Vanagon Starting issues!

[Vanagoneer]

Hey all, Im having some starting issues with my 84 Vanagon. It was running fine, I parked it for a few hours and cam back and nothing. It is turning over, but will no start. By turning over i mean i can hear the starter engaging. I have gone through electrical and see no issues. I have spark off the coil, and at the plugs. I pulled injectors off left rail and had some one turn key, and i had no spray. But earlier when i had pulled a plug, I could smell fuel on it and in the cylinder. So i went underneath to check out fuel pump, and im not hearing any noise, nor do i have any power? at FP. I do have continuity from power to ground at FP. So after, i checked fuel pump relay and replaced with brand new one, still having same issue? Why woulndt i have any power at the fuel pump if it comes directly from relay, where i have 12.6 volts??

[vanlover22]

Do you hear the little whir of the fuel pump when you turn the ignition from off to the on position? I hear a little whir when I do that. Perhaps it is the AFM (Air Flow Meter). I was having lots of trouble starting, and I could get it to start if I feathered the gas for 10-15 minutes. I've also had other AFM issues where it dies all of a sudden while driving and then I can't get it started. (Turns over but does not fire up). There are some youtube videos on how to test your AFM with a multimeter.
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83.5 Vanagon 1.9L Automatic
Country Homes Camper
Engel Fridge w/Solar

[shagginwagon83]

So just to clarify, you are getting voltage at the relay (going to the fuel pump), but no voltage at the fuel pump? If that's correct then are you sure you've got the correct relay/connection?

Also, Vanlover22, you should check out your idle control unit box. I had a lot of issues like you mentioned and was all fixed by replacing the idle control unit box. Try bypassing the box when youre having starting issues (unplug both plugs from box and plug them together). You will idle rough but if it starts after bypass then you know it might be a problem.
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Brandon
"Jo Ann" - '83.5 Westfalia EJ22e w/Peloquin
Instagram @joannthevan

[Vanagoneer]

Correct i have power at relay. Which as far as i understand, is on the right. I have 12.6 volts there. But when i go underneath and test power at fuel pump, i only have continuity to ground, no power.

[shagginwagon83]

[vanlover22]

Do you have continuity from the relay to the fuel pump if the fuel pump is disconnected? You may need a long wire and some alligator clips to help you test. The Bentley (page 97.55) shows the relay connecting to the fuel pump. Here's some diagnostic steps I found that may help.

http://www.vanagonauts.com/Fuel-Pump208.htm

shagginwagon83, I'm all set, a more experienced mechanic got me going. Idle stabilizer was bypassed but that didn't help. New old stock AFM and Temp II sensor got me going.
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83.5 Vanagon 1.9L Automatic
Country Homes Camper
Engel Fridge w/Solar

[Vanagoneer]

I have not tested continuity from the relay to the fuel pump. But I will tomorrow. Also after reading your response I looked at Vanagonauts.com posting you sent, and put a lead across the top and bottom of relay socket and still no power at FP. I guess ill need to run a new wire from socket to FP?? Is it just a direct run? or does it go through ECU first? As far as i can tell from the Bentley it just goes directly from relay to FP.

[Wildthings]

I would not suspect a wire, though it certainly could be. Get a piece of wire long enough to run from the battery to the fuel pump and install a female spade terminal on one end. Attach this end to the "+" side of the fuel pump and then touch the other end of the wire to the "+" post on the battery. The fuel pump should run. If not then either the fuel pump is bad, or its ground is bad.

[vanlover22]

From the diagram in the Bentley it looks like the relay is controlled by pin 20 on the "Fuel Cntrl Unit" (ECU). When the ECU turns on the relay, the relay then in turn turns on the fuel pump. I think the relay is connected directly to the fuel pump.

There's some more diagnostics on page 66 on this VW vanagon digijet manual. I can check mine tomorrow.

http://www.vanagonauts.com/files/Digijet_FI.pdf
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83.5 Vanagon 1.9L Automatic
Country Homes Camper
Engel Fridge w/Solar

[vanlover22]

I connected my voltmeter to the terminals for the fuel pump. When I turn the key from off to on, it applies 12v for 1 second, then turns off. I also hear a little whir for 1 second. I think this primes the engine for starting. In the starting position it supplies 12v continuously. I think the test described by Wildthings is the right test to see if the fuel pump is good.
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83.5 Vanagon 1.9L Automatic
Country Homes Camper
Engel Fridge w/Solar

[Ahwahnee]

[raoul mitgong]

Out of gas?
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84 Westy with a 2.1 (Groover)
86 Tintop Syncro (Crow)
86 Tintop Syncro to Westy project (Tom Servo)
91 Westy (Only the top 12 inches of this van (a burn victim))

[Vanagoneer]

Alright, thanks everyone. So i found a faulty connection at back of relay socket wasnt sending power to FP. Have no fixed that, and have 12.9 volts at fuel pump, and can hear it whirling....but unfortunately still isn't starting. Going to back track now that i know FP is running and check injectors for spray... short of that im not sure where to go next

[Vanagoneer]

Update. I only have power at FP when i put jumper across top and bottom of fuel pump socket. Do not have power when i put in old relays or two new relays that i bought yesterday....Is there a good way to test these relays with a meter?

[shagginwagon83]

Spark, air, compression, and fuel!

You said it was working previously right? Overlook everything you messed with. Make sure you're injectors are spraying. Clean engine grounds if you haven't already and look for vacuum leaks. See if it will start with starting fluid
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Brandon
"Jo Ann" - '83.5 Westfalia EJ22e w/Peloquin
Instagram @joannthevan

[Vanagoneer]

Ive looked over everything.. Injectors are not spraying, and fuel pump does not run unless i put a jumper across top and bottom of relay socket. With new or old relays in I am not getting power at Fuel pump..

[Wildthings]

[djkeev]

[Vanagoneer]

[mikemtnbike]

Have you done the LED test in Bentley to see if injectors are getting power?

That seems like the red flag here- injectors aren't spraying. Why? Doing the LED test and the pin test from Bentley would be next steps for me.

Do you have the Digijet ProTraining manual downloaded/printed?

http://www.vanagonauts.com/files/Digijet_FI.pdf

The LED tests and pin tests are also outlined in the above link.

Also, ignition switch?

When you jumper the pump and it runs, do the injectors spray when ignition/started engaged?

If the injectors don't spray when you have the pump rigged with the jumper, that seems to indicate an ECU issue as it what tells both the pump and the injectors to do their respective jobs...

I realize I'm kind of all over the place on my suggestions, just trying to help out.
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1991 Vanagon GL 2.1 AT Westfauxlia. "Frankie" Totaled https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=764510&highlight=carnage
1995 Eurovan Camper "Marzivan"
2020 GTI SE manual