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Paulbeard
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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 Posted: Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:00 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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What alternator are y'all using on these ABA-based motors? I have the stock Vanagon 90a and I am wondering if keeping two batteries topped up (they are not deeply discharged and are usually maintained with solar) is too much for it. I ran the main battery down by leaving my lights on last week and the squealing as it tried to catch up when I got it started was not what I wanted to hear. Without going to the serpentine belt, do I have other options?
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Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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h00drat
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2016
Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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Vanagon Nut
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Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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h00drat
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2016
Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 11:49 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Thanks Neil.
Got back from the coast last night and I have to say, I was very pleased with my cooling system. After the catastrophe I had last week I was a little nervous. The drive to the coast was HOT too, even hit some traffic, but the van maintained temp the whole time and didn't lose any fluid. I will keep a closer eye on my plastic connectors in the future.
As far as the trans goes, I'm not really sure what's next.
I am suspicious of the fact that so soon after the governor mod it started acting up, worse than before. Based on my reading, it sounds like leaky seals around the governor could cause slipping...maybe?? This at least sounds like an easy place to start.
What I find odd is that while driving at high speeds, in 3rd gear, I can get the motor to kick down exactly as it should, winds up to high rpm in 2nd, then shifts to 3rd perfectly smooth like it should. This gives me hope that my transmission isn't totally shot. Around town, very low rpm shifts are OK. Not perfect, but okay. It's mid range shifts, like between 2 and 4k rpm's from 2nd to 3rd where I have the biggest issue.
I don't know enough about how this transmission functions to make an educated guess as to what's going on in there. All I know is that it sucks.
Prior this trip I could mediate it by manually shifting from 2nd to drive, but on this trip it started slipping even when I did that. Still no issues in 1st/2nd or reverse, though.
Oh, and my gas tank which I use to only be able to smell gas from after fill ups finally started leaking after my last fill up. Guess I'll be running half tanks for a little while until I have time to drop the tank and reseal it.
Always somethin'!
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
CHC Top Thread
Engine Conversion Thread (2.0 ABA Swap)
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 1:24 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Wild ass guess.
I'm not certain, but possibly a torque converter issue like Blackgrasspirate was having..
maybe read thru his thread and see if the symptoms are similar.
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Vanagon Nut
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Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10379
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Tue Jul 31, 2018 10:31 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| h00drat wrote: |
Thanks Neil.
..... The drive to the coast was HOT too, even hit some traffic, but the van maintained temp the whole time and didn't lose any fluid. I will keep a closer eye on my plastic connectors in the future.
..... until I have time to drop the tank and reseal it.
Always somethin'! |
Glad to hear that. I find the same. Not that it's the only measure of cooling system health but generally, the coolant gauge needle doesn't move. It rises a little in stand still traffic, e.g. border crossing traffic, and that happens faster on a hot day. Of course the fan comes on soon after the needle rises. Yours' does as well? Descending long grades, the needle moves down a little which of course is normal.
You will find that as you drive the swap, you may notice other small small details like rubbing hoses, things that could be tethered better etc. All normal and good to watch for.
These are rolling antiques. 
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
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h00drat
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2016
Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 9:36 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| Paulbeard wrote: |
| What alternator are y'all using on these ABA-based motors? I have the stock Vanagon 90a and I am wondering if keeping two batteries topped up (they are not deeply discharged and are usually maintained with solar) is too much for it. I ran the main battery down by leaving my lights on last week and the squealing as it tried to catch up when I got it started was not what I wanted to hear. Without going to the serpentine belt, do I have other options? |
I think I am running a 120 on mine, but I could be wrong. I first one I picked up crapped out, so I got a Bosch rebuilt unit from NAPA. I have heard of people running all the way up to 140's I think.
I'm not sure I understand your serpentine belt question. Sorry for not being more help!
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
CHC Top Thread
Engine Conversion Thread (2.0 ABA Swap)
ABA Swap - Image Gallery
Auto Trans Rebuild - Image Gallery |
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Paulbeard
Samba Member
Joined: July 10, 2015
Posts: 2604
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 9:48 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| h00drat wrote: |
I think I am running a 120 on mine, but I could be wrong. I first one I picked up crapped out, so I got a Bosch rebuilt unit from NAPA. I have heard of people running all the way up to 140's I think.
I'm not sure I understand your serpentine belt question. Sorry for not being more help! |
Thanks. I wasn't even sure there were beefier ones.
Apparently, there are.
You might already be using the serpentine belt, vs the 2 or 3 V belts on many of these.
_________________
Currently -> Frida: 87 Tizian Red (mostly) Vanagon GL Westfalia w/ 2.0L ABA conversion
Formerly -> Steward of a 73 Super Beetle (Beater) and 67 Beetle 1300 (Little Max) both names by POs
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h00drat
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Vanagon Nut
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Joined: February 08, 2008
Posts: 10379
Location: Sunshine Coast B.C.
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 11:45 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| h00drat wrote: |
| Paulbeard wrote: |
| What alternator are y'all using on these ABA-based motors? I have the stock Vanagon 90a and I am wondering if keeping two batteries topped up (they are not deeply discharged and are usually maintained with solar) is too much for it. I ran the main battery down by leaving my lights on last week and the squealing as it tried to catch up when I got it started was not what I wanted to hear. Without going to the serpentine belt, do I have other options? |
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A house battery charger or charge converter might be useful option regardless of alternator/belt configurations.
Though its not quite the right way to do it, my onboard 7.x Amp Genius charger is used to to charge or maintain the batteries and help run the fridge when connected to shore power. It has a "power supply" mode but I've never used it.
I'd have to double check but I'm nearly certain my stock early 90's Mk3 alternator is 90 Amps. It's a Bosch rebuilt that c/w the engine prior to the swap install. It and coolant pump run off a 6 PK serp belt. For some years, the starter, aux group 42, aux group 27 were connected to the alternator BUT.... the 27, and later the aux 42 (switched to panel feed) were mostly maintained by a 140 Watt solar panel. The 27 usually gets drawn down the most. Even though it's connected via #8 wire, I suspect that the 42 was, at times, being undercharged. But the alternator charge system kept my starter battery in good shape. It was 9 years old when pulled and still worked.
Neil.
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1981 Westy DIY 15º ABA
1988 West DIY 50º ABA
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h00drat
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Joined: May 31, 2016
Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2018 3:41 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Still spinning on this transmission thing. I noticed some ATF around the outside of the governor housing, so I ordered the seal kit. Even if it doesn't solve the problem it's one less leak, I guess.
Anyway...as a point of clarity, it became increasingly obvious today while driving that the slip depends entirely on load. For example...
Shifting going down hill, zero to little throttle, no slip at all.
Shifting on flat ground, moderate throttle, moderate load, moderate slip.
Shifting with heavy exelleration OR going up hill and major slippage.
My grandfather-in-law is in town and he's a very experienced mechanic. He said while riding in it...basically it feels like it's shifting back into neutral between 2nd and 3rd. I hadn't thought of it this way before, and I don't know if it changes anything, but it is a good description of what it feels like.
Just trying to get my thoughts out there in case something clicks. He didn't think torque converter could be a culprit.
I still question 2nd gear piston / brake band. Though the other night after our trip I tightened the adjuster nut on the brake band another 1/4 turn and it didn't appear to make any difference.
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
CHC Top Thread
Engine Conversion Thread (2.0 ABA Swap)
ABA Swap - Image Gallery
Auto Trans Rebuild - Image Gallery |
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danfromsyr
Samba Member
Joined: March 01, 2004
Posts: 15144
Location: Syracuse, NY
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 6:39 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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this sounds like you may not yet be done with the throttle manual valve adjustment.. move it another 1/4" fore/aft and note the change. you may be just on the cusp of soft/firm shifting input. if in doubt make the adjustments to move the lever more forward (stiffer)
| h00drat wrote: |
Still spinning on this transmission thing. I noticed some ATF around the outside of the governor housing, so I ordered the seal kit. Even if it doesn't solve the problem it's one less leak, I guess.
Anyway...as a point of clarity, it became increasingly obvious today while driving that the slip depends entirely on load. For example...
Shifting going down hill, zero to little throttle, no slip at all.
Shifting on flat ground, moderate throttle, moderate load, moderate slip.
Shifting with heavy exelleration OR going up hill and major slippage.
My grandfather-in-law is in town and he's a very experienced mechanic. He said while riding in it...basically it feels like it's shifting back into neutral between 2nd and 3rd. I hadn't thought of it this way before, and I don't know if it changes anything, but it is a good description of what it feels like.
Just trying to get my thoughts out there in case something clicks. He didn't think torque converter could be a culprit.
I still question 2nd gear piston / brake band. Though the other night after our trip I tightened the adjuster nut on the brake band another 1/4 turn and it didn't appear to make any difference. |
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h00drat
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2016
Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:03 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| danfromsyr wrote: |
this sounds like you may not yet be done with the throttle manual valve adjustment.. move it another 1/4" fore/aft and note the change. you may be just on the cusp of soft/firm shifting input. if in doubt make the adjustments to move the lever more forward (stiffer)
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This may be true. I will see if I have any adjustment left fore/aft. If not, I may have to have another throttle cable plate made with more room for adjustment.
If I move the rear plate forward, more, I assume I will also have to make an adjustment under the gas pedal to compensate as well.
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
CHC Top Thread
Engine Conversion Thread (2.0 ABA Swap)
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Auto Trans Rebuild - Image Gallery |
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mikemtnbike
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Joined: March 26, 2015
Posts: 2797
Location: North Carolina
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:03 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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I'm no expert but I will observe again that I'm very surprised by how important, and sensitive, the throttle linkage adjustment is on the 010. Getting it better on my van has made a world of difference, I'd definitely try dan's suggestions before diving into internals or calling GTA or whatever your next steps would be.
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1991 Vanagon GL 2.1 AT Westfauxlia. "Frankie" Totaled  https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=764510&highlight=carnage
1995 Eurovan Camper "Marzivan"
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h00drat
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2016
Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Thu Aug 02, 2018 8:57 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| mikemtnbike wrote: |
| I'm no expert but I will observe again that I'm very surprised by how important, and sensitive, the throttle linkage adjustment is on the 010. Getting it better on my van has made a world of difference, I'd definitely try dan's suggestions before diving into internals or calling GTA or whatever your next steps would be. |
It does appear to be quite sensitive...and also fairly easy to adjust. Much easier than digging into internals, that's for sure.
Worth consideration is the fact that the governor mod changed my RPM shift point...so perhaps the throttle linkage needs to be adjusted as well to compensate for this? I don't know...just trying to justify this as a likely solution. Will find out tonight
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
CHC Top Thread
Engine Conversion Thread (2.0 ABA Swap)
ABA Swap - Image Gallery
Auto Trans Rebuild - Image Gallery |
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h00drat
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2016
Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 8:55 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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The throttle cable adjustment piece on the motor was shifted as far forward as it could go. I shifted it BACK a 1/4 of an inch just to see what would happen. It may have made it a little better, but still struggling a bit at times.
I may have another plate made with more room for adjustment. It's a temperamental thing, but I'm glad that external adjustments are doing something. Gives me hope that I don't need a new tranny (at least not quite yet)...just need to spend some time adjusting things.
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
CHC Top Thread
Engine Conversion Thread (2.0 ABA Swap)
ABA Swap - Image Gallery
Auto Trans Rebuild - Image Gallery |
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82westyrabbit
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Joined: March 02, 2015
Posts: 969
Location: Ma
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| Posted: Fri Aug 03, 2018 2:53 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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| Sorry I an no help with automatic transmissions. To paulbeard I am also running the 6pk serpent belt. My van has no power steering and no air conditioning. So if you decide to up grade I have most of the pullys left over from my project. John |
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h00drat
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2016
Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 4:34 pm Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Losing hope that I don't actually need a transmission rebuild.
Shifting the plate back didn't help, so I shifted it back forward (as far as it will go) and I'm back to where I was. I still may modify the plate to shift further forward just to see what happens 
At this point, slipping is still happening and things are progressively getting worse. Wonky up AND down shifts. Occasional shutters (bad torque converter?). Just weird stuff all around. Unless going downhill, it acts like it has no idea what gear it should be in, unless I floor it, then it can sort of figure it out, which is the only thing giving me hope that throttle position lever might still make a difference.
After reading an article on "how a torque converter works" I can now see why you thought this might be culprit, Dan. It definitely feels, at times, like the engine is spinning and the torque converter just simply isn't engaging the drive shaft. I just simply don't have the understanding of an automatic transmission to make any knowledgable assessment.
At this point I definitely feel like I'm running around in circles, so if nothing else, I may pay a pro to properly diagnose it before I start throwing money at it.
It feels fishy that it really started acting up shortly after I did the governor mod. But I don't really know what that means
As a precaution, I checked a few things...
1. Replaced governor seal (it was leaking) - made no difference
2. Checked gear oil to see if I have mixing issues - not high, so no signs of ATF > gear oil leak
3. Checked ATF after last long drive. Normal level.
Aside from throttle position lever and 2nd gear brake band, I'm running out of "external" adjustments. If I can't get it, then I have to assume it's either fried clutch packs or bad torque convertor...I think.
Edit: I feel like I should probably move my transmission ramblings from this to my other transmission thread that I started a while ago...especially since it's not really motor swap related, which is where this thread started. So sorry if ya'll are getting more tranny talk here than you'd like. Motor is still running well
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
CHC Top Thread
Engine Conversion Thread (2.0 ABA Swap)
ABA Swap - Image Gallery
Auto Trans Rebuild - Image Gallery |
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h00drat
Samba Member
Joined: May 31, 2016
Posts: 881
Location: Hood River
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| Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 8:08 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Well just like that, no more go. At least not forward.
All forward gears appear to be out, regardless of shift level position (1, 2, D) but reverse still works.
I had heard reverse is typically the first to go, so this is a little weird. At any rate, rebuild in the future. Just bought a house, so $$ and time are limited at the moment.
Thanks again for all the input and for following along is this crazy little journey.
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<<Tyler>>
1987.5 Wolfsburg Weekender / CHC / 2.0 ABA
CHC Top Thread
Engine Conversion Thread (2.0 ABA Swap)
ABA Swap - Image Gallery
Auto Trans Rebuild - Image Gallery |
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tristessa
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Joined: April 07, 2004
Posts: 3992
Location: Portland, OR
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| Posted: Tue Aug 21, 2018 10:58 am Post subject: Re: 2.0 ABA Swap |
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Let me know if you need a hand with things -- I'm leaving my job at the end of August and could probably spare a day or two. Not terribly familiar with the inner workings of the automatic but I can turn wrenches and provide grunt labor. |
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