grinds only into 3rd, could it be something other than syncro?

[loveevan]

hello,

I have a 1978 vw high roof camper bus. I bought it from a family friend, site unseen, for a nice low price.

He said he doesn't remember any gear grinding when he drove it, fairly recently.

For me though, it grinds, a lot, going into 3rd gear from 2nd, and downshifting to 3rd from 4th.

I can shift out of second, wiggle it around a bit in neutral, and ease it into 3rd from the far right (while the engine speed reduces as well) and get it into 3rd with much less and sometimes no grinding.

i can shift down from 4th, hang out in neutral while the engine slows a little, then shift while accelerating and get less grinding into the downshift to 3rd.

double clutching doesn't seem make a difference

I was informed that the previous owner had just gotten a new clutch installed, so perhaps something happened there, because while the old clutch shuddered at bit, he does not recall any problem shifting to 3rd.

other than the grinding into 3rd, the trans works great, no popping out of gears, even under load, and all other gears shift smooth every time.

so, the question is, is there anything that could cause this other than a worn or broken syncro... ...as in anything I can fix or adjust without paying a whole lot for a rebuild and install?

thanks

[skills@eurocarsplus]

If the clutch is adjusted correctly then its rebuild time. Do it sooner rather than later before there is nothing left to rebuild
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[sjbartnik]

Indeed the first thing to check would be the clutch cable adjustment. If you have too much free play, then the clutch could be not completely disengaging when you are pushing the pedal down - which is very hard on the syncros.

Adjust the clutch cable so the free play is as specified in Bentley.

If it still grinds going into 3rd after that, then Skills already told you what's next.
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1965 Volkswagen 1500 Variant S
2000 Kawasaki W650

[Wildthings]

Why don't you have your friend drive it and see if he sees anything odd in the way it shifts. As others mentioned it could be an out of adjustment clutch. Did you change the gear oil in the tranny? These units typically don't like GL-5 oils which is the reason the VW recommended using only GL-4 oils.

[tommu]

[SGKent]

the stop plate might be broken also. It commonly breaks on the 3rd gear side. If that isn't it then shift slower. Mark the position of the stop plate and cover before removing it. Also check the bushing for the shift tube nose, and the tightness of the shift cage.

They break where the red arrows are:

.
_________________
“Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin

[aeromech]

Rebuild time, sorry. I’ve been there before.
_________________
Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound

[KentABQ]

[aeromech]

Sure but I won’t be open for a couple months
_________________
Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound

[loveevan]

Thanks for the replies,

I didn't get out there today to work on it, hopefully tomorrow.

to sum up the suggestions, or maybe to ask for clarification and consensus, is it possible to get grinding in just one gear due to sloppy linkage or maladjusted clutch cable or shift lever?

or is all grinding inherently a syncro issue?

obviously I'm hoping for an easy fix, but I can take the news if that is not ever as cause of grinding



on a hopefully unnecessary side note, what does it cost to rebuild one of these late bay trans?

thanks for helping, i appreciate it

[SGKent]

grinding can be a synchro or the wrong oil (too slippery). It can also be that the wrong gear is being engaged. Synchro would be the first suspect because it spins the gear up to the same speed before the hub locks it. GL4 gear oil is the preferred gear oil because GL5 and synthetics can contaminate moly coated synchro rings and make them too slippery. Also shifting slower can help a little too.
_________________
“Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin

[aeromech]

A few years ago my buddy Dan and I went together to flip this 1978 bus

It would gear grind when shifting from second to third.

The rebuild cost us about $850 as I recall

You can bet we tried all options before pulling that transmission

_________________
Lead Mechanic: San Diego Air and Space Museum
Licensed Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic
Licensed Pilot (Single engine Land)
Boeing 727,737-200-300-400,757,767
Airbus A319,320,321
DC9/MD80
BAe146
Fokker F28/F100
VW type 1 1962,63,65,69,72
VW Type 2 1971 (3 ea.) 1978, 1969
VW Jetta
VW Passat
Capable of leaping tall buildings in a single bound

[SGKent]

Gary - you are so lucky to be near Eric. He is a great transmission builder. To others - when Rick Long closed up shop he told me that Eric is the best in the business these days. http://www.transworks.biz/
_________________
“Most people don’t know what they’re doing, and a lot of them are really good at it.” - George Carlin

[aeromech]