February 12, 2004 Posts: 51128 Location: Surrey B.C. Canada, but thinking of Ukraine
|
Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 5:32 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
Aaannd there's two different styles of those, the later ones shown with the separate basket, and the earlier ones which use the chrome ring as the mount.
I have no idea when the change took place. _________________ Rust NEVER sleeps and stock never goes out of style.
Please don't PM technical questions, ask your problem in public so everyone can play along. If you think it's too stupid post it here
Stop dead photo links! Post your photos to The Samba Gallery!
Слава Україні! |
|
Back to top |
|
|
notchboy Samba Member
Joined: April 27, 2002 Posts: 22449 Location: Escondido CA
|
Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 7:56 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
busdaddy wrote: |
Aaannd there's two different styles of those, the later ones shown with the separate basket, and the earlier ones which use the chrome ring as the mount.
I have no idea when the change took place. |
I would wager around 73, 74.Maybe as early as 71. All I know is I was buying bus and bug euro spec headlights out of Europe for a steal as they were plentiful. Then flipping them to US folk wanting the Euro headlights. Popular in the Type 3 scene for sure. And they were into the early 70's for sure.
Hazets pics of earlies.
_________________
t3kg wrote: |
OK, this thread is over. You win. |
Jason "notchboy" Weigel
1964 1500 S
1964 T34 S Convertible
1977 Westfalia Camper pop-top |
|
Back to top |
|
|
jtauxe Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2004 Posts: 5780 Location: Los Alamos, New Mexico
|
Posted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 4:31 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
So, I actually bought and paid for these headlights in the ad above from the seller on The Samba (Globusoverland https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/profile.php?mode=viewprofile&u=48570), and then he reneged and returned my money. Jerk.
But, as it turns out, these are available from Europe. I found them in Germany, Latvia, and the UK (OK, I still think of the UK as part of Europe), and ultimately bought a pair from a UK Amazon seller.
For those of you looking in the future, the Hella part number is 1A8 003 060 551 _________________ John
"Travelling in a fried-out Kombi, on a hippie trail, head full of zombie..." - Colin Hay and Ron Strykert
http://vw.tauxe.net
1969 Transporter, 1971 Westfalia, 1976, 1977, 1976, 1977, 1971, 1973, 1977 Westfalias,
1979 Champagne Sunroof, 1974 Westfalia Automatic, 1979 Transporter, 1972 Sportsmobile, 1973 Transporter Wild Westerner, 1974 Westfalia parts bus, 1975 Mexican single cab *FOR SALE*, 1978 Irish 4-door double cab RHD
Last edited by jtauxe on Tue Nov 21, 2017 8:16 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
Back to top |
|
|
notchboy Samba Member
Joined: April 27, 2002 Posts: 22449 Location: Escondido CA
|
Posted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 5:59 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
Yes John. Glad you found some. Now you know why I called them "Euro" headlights _________________
t3kg wrote: |
OK, this thread is over. You win. |
Jason "notchboy" Weigel
1964 1500 S
1964 T34 S Convertible
1977 Westfalia Camper pop-top |
|
Back to top |
|
|
zerothehero Samba Member
Joined: March 16, 2008 Posts: 214 Location: Derbyshire
|
Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 7:00 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
[quote="jtauxe"]
otiswesty wrote: |
(OK, I still think of the UK as part of Europe), |
We're not leaving Europe _________________ I like caves..
Caves are cool
-------------------
1979 Devon Moonraker 1600 twin port
1978 Oz Microbus 2000 FI Auto |
|
Back to top |
|
|
furgo Samba Member
Joined: September 06, 2016 Posts: 944 Location: Southern Germany
|
Posted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 11:57 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
jtauxe wrote: |
But, as it turns out, these are available from Europe. I found them in Germany, Latvia, and the UK (OK, I still think of the UK as part of Europe), and ultimately bought a pair from a UK Amazon seller.
For those of you looking in the future, the Hella part number is 1A8 003 060 551 |
For future reference for someone else looking for them, here's one (German) seller that stocks them. I would think they ship worldwide:
https://www.werk34.de/product_info.php/info/p16678...Hella.html
Or you can also search for the VW part #: 111 941 073 _________________ '79 Westy, P22 interior, FI 2.0 l Federal, GE engine (hydraulic lifters)
Decode your M-Plate |
|
Back to top |
|
|
notchboy Samba Member
Joined: April 27, 2002 Posts: 22449 Location: Escondido CA
|
Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 6:40 pm Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
furgo wrote: |
jtauxe wrote: |
But, as it turns out, these are available from Europe. I found them in Germany, Latvia, and the UK (OK, I still think of the UK as part of Europe), and ultimately bought a pair from a UK Amazon seller.
For those of you looking in the future, the Hella part number is 1A8 003 060 551 |
For future reference for someone else looking for them, here's one (German) seller that stocks them. I would think they ship worldwide:
https://www.werk34.de/product_info.php/info/p16678...Hella.html
Or you can also search for the VW part #: 111 941 073 |
As well as pop open any VolksWorld or Camper mag and find a nice pic of it and a vendor _________________
t3kg wrote: |
OK, this thread is over. You win. |
Jason "notchboy" Weigel
1964 1500 S
1964 T34 S Convertible
1977 Westfalia Camper pop-top |
|
Back to top |
|
|
jtauxe Samba Member
Joined: September 30, 2004 Posts: 5780 Location: Los Alamos, New Mexico
|
Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 8:29 am Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
Well, damn. I got a pair of these lights from the UK, and it looks like they would mount to the bus' headlight buckets, BUT...
...the lights will not accept the trim ring that goes directly around the glass. The trim ring (not the outer ring that goes to the body) will simply not fit over the Hella headlights. Nor will the BusDepot headlights (which accept the trim) fit into the Hella frame.
So, crap. At this point I have two different pairs of headlights that support the parking lamp feature, but neither of them can I get to fit in my bus, any any combination. WTF?
Does anyone really know how this would have been built at the factory in 1975?
Are there any European folk out there with a '75 (or so) bus that has a setup like this? HELP! _________________ John
"Travelling in a fried-out Kombi, on a hippie trail, head full of zombie..." - Colin Hay and Ron Strykert
http://vw.tauxe.net
1969 Transporter, 1971 Westfalia, 1976, 1977, 1976, 1977, 1971, 1973, 1977 Westfalias,
1979 Champagne Sunroof, 1974 Westfalia Automatic, 1979 Transporter, 1972 Sportsmobile, 1973 Transporter Wild Westerner, 1974 Westfalia parts bus, 1975 Mexican single cab *FOR SALE*, 1978 Irish 4-door double cab RHD
|
|
Back to top |
|
|
sjbartnik Samba Member
Joined: September 01, 2011 Posts: 5995 Location: Brooklyn
|
Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:42 am Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
Do make sure that the lamps you got from the UK seller are set up for LHD vehicles. The lens design would be different for LHD vehicles vs. RHD vehicles, throwing the upward kink in the beam pattern to the wrong side of the road if RHD lenses are used in a LHD country.
In other words you'd be blinding oncoming drivers. _________________ 1965 Volkswagen 1500 Variant S
2000 Kawasaki W650 |
|
Back to top |
|
|
static Samba Member
Joined: March 22, 2002 Posts: 1831 Location: The High Desert
|
Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 9:54 am Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
sjbartnik wrote: |
In other words, you'd be blinding oncoming drivers. |
You say that as if it's a bad thing. |
|
Back to top |
|
|
sjbartnik Samba Member
Joined: September 01, 2011 Posts: 5995 Location: Brooklyn
|
Posted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 11:09 am Post subject: Re: problem mounting European heallights with parking lamp |
|
|
static wrote: |
sjbartnik wrote: |
In other words, you'd be blinding oncoming drivers. |
You say that as if it's a bad thing. |
Blinding someone driving a 3500-lb. projectile toward you at 50 mph could be seen as a bad thing. _________________ 1965 Volkswagen 1500 Variant S
2000 Kawasaki W650 |
|
Back to top |
|
|
|