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Volktales Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2013 Posts: 545 Location: Nanaimo, B.C. CANADA
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Posted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 11:21 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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The fenders still have not arrived, so doing some more polishing...
Amazing how much fade there was and how much original colour is coming back.
Front is finally done. Not too much left to do now. Hope it drives just fine...
Peeling some much newer stickers off the back window revealed the original 48 year old decal. That is going to stay...
Thanks so far to the help from members on this site with my questions. _________________ 1974 "Restfalia" Camper 2000 cc EFI 2001-
1970 Beetle first car, rotten, yard art 1985-
1966 Sunroof Beetle, restored 1998-
1964 Ghia, ongoing project 2007-
1962 Beetle Beryl,original paint survivor 2012-
1970 Savannah Beige Beetle 2012-
1992 16v GTI, 100% stock 2006-
1991 "Terseo", wife's old daily 1995-
1969 Chevrolet CST/10 (family owned since new)
1965 Gold Corvair Monza 2021-
1966 and 1965 Monza 2022- |
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ataraxia Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2010 Posts: 4504 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 8:02 am Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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What did you use to clean/polish the paint? |
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Volktales Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2013 Posts: 545 Location: Nanaimo, B.C. CANADA
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Posted: Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:23 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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ataraxia wrote: |
What did you use to clean/polish the paint? |
The paint was pretty bad, so I used 2000 grit sandpaper with lots of water, followed by an old bottle of Meguiar's cutting compound. This stuff was supposed to be applied with a power polisher, but I don't have one so did it by hand. Then waxed it with another old Meguiar's wax. Hard work but satisfying to do... _________________ 1974 "Restfalia" Camper 2000 cc EFI 2001-
1970 Beetle first car, rotten, yard art 1985-
1966 Sunroof Beetle, restored 1998-
1964 Ghia, ongoing project 2007-
1962 Beetle Beryl,original paint survivor 2012-
1970 Savannah Beige Beetle 2012-
1992 16v GTI, 100% stock 2006-
1991 "Terseo", wife's old daily 1995-
1969 Chevrolet CST/10 (family owned since new)
1965 Gold Corvair Monza 2021-
1966 and 1965 Monza 2022- |
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ataraxia Samba Member
Joined: March 19, 2010 Posts: 4504 Location: Illinois
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Posted: Sun Mar 11, 2018 7:01 am Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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Volktales wrote: |
ataraxia wrote: |
What did you use to clean/polish the paint? |
The paint was pretty bad, so I used 2000 grit sandpaper with lots of water, followed by an old bottle of Meguiar's cutting compound. This stuff was supposed to be applied with a power polisher, but I don't have one so did it by hand. Then waxed it with another old Meguiar's wax. Hard work but satisfying to do... |
You got some pretty nice results! My car has an incorrect color respray and it has faded and doesn't hold a shine at all. I'm going to repaint the car in the future but I might test out a fender or door with your method. I tried a couple of different 'old paint polishing compounds' and they didn't deliver much of an improvement. |
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Volktales Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2013 Posts: 545 Location: Nanaimo, B.C. CANADA
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Posted: Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:38 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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So the new fenders have finally arrived. And there are issues...
Here the fender is clamped to an original opposite side fender. Notice that huge alignment issue below the headlight? This is not even close and is nowhere near fitting on the car...
Another angle shows how far out this is. And no it is not possible to "flex" it into position either. It is really that far out of whack. Did the fiberglass cure incorrectly? Is their mold distorted? Note that the left fender was OK in this regard.
From the backside you can see how far distorted it is as well. And that is not the only problem...
Far too much material has been trimmed off the mounting flange. You can see the hole location will not work at all. It is not just in this one section, but most of the flange has been cut off too short..
The owner of this car who ordered these fenders talked to the vendor before buying them. He was assured that they were very good quality, and that other than drilling your own mounting holes and trim holes and bumper slots, they were ready to install. I was concerned about mounting the headlights and the owner was told the original parts would just bolt right in. Nope, that is BS. The vendor DID supply poorly made generic fiberglass headlight bowls without any lip or any way of attaching them to the fender, short of bonding them in place with more fiberglass. Nice. And there of course is no proper way of mounting the headlight retainers or trim rings anyway... I figured the best way is to bond in the original steel bowls from the rusted out fenders, but then one of the originals was unsurprisingly pretty far gone. Not happy that this is necessary anyway...
So what to do about this situation? I expected that these would need some work to fit on the car, but adding material to the flanges, and reshaping the lower corner of the fender is beyond my skill set. The headlight bowls make me unhappy, and in reality the fender surfaces will need a lot of work to get straight as there are many flaws in the molding. This situation is causing the project to come to a dead stop and I am not sure what to do... The owner has spent some large $ for these parts and the shipping costs mean returning them is not really an option...
Not happy at all... _________________ 1974 "Restfalia" Camper 2000 cc EFI 2001-
1970 Beetle first car, rotten, yard art 1985-
1966 Sunroof Beetle, restored 1998-
1964 Ghia, ongoing project 2007-
1962 Beetle Beryl,original paint survivor 2012-
1970 Savannah Beige Beetle 2012-
1992 16v GTI, 100% stock 2006-
1991 "Terseo", wife's old daily 1995-
1969 Chevrolet CST/10 (family owned since new)
1965 Gold Corvair Monza 2021-
1966 and 1965 Monza 2022- |
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Clatter Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2003 Posts: 7537 Location: Santa Cruz
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Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 7:57 am Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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Dag, that sucks.
With fenders becoming such a challenge, it sucks to see these fiberglass ones getting a half-ass implementation..
I saw the rear apron replacement those guys sell,
and wasn't particularly impressed with it either.
Gerson stepped up and made Type 3 floorpans; that's a very good sign.
Tried to send him an NOS apron to use as a pattern to start making aprons,
But he drug his heels too long, and i had to put it onto my car.
How cool would it be if he tooled up to make fenders?
Those are some big big dies to fab up,
And Type 3 people are the cheapest cheapasses of the already-notoriously-cheap VW community.
So, until more people with money start into these cars, we'll just have to be paying the 'time' side of the 'time is money' equation;
As in time to start fabbing up rust patch pieces,
or time to start tooling up to do fiberglass repair.
After doing a whole set of front fenders clear apart and back,
I can tell you it's a lot of work.
The headlight buckets are pretty straightforward,
but those rear splash pans are no fun at all.
My mistake was to do the fender and the splash pan at the same time,
As a result, the OG shape was lost.
Best to do one or the other completely first, so it can be used as a template to fit the other part,
Then do the other, after the first is done and right.
If that makes any sense.. _________________ Bus Motor Build
What’s That Noise?!? |
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Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22413 Location: Kimball, Mi
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Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 12:37 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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I hate to say it, but I'd bite the bullet and look for a set of steel fenders. Contact Joel (aka Boo-Koo-Z) and see if he's got a good pair he'll sell you. Look in the classifieds as well. I only say that as you'll never be happy with the fiberglass ones with all the rework that's needed. _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Mike Fisher Samba Member
Joined: January 30, 2006 Posts: 17970 Location: Eugene, OR
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Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:07 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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That tan squareback in Norway has fiberglass front fenders that look good. Yours are already bought & paid for, so you might as well bolt them on and cut/patch them to fit. Cut/slice the flange enough to get it bent into a better angle. Don't use fiberglass cloth on the outside. Fiberglass is is easier than steel to get perfectly smooth anyway!
I was telling a couple guys at Dubs & Donuts last Saturday how nice your original paint was color sanding@2000grit & polishing out! _________________ https://imgur.com/user/FisherSquareback/posts
69 FI/AT square Daily Driver
66 sunroof,67,70,71,71,71AT,72,72AT,73 Parts
two 57 oval ragtops sold
'68 Karmann Ghia sold
Society is like stew. If you don't keep it stirred up you end up with a lot of scum on the top! - Russ_Wolfe/Edward Abbey |
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Volktales Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2013 Posts: 545 Location: Nanaimo, B.C. CANADA
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Posted: Tue Apr 03, 2018 9:59 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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Thanks for the advice. We all would have preferred steel fenders, but rust free versions are simply extinct in this area. Even my memories of type 3's in the late 70's were of bubbling and holed fenders. For us, the shipping cost is a killer outside of the USA as well. Those new fibreglass fenders were over $1000 by the time they arrived! The owner has been informed of the quality issues, and it is up to him to see if he wants to deal with the vendor again. If shipping costs were not soooo high, you can bet that they would be returned...
Between myself and the owner, we have eight steel fenders to choose from, and every one of them is a rotten mess. The owner searched for rust free ones online before pulling the trigger on the fibreglass, and nothing worthwhile could be found at the time. I am assuming everyone with a decent spare set is hoarding them. I know that I would!!!
Another friend who has some fibreglass experience is going to see what he can do, but he must finish a major house renovation first. Looks like things may be sitting for awhile... _________________ 1974 "Restfalia" Camper 2000 cc EFI 2001-
1970 Beetle first car, rotten, yard art 1985-
1966 Sunroof Beetle, restored 1998-
1964 Ghia, ongoing project 2007-
1962 Beetle Beryl,original paint survivor 2012-
1970 Savannah Beige Beetle 2012-
1992 16v GTI, 100% stock 2006-
1991 "Terseo", wife's old daily 1995-
1969 Chevrolet CST/10 (family owned since new)
1965 Gold Corvair Monza 2021-
1966 and 1965 Monza 2022- |
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W1K1 Samba Member
Joined: March 04, 2004 Posts: 4919 Location: Southern AB
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Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 10:35 am Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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That's a really shitty version of a fender, they should have at least put a ring in for the bowl to fit in or had it added after. Fiberglass is at least easy to work with if you have to add material.
I don't like the fact that they used the chopped mat for the "glass", you end up with a lot more epoxy & less glass to make up the thickness. The bug fenders we have used have been from Creative car craft and they were all cloth layup so a really nice finished product. We drilled turn signal holes , fender holes and bumper bracket holes, and took them to the body shop. They thought they were great, very little prep to get paint ready. _________________ http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/manuals/jim_martin_engine_build.php
1973 super
1965 squareback 1500E
1971 bay window westy- subi swap |
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Volktales Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2013 Posts: 545 Location: Nanaimo, B.C. CANADA
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Posted: Fri Apr 06, 2018 11:16 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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Talked to the owner tonight. He is going to search for some decent steel fenders. In the meantime, we will put the best of the rusty ones on for now to make the car mobile, and at least road test it. This is not really the course of action we hoped for, but it will have to do for now... _________________ 1974 "Restfalia" Camper 2000 cc EFI 2001-
1970 Beetle first car, rotten, yard art 1985-
1966 Sunroof Beetle, restored 1998-
1964 Ghia, ongoing project 2007-
1962 Beetle Beryl,original paint survivor 2012-
1970 Savannah Beige Beetle 2012-
1992 16v GTI, 100% stock 2006-
1991 "Terseo", wife's old daily 1995-
1969 Chevrolet CST/10 (family owned since new)
1965 Gold Corvair Monza 2021-
1966 and 1965 Monza 2022- |
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Clatter Samba Member
Joined: September 24, 2003 Posts: 7537 Location: Santa Cruz
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Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:52 am Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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Once you dive in and get tooled up for it,
Glass can be easy to work with.. FWIW. _________________ Bus Motor Build
What’s That Noise?!? |
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Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22413 Location: Kimball, Mi
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Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2018 1:25 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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Clatter wrote: |
Once you dive in and get tooled up for it,
Glass can be easy to work with.. FWIW. |
Yeah, but they still need that inner lip added so they could be bolted on. If I didn't know better, I'd say those fenders were made for drag racing. _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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Volktales Samba Member
Joined: June 21, 2013 Posts: 545 Location: Nanaimo, B.C. CANADA
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Posted: Sun Apr 15, 2018 10:14 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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Sooo, here is a bit of an update...
While pondering on the fender situation, I have been continuing with the polishing of the ancient paint job. Door done, now onto the rear fender...
I bought a small dense foam sanding block, and am continuing to use the 2000 grit sandpaper, followed by polishing compound and wax. Is working decently, but lots of effort by hand. Then the owner showed up today...
I recently bought an extremely rotten '69 Fastback parts car that was nicely covered in slime, mold, and moss. This is living at my friend's place, which is also the owner of the Notch. Anyway he took a closer look at the RF fender on the car, and stated it was much better then the rest of the car. And it actually was! Unusual in that there was zero undercoating on the back side, an no remaining paint either. At least moisture had not been trapped against the metal, so the rot was not that bad.
There is no rust out whatsoever around the headlight area. This is extremely rare for this area. There are a few pinholes on the top near the door, and some rust out in the bottom/back of the fender. Overall much better than any other fender we have...
The best fender he had for the left side is off an earlier car and would need modification to the turn signal area, and the trim clip holes are much bigger. Otherwise this fits well, although there is previous bondo repairs that are failing as usual...
At least these two are usable, and could be properly repaired by a metalworker. The owner would still prefer some better examples for this car, but these might be the best available from what we have seen At least the project is continuing now... _________________ 1974 "Restfalia" Camper 2000 cc EFI 2001-
1970 Beetle first car, rotten, yard art 1985-
1966 Sunroof Beetle, restored 1998-
1964 Ghia, ongoing project 2007-
1962 Beetle Beryl,original paint survivor 2012-
1970 Savannah Beige Beetle 2012-
1992 16v GTI, 100% stock 2006-
1991 "Terseo", wife's old daily 1995-
1969 Chevrolet CST/10 (family owned since new)
1965 Gold Corvair Monza 2021-
1966 and 1965 Monza 2022- |
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Bobnotch Samba Member
Joined: July 06, 2003 Posts: 22413 Location: Kimball, Mi
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Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:00 am Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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At this point in time, I'd repair those for now and use them. I'd also keep an eye out for a better pair. I did that back in 2000 when I first did my 65 Notch, and 3 years later came across a better pair. My son ended up with my old pair. _________________ Bob 65 Notch S with Sunroof
71 Notch ...aka Krunchy; build pics here;
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=249390 -been busy working
64 T-34 Ghia...aka Wolfie, under construction... http://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=412120
Tram wrote: |
"Friends are God's way of apologizing for relatives." |
Tram wrote: |
People keep confusing "restored" and "restroyed". |
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rosiensandiego Samba Member
Joined: February 07, 2016 Posts: 12
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Posted: Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:50 pm Post subject: Re: 1969 Canadian spec Notchback project |
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Great thread! _________________ Cheers
Rosie in San Diego |
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