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h00drat
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Joined: May 31, 2016
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Location: Hood River
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 Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:05 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Well, it appears it was the high pressure oil switch.
Got home last night, check oil level, fired it up. Ran for a bit at idle, no oil escaping. Revved it up by hand while watching the motor, and sure enough, oil gushing out again. All I could tell was that it was was NEAR the distributor, which was my assumption given the two pools of oil over there sitting on top of the block.
Shut the motor down, cleaned up the oil spillage, put on a different 1.9 bar high pressure switch, then started over. Engine running, all the way to warm, with/without revving, and NO oil leakage at all.
The switch that was leaking was brand new. 100 mile on it. The one I put back on came with the motor. Just a bad switch, I guess.
Thinking I'll grab a backup low and high pressure switch to keep in the van from now on. Glad it was so easy to fix...but another 10 minutes on the side of the road and I probably would have found it and been back on the road. Oh well. Live and learn.
Some more tests drives this week, then camping this weekend 
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
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joetiger 
Samba Member
Joined: January 27, 2005
Posts: 5076
Location: denver
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| Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 8:23 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Glad to hear it wasn't the rear main seal!
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Joe T.
'86 NAHT Vanagon GL Syncro/ supercharged ABA 2.0 "Pigpen"
'04 GTI 1.8T
'04 Golf R32
"get metaphysical with it. if it's simply a means to get to and from places, it will let you down. if it becomes your zen, it can't fail you." -dabaron
"Still, it's good to be afield."--VWagabond
Available Now! Vanagon to Louisiana--A Two-Lane Reckoning Through Past and Present
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h00drat
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Joined: May 31, 2016
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Location: Hood River
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Vanagon Nut
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Joined: February 08, 2008
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Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:45 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| h00drat wrote: |
Well, it appears it was the high pressure oil switch.
The switch that was leaking was brand new. 100 mile on it. The one I put back on came with the motor. Just a bad switch, I guess.
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great news!
Did the switch leak at point between the switch plastic and metal or at threads?
Neil.
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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h00drat
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Location: Hood River
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Vanagon Nut
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Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:57 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| h00drat wrote: |
| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
Did the switch leak at point between the switch plastic and metal or at threads?
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I believe, but could be wrong, that it is between the metal and plastic. The rubber boot around the connector was full of oil. |
Ok. Figured that was the fail point but helpful to know. Thanks.
Neil.
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
VE7TBN |
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h00drat
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Joined: May 31, 2016
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Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:02 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Probably hard to see in the image, but you can see oil sitting in the lip between the metal and the plastic.
Manufacturer appears to be SIPEA, perhaps a Chinese outfit? Stamped 1.8 bar +/- .2 with a VW and AUDI logo, and part number. Made me think it was a genuine VW/AUDI part...but then I noticed the SIPEA stamp.
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
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Vanagon Nut
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Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 10:20 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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thanks for the pics.
Switch was new at time of install?
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
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h00drat
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tristessa
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h00drat
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Zeitgeist 13
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| Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:13 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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I've seen a few of them weep, but never fail as a significant point source of oil. On the WBX, I like to use some epoxy sealant around the perimeter seam of the switch located behind the pulley, 'cause it's such a chore to R&R
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Casey--
'89 Bluestar ALH w/12mm Waldo pump, PP764 and GT2052
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crazyvwvanman
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Joined: January 28, 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 3:19 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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That is an Italian company, used in cars from Maserati on down.
Mark
| h00drat wrote: |
.......
Manufacturer appears to be SIPEA, perhaps a Chinese outfit? Stamped 1.8 bar +/- .2 with a VW and AUDI logo, and part number. Made me think it was a genuine VW/AUDI part...but then I noticed the SIPEA stamp. ... |
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h00drat
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Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 1:21 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Still no oil leakage since going back to the previous high pressure switch. However, interesting thing happening.
Key on - oil light blinks like it should.
Start up van - oil light continues to blink until I A - start driving it, or B - rev the motor to around 2k RPM's.
I only bring this up because I want to make sure that my sensors are working correctly to avoid future issues.
I confirmed via a test light that the low pressure oil switch, the one on the front of the head grounds with the engine off. The test light should turn off when the engine starts. It doesn't. Which explains the oil light flashing after start up.
Revving the engine to 2k RPM's obviously increases pressure and causes the light to go off. It does NOT come back on at idle.
I guess I have concluded that oil switches and warning light are functioning correctly. So what does this mean? Low oil pressure at startup? Causes?
This was not an issue until after this weekends mishap.
Oil level is good.
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
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crazyvwvanman
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:06 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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One of the causes I have seen a few times is a bad oil pickup tube, when one from an old diesel Vanagon has been reused. There is an oil pressure relief valve built into the pickup tube and this valve can fail to close completely. When the engine is off this allows air into the tube which lets the oil drain out of the tube and the pump, back into the pan. Then when the engine starts and is turning slowly the mostly empty pump sucks air in through the leak instead of pulling oil up from the pan. When you speed up the engine the pump sucks hard enough that it draws oil back up the tube in spite of the small air leak. Once the pump is again full of oil it pumps strong enough even after the engine slows down to idle.
Don't know if this has anything to do with your situation but it does happen with old used diesel pickup tubes. Especially ones that are taken off of blown engines. Bits of metal from the failing engine get pulled into the tube and can cause the pressure relief piston to bind in the piston bore. Then the valve piston sticks. I stopped using old pickup tubes from blown engines after encountering this a couple times.
Mark |
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h00drat
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Vanagon Nut
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:17 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Just to rule out the high pressure switch as a cause and check function, with engine running, if you disconnect the high pressure switch then raise rpm to 2000 or more, does the oil light start flashing, buzzer sounds?
Neil.
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1988 West DIY 50º ABA
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h00drat
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Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:23 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
Just to rule out the high pressure switch as a cause and check function, with engine running, if you disconnect the high pressure switch then raise rpm to 2000 or more, does the oil light start flashing, buzzer sounds?
Neil. |
Good question. I have not tried this test. I have tested the low pressure switch with a test light, but have not done the high pressure buzzer test.
The low pressure switch turns on a test light with engine off (creating ground) with one end of test light on battery positive, then it SHOULD cause the light to turn off as soon as the engine starts. This was not the case on my last test.
Ruling out the high pressure switch is a good idea as well, though I don't know why this would cause issues at idle, or below 2k rpms.
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
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crazyvwvanman
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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The high pressure switch is ignored by the oil warning circuit board unless the circuit board sees tach pulses that tell it the engine is at or above about 2000 rpm.
Mark
| h00drat wrote: |
....
Ruling out the high pressure switch is a good idea as well, though I don't know why this would cause issues at idle, or below 2k rpms. |
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Vanagon Nut
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Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:44 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| h00drat wrote: |
| Vanagon Nut wrote: |
Just to rule out the high pressure switch as a cause and check function, with engine running, if you disconnect the high pressure switch then raise rpm to 2000 or more, does the oil light start flashing, buzzer sounds?
Neil. |
Good question. I have not tried this test. I have tested the low pressure switch with a test light, but have not done the high pressure buzzer test.
The low pressure switch turns on a test light with engine off (creating ground) with one end of test light on battery positive, then it SHOULD cause the light to turn off as soon as the engine starts. This was not the case on my last test.
Ruling out the high pressure switch is a good idea as well, though I don't know why this would cause issues at idle, or below 2k rpms. |
The high pressure switch itself shouldn't be related and maybe I'm off track with this thought but I figured why not double check function of the "L" board at dash in the process? But doing that high pressure switch test may only confirm that "L" board components etc related to the high pressure warning system, are working. The Vanagon Bentley would be clearer about that than me. And as you said-say, the low pressure switch is not opening (lifting ground) as soon as it should so that really seems to point to something to do with the switch or engine oiling system. Thankfully, if needed, as you know replacing the oil pickup tube is no big deal.
Could engine assembly lube still in system or not totally absorbed by the engine oil figure into this?
This is not a very good comparison, as I think you've done more engine rebuild work than me, and my block/crank likely had more miles on it and wasn't treated well, but fwiw, the light on my current ABA swap goes out right away. But I haven't put any miles on my work yet so time will tell!  And oddly enough, the red light stays out when engine is shut down then key immediately turned to ign on. Anyhow..... I'm side tracking.
edit: fwiw, I installed a new diesel pick up tube on my swap. As it was pointed out to me, scoring on the pressure relief valve looked pretty bad. And, that tube came off a 1.8/diesel parts swap that looked like it been pretty abused.
Neil.
If this provides any POV ....
clogged screen at old diesel pickup tube
pressure relief valve scoring
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
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Last edited by Vanagon Nut on Tue Jun 19, 2018 3:59 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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