| Author |
Message |
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
 Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:12 pm Post subject: RAT Performance engine case Type 4 |
 |
|
Hello. Im looking for an a really good rebuildable engine case for a type 4. Most likely id build the motor myself but i need a good starting point. I started a topic about where to start and the information was great about what to measure and how everything needed to be. Because I live the east coast and an not really able to travel (because i can't drive) I wouldn't be able to go and measure a case and inspect it for wear. I also can't spend a few hundred on a case then need it to be machined or fixed by someone else. So i need a place then can get me a really good type 4 engine case from a 914. I hear RAT sells them but they have no prices online. Has anyone gotten one from them? If not where can i buy a good case. Even one that has machine work done to it to build a bigger motor. I want to build a 2600cc so im assuming it will need machine work. So anywhere that sells them or where yo get one is great. Thanks for any tips or advice!
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Pruneman99
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2012
Posts: 5013
Location: Oceanside
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:25 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| What's your definition of a few hundred? A good case is going to cost. Any case you find will have a visit to the machine shop unless you just bought it from a machine shop that just worked it over. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:38 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| Pruneman99 wrote: |
| What's your definition of a few hundred? A good case is going to cost. Any case you find will have a visit to the machine shop unless you just bought it from a machine shop that just worked it over. |
 do you know what machine shops charge? In willing to spend what it costs. But hopefully not too much. 
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
raygreenwood
Samba Member
Joined: November 24, 2008
Posts: 21512
Location: Oklahoma City
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 5:43 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| sshulk wrote: |
| Hello. Im looking for an a really good rebuildable engine case for a type 4. Most likely id build the motor myself but i need a good starting point. I started a topic about where to start and the information was great about what to measure and how everything needed to be. Because I live the east coast and an not really able to travel (because i can't drive) I wouldn't be able to go and measure a case and inspect it for wear. I also can't spend a few hundred on a case then need it to be machined or fixed by someone else. So i need a place then can get me a really good type 4 engine case from a 914. I hear RAT sells them but they have no prices online. Has anyone gotten one from them? If not where can i buy a good case. Even one that has machine work done to it to build a bigger motor. I want to build a 2600cc so im assuming it will need machine work. So anywhere that sells them or where yo get one is great. Thanks for any tips or advice! |
Really....it will either need an align bore or it will not. If you can do your own measuring.....then the case you want to order will be the one that is in your price range including shipping.....and has no visible damage in the crank bores or any bosses or parts cracked off.
While its nice to get a case that is known to be from a 914.....the 914 guys continuallly insist that its "special" and price it accordingly....at about 3X normal.....without even realizing that there is "0" differences between a 411/412 1.7L or 1.8L case.....including the series. Not one thing....same assembly line.
It would be just as well to get one from a 411 or 412.....so you could just look for cases of those series....W, EA, EB, EC.
Really a well cared for bus case will be just fine as well and is about 75% of what you will find....difference being that in about half of them.....it will probably need an align bore if its high miles.....but half do not.
So look for the big things....like cracked and broken parts and gouged main bores.
Personally....I would also stick to the two relief case....pre hydraulic lifters. Its just been my experience that the hydros wear the lifter bores a little more.
I havd bought a few used parts from Jake at RAT. Superb service....superb parts condition. Most probably.....any case you buy there will be more expenaive but will have been checked snd in known condition and may already have some work done to it. If they are in your budget....I would not hesitate to buy from them.
Ray |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
jsturtlebuggy
Samba Member
Joined: August 24, 2005
Posts: 4496
Location: Fair Oaks/Orangevale, CA
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:07 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
edit.
_________________
Joseph
Fair Oaks/Orangevale, CA
Elrod Motorsports
Motion Tire Motorsports
Having fun with Dune Buggies since 1970
Into Volkswagens since 1960
Last edited by jsturtlebuggy on Mon Dec 18, 2017 8:19 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:28 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
Yeah i can share no problem. So i have saved up 1600 dollars. Not that much i know. But i work everyday and pull in around 800 per month. Throw in snowblowing in the winter. Plus I will get a day job in the summer.also may sell my computer for 1000 dollars. I really don't have a budget. Im willing to spend what it costs. When the money comes in it goes towards the car.
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:43 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
I see on this website .5 bore size. What does that mean?
I see this website also offers machine. What would i need to be done machining wise to turn a stock 914 case into a 2600cc type 4. What needs to be done ?
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Pruneman99
Samba Member
Joined: February 22, 2012
Posts: 5013
Location: Oceanside
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 6:50 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
Yes I'm very aware of machine shop prices. You have to pay to play. A built type 1 can cost 4k and up if you're starting blank. Type 4 stuff isn't any cheaper.
Do you have any type 4 stuff now or are your starting from scratch? A better understanding of your starting point and expectations may help. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 7:01 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| Pruneman99 wrote: |
Yes I'm very aware of machine shop prices. You have to pay to play. A built type 1 can cost 4k and up if you're starting blank. Type 4 stuff isn't any cheaper.
Do you have any type 4 stuff now or are your starting from scratch? A better understanding of your starting point and expectations may help. |
Nope from scratch.
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vwracerdave
Samba Member
Joined: November 11, 2004
Posts: 15303
Location: Deep in the 405
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:33 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
I'm not trying to be rude but I'm gonna get straight to the point. There is no way in hell your gonna build a 2600cc type IV engine for a $1600 budget. Starting from scratch your looking at an $8,000 engine. Please understand VW's ARE NOT cheap like old people tell you they are.
A well build turn key 1835cc type I engine with a solid 100 HP is gonna cost $4,000. A transaxle that will handle it will cost $1000.
If you have nothing to start with my suggestion is too buy a complete used engine so you have all the cooling system, engine tin, distributor, alternator, and auxilary accessories, then rebuild it.
_________________
2017 Street Comp Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble, OK
2010 Sportsman ET Champion - Mid-America Dragway - Arkansas City, KS
1997 Sportsman ET Champion - Thunder Valley Raceway Park - Noble ,OK
Featured in Dec. 2001 HOT VW's Magazine page 63
Watch my racing video's http://www.youtube.com/user/okvwracer/videos |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 8:47 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| vwracerdave wrote: |
I'm not trying to be rude but I'm gonna get straight to the point. There is no way in hell your gonna build a 2600cc type IV engine for a $1600 budget. Starting from scratch your looking at an $8,000 engine. Please understand VW's ARE NOT cheap like old people tell you they are.
A well build turn key 1835cc type I engine with a solid 100 HP is gonna cost $4,000. A transaxle that will handle it will cost $1000.
If you have nothing to start with my suggestion is too buy a complete used engine so you have all the cooling system, engine tin, distributor, alternator, and auxilary accessories, then rebuild it. |
Oh I know this is gonna be expensive. And I stated, Im willing to spend what it costs. Im well aware that 2600cc is gonna be expensive. No rudeness about it. Maybe you misinterpreted what i said?
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bugguy1967
Samba Member
Joined: January 16, 2008
Posts: 4341
Location: Los Angeles, CA 90016
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:07 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| European Motor Works in Hawthorne is a mainly Type 4 shop. Jorge has a bunch of cores, and can machine one for you and send it to your doorstep. He makes a bunch of T4 parts, which he sells to major vendors, and they market them as their own. Their prices are the best that I know of. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:17 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
Im looking at a page of machine work they do for a case. more then Half of it i dont know what it means.
http://www.europeanmotorworks.com/vw/engine-case-service.html
^ Here is a link to all the services.
I know i would need 103 bore so there is $60
Clean Engine Case? $30,
Do I need machining for a .78 crank?
What are things like?
Shuffle Pin all Mains in T-4 Case
Sleeve Lifter Bores in T-4 Case
Bore T-4 Case for 1/2" through-bolts
Deck Case - T-1 / T-4
Install 10mm Inserts in T-4 Case
Drill Tap Oil Galley in Holes T-4 Case
Drill and Tap Case For Full Flow
Bore T-4 Case Oil Filler Hole
Install Dipstick in T-4 Case
Remove Head Studs from T-4 Case
Repair Main Dowel Pin
Weld Plate Behind Cylinder #3
Do i need any of these things? What would they do. I know i am asking a lot of questions and i apologize just wanna make sure i have everything right so i dont miss something and have to ship it somewhere to do even more work.
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
thesatanicmechanic
Samba Member
Joined: November 30, 2008
Posts: 102
Location: Charlotte, NC
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:18 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
Preformance aside,
Look for a complete 1700 or 1800 bus or 914 engine on Craigslist. You do not want to build one from scratch.
YOU DO NOT WANT TO BUILD ONE FROM SCRATCH.
Performance aside. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
modok
Samba Member
Joined: October 30, 2009
Posts: 26781
Location: Colorado Springs
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:21 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
^^That sounds good.
FAT/rimco should be on the list as well. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:27 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| modok wrote: |
^^That sounds good.
FAT/rimco should be on the list as well. |
What? Are you saying i need everything on that list or?
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers
Last edited by sshulk on Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:27 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| thesatanicmechanic wrote: |
Preformance aside,
Look for a complete 1700 or 1800 bus or 914 engine on Craigslist. You do not want to build one from scratch.
YOU DO NOT WANT TO BUILD ONE FROM SCRATCH.
Performance aside. |
why?
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
thesatanicmechanic
Samba Member
Joined: November 30, 2008
Posts: 102
Location: Charlotte, NC
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:46 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| sshulk wrote: |
| thesatanicmechanic wrote: |
Preformance aside,
Look for a complete 1700 or 1800 bus or 914 engine on Craigslist. You do not want to build one from scratch.
YOU DO NOT WANT TO BUILD ONE FROM SCRATCH.
Performance aside. |
why? |
Because you cannot afford it.
practice on some type 1 engines, spend a few thousand $$s blowing some up, then buy a used type 4 and try carefully to build it back to stock using the parts and machine services that are available today.
Or just go ahead & go for it.
Please buy the parts from me though. I have a rent and 2 mortgages to cover. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
sshulk
Samba Member
Joined: August 29, 2008
Posts: 694
Location: Succasunna, NJ
|
| Posted: Wed Dec 06, 2017 9:54 pm Post subject: Re: RAT Preformance engine case Type 4 |
|
|
| thesatanicmechanic wrote: |
Because you cannot afford it.
practice on some type 1 engines, spend a few thousand $$s blowing some up, then buy a used type 4 and try carefully to build it back to stock using the parts and machine services that are available today.
Or just go ahead & go for it.
Please buy the parts from me though. I have a rent and 2 mortgages to cover. |
I mean I understand what you are saying but I really dont want to spend "a few thousands" on practice. Id rather "just go ahead & go for it" Also you said, performance aside, The whole point of me building this engine is performance.
_________________
17 years old
German Looker in the Making
73 Super Autostick OG paint Marina Blue
72 Super
60 Mango Ragtop Camper Bug Project Thread
63 Ragtop Project
73 Auto Westfalia
2056 Type 4 Engine Build Thread
Filthy Buggers |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
