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/New-to-Me Engine, what's missing
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Goach2
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 2:59 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Thanks, I do have a printout in the bus, it's just low-quality. Even the original image is. I'll have to scan one from the book I suppose.
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Wildthings
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 5:56 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Goach2 wrote:
Thanks, I do have a printout in the bus, it's just low-quality. Even the original image is. I'll have to scan one from the book I suppose.


The '79 diagram is pretty clear and almost the same as any other FI'd bus drawing. As far as differences it doesn't have the diagnostic wires and shows a Hall ignition setup verses points and condenser. As a big plus, it has the legend running across the bottom of the page verses being on a separate page.
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Goach2
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 16, 2018 7:35 am    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Good tip, thanks Wildthings.
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Goach2
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 29, 2018 8:09 am    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Still waiting on my order from German Supply. I was told it 'likely' shipped out a week ago. Would only take one day to get to my place. Couple of emails and calls and still no response. I have read of others having the same experience, so I was prepared for some delay. I will keep everyone posted on when it is received or I get a response to my inquiries.
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Goach2
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 30, 2018 2:01 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Parts came in, looks like I'm going to be pretty busy for a few days Wink

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Anyone know the best way to crimp hose clamps? I doubt I have the proper tool for it.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 31, 2018 11:32 am    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Goach2 wrote:
Still waiting on my order from German Supply. I was told it 'likely' shipped out a week ago. Would only take one day to get to my place. Couple of emails and calls and still no response. I have read of others having the same experience, so I was prepared for some delay. I will keep everyone posted on when it is received or I get a response to my inquiries.


It's unfortunate that this situation hasn't since changed. I would order so many more parts from them if it wasn't for the complete roll of the dice as to if/when they end up shipping. If I can get it anywhere else first, I will.
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Goach2
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:54 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

So, I'm ready to start putting a whole lotta new and painted parts back on my engine. The only thing I am hesitant about right now is the dirt on the engine itself. I REALLY don't want to pull any more parts off of it to clean/paint, but I would like to do something relatively quick to clean it up. Is this a 'soap and water' thing? Or is there another way to cut this grime? It's not overly greasy, just dirty...

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:04 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Suggestion:

Remove the remaining tinwork for painting and then use a steel brush on a dremel and /or a die grinder with brushes to do some "deep cleaning". Compressed air to blow it off.

Then coat the remaining parts of the engine with Gibbs Lubricant and wipe off. 2 coats please.
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Goach2
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:32 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Argh! This is just feeding my OCD tendencies! I'm never going to get this done!

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Is there a Canadian alternative to Gibbs?
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Goach2
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 1:09 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Any alternatives to Gibbs? Can't seem to find it in the North and import is waay to expensive!
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:12 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

OK, here I go again with another curmudgeonly rant,
Hope you can see what i'm saying here without getting offended..


Not really sure what your goals are with this first run through the engine..

Good for learning, and perhaps making any mistakes now, before you mess up a future good engine..?

Also to get it dressed down and given any chance of running right, too..?


However,
With as much dirt is on the thing, it's bound to get into the motor.
How much dirt fell into the distributor hole when you pulled it out?

There is a very soft brass gear that drives the distributor, and if it gets nicked,
Then your timing will always be erratic.
The crank has to come out to fix this.


These busses very often lived a hard and thankless life.
Most of them were used up and crushed in the late 80s or 90s.
Almost all of them have been monkeyed by a PO.
The chance that you got one of the 35 remaining 'good when parked' type 4 bus motors on earth is pretty slim.
Especially when looking at it..
These busses are NOTHING like a normal water-cooled car when it comes to how they are taken care of, and how you approach reviving one from the dead.


What I'm getting at, is that you are more likely to have good results if you get it out/apart for a check-out.

Even cleaning the motor up is WAY easier on the stand.
The cooling is all done by those little fins and the fan,
And some of your fins are clogged solid with packed dirt/grease in your pic there.


So,
Check out the recent thread by user 'KentPS' here.
He took a bus in similar shape as yours to success.



If your goal is to eventually get it reliable and running to go on a trip or something,
Then it will need pulled out and apart for inspection/cleaning.

If your goal is to gamble a few parts, and see if the motor is a good one,
Otherwise, you will throw in the towel, and sell or give it away,
Then you are on the right track.

What you risk by doing like you are,
Is some crap falling into the motor,
Or a valve hitting a piston,
or other damage, that will be a real setback/bummer,
Should you end up actually doing it right one day.
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Clatter
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 2:13 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

The most common failure on these is a dropped valve seat.

Pull the heads and see if that's the case with yours.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 5:39 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

From under the valve covers, everything appears to be lined up valve-wise. I'd love to drop the engine and crack it open, but for personal reasons, i don't have time. If I can get it running for the summer, I'm not opposed to dropping it next winter.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 6:14 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Goach2 wrote:
Anyone know the best way to crimp hose clamps? I doubt I have the proper tool for it.

https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/7-in-cutting-nipper-pliers/A-p2929537e
Quote:
Any alternatives to Gibbs? Can't seem to find it in the North and import is waay to expensive!

https://www.princessauto.com/en/detail/fluid-film-penetrant-and-lubricant/A-p6420392e

I agree with Clatter, but if you are bent on using it as is don't plan any long trips and make sure your CAA coverage is up to date and covers long tows.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:35 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

So this is never going to be a daily driver and won't be going far this year at all. Would a head removal be enough to appease the Gods for now? I don't know if I'm willing to attempt this yet, but if it will increase my chances of not blowing it up, then it's a consideration.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2018 7:54 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

You are in fairly deep now, a little further can catch potential failures before they do something that demotes your rebuildable engine parts to boat anchor status. If a valve lets go it takes out alot of other parts in the process, a peek inside can really improve how you sleep at night and makes those longer trips hard to say no to.
You say it's not going far now, but once you start driving it you'll likley start having other thoughts, why not be prepared?
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 1:56 am    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

I'll be the one to say it,
So apologies in advance..


That video of it "running" made me cringe.
It was like "Shut it off!! Shut it off!! It's gonna blow!"


But I have been wrong before..

Sometimes a bus doesn't get parked because the motor went bad.



At least it's a physical possibility...
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:17 am    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Ya, that video was before I adjusted the valves. It was starting much better afterwards, but only for 10-15 seconds before it died. It didn't have any intake or vac lines at the time.

If it's just a matter of pulling the heads to have a look, can I do that without pulling the engine? Obviously it would be easier, but I don't really have that luxury right now. If I can pull them, what are the 'have-to-haves' I will need to replace before I reassemble? (Assuming everything checks out) I will look for some good examples of the process, but can I post pics here once it is apart? I don't know what to look for, as this will be my first attempt.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 3:51 pm    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

Ok, manual says heads off only after the engine is dropped. What gaskets/replacement parts will I need to reassemble? What am I looking for under the head? What is this feeling of impending doom?
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 8:47 am    Post subject: Re: /New-to-Me Engine, what's missing Reply with quote

One of those things that happen over time when these things set long-term is the gaskets all dry out.
A new full engine gasket set doesn't cost that much.
Gives you a chance to replace any old failed ones,
And also put into place any that a PO didn't install.

When you pull the heads, then you can pop them apart and see what is going on.
Even a regular old radiator-car shop can dis-assemble and check them for you.
If they are decent, get the valve job touched up, and everything 100% clean.

At that point, you can also check out the P&L, and inspect the rod bearings.
Many of these motors are still OK in the bottom end.
Did a couple of top-end-only rebuilds that lasted quite a while..

You can also check the lifters and cam with the top-end off.

If any of this shows up as bad, you will be way better off fixing it first,
And not have it all come apart in the middle of your first trip...


See,
Rear-engine air-coolers are kind of a bad design in a way..
The fan sucks up the dust cloud that follows every car down the road,
And pumps it over the motor constantly.
Once you get oil leaks, the leaking oil is always fed a steady supply of dust,
As this sludge builds up, it insulates the cooling fins, preventing them from doing their job.
With no cooling, the motor fries.

So,
Unless you have the fins all clean, your motor doesn't really stand much of a chance.

Additionally,
Every little fiddly piece of ductwork/tin that the PO leaves off of the motor allows the cooling air to leak away.
Again,
Frying the motor.

That's when i see something missing parts and covered in sludge, i say "Fried!"

That's why I'm this big pessimist/skeptic when i see something like this..

There's this romantic "find an old bus and get it running and go travel" thing,
But it doesn't include the harsh reality of what most people are bound to find and start out with..
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