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Rewiring my buggy
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Sharp64 Premium Member
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 9:40 am    Post subject: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

I know there are several threads on wiring but I知 hoping to have this for my specific questions regarding my buggy rewire.

Buggy starts and runs etc but I want to slowly start to get the wiring sorted. Initially, I知 trying to figure it all out. I知 not sure what harness was used but there is a lot of extra wire that I also want to get shortened and under control. I知 not sure what year was followed or if it matters so I may have some questions specific for my build. My plan is to essentially go with a wiring schematic close to what would be found in an 8 fuse 64 as I have a 64 and am somewhat familiar with this system.

Sorry for the long winded start but here is my first question. I知 not familiar with alternator wiring so I am confused as to where these two wires SHOULD go and the later wiring diagrams with an alternator are exceedingly confusing for my limited wiring experience. The red one is going to the starter which seems correct. The green changes to black just behind(front whatever) of the shroud and tracing it forward it is clamped in a junction fitting with a red wire that goes to the ignition? I知 trying to trace the red wire now as there are A LOT of red wires underneath the dash. I was trying to get the charging light on the speedo to work which is what started this venture.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Edit* After tracing some more it seems that the green/black wire in the picture actually seems to be spliced into a wire that goes to the terminal on the ignition and also into the turn signal relay? I'm lost on this....
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:39 am    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

The green wire goes directly to the idiot light. Then from the idiot light to the ignition or a fused power source.

With an internal regulated alternator, the heavy red wire goes to the starter terminal with the main battery +
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:47 am    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

vwracerdave wrote:
The green wire goes directly to the idiot light. Then from the idiot light to the ignition or a fused power source.

With an internal regulated alternator, the heavy red wire goes to the starter terminal with the main battery +


Ok. It was wired with the green/black wire going to a splice with one wire going to the accessory pole on the ignition and the other end went to the turn signal relay. Which is why it works I guess. Would just splicing another wire into the green/black wire and running it to the idiot light be fine as a temporary patch until I can actually get the proper fuse panel in? This will be a few months off since I am going to end up most likely cutting the "hood" out so I can have better access to the wiring under the dash. Laying on my back across two high sided seats with my feet dangling over the side is fun and all....
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 1:01 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

IF you are trying to incorporate existing wire looms and do repairs its a treacherous road to go down.... Sometimes its easier to cut it all loose and start over.....

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


This essentially how alternator is wired, wire color do not matter (to the electricity) its the continuity of the circuit that is critical.... IF you splice a red wire to a green wire then to a yellow wire to get circuit to work, its going to be a nightmare...

Remove passenger side seat, it make wiring fixes under dash a lot easier...

If you need fuse panel, I think the one with ground pad are very good especially with the need of a lot of ground wiring in FG buggy...

https://www.delcity.net/store/Fuse-Panels-&-Terminal-Strip-Connectors/p_180

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 1:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

Yeah I知 starting to think it may be easier to start over. I知 going to start a wiring diagram as I知 finding some things that simply don稚 make sense to me at all. Maybe someone can steer me in the right direction once I post up some drawings.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 5:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

When you get done with yours, maybe you can help me with mine....

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Might find some relief here....

https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=344781

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 6:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

I知 just trying to figure out wtf was done? Seriously everything works but I知 not understanding how or why. Somehow the turn signal switch/lever is tied into some circuits I知 not expecting. As an example, the wire from the starter solenoid is wired into a wire going into the turn signal bundle? One wire for the stop light switch is connected to the 澱attery terminal on the ignition switch and the other goes into the turn signal switch. Does the TS act as some sort of relay? There also seems to be some sort of relay for the turn signals but I haven稚 traced the wires yet to confirm if that痴 what it does.

Oh yeah and I'm totally baffled why the wire that is connected to the center tab on my generic ignition traces back to the right rear taillight?????? Has to be something I'm missing......

Back of generic switch. I get the labeled tabs but what does the center one do?
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 8:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

The center connection for your universal ignition switch should go to the solenoid (#50), its when you turn key over to "start" position it energizes solenoid to kick in and spin up starter...

Have not a clue to why so much goes to TS switch...Other than brake lights may go through TS switch depending on if you are using same filament for turnsignal and brake lights... Ideally if turn signal is operated it disconnects brake light circuit to that side and allows light turnsignal to flash and opposing brake light still operate as brake light... Not as VW designed theirs but as US designed TS/brake light systems...

Is turn signal switch VW or after market...

Does turnsignal switch look similar to this?

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.



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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Don't laugh, I spent the last 3-4 hours doing this.

I have this turn signal switch:


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


There are 7 wires coming out of it and all are accounted for.

I pretty much understand ( sort of) most of the wiring except the wire from the solenoid to the TS. This one just doesn't make sense. Ive traced it a couple of times and the wire does go there and the wire from the center pole on the switch does go back to the right rear tail light.

Works. I don't know why, but it works..

Edit*. Did some digging and found this diagram. I think somehow whoever wired this swapped the solenoid wire and the taillight wire. I知 going to swap those wires and think it will be good.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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Last edited by Sharp64 on Wed Dec 13, 2017 11:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 11:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

A couple things don't make sense to me. The green wire going to the tail light and the red wire going to starter terminal 50 must be spliced somewhere in the bundle to go opposite what is shown. The oil pressure light would stay on if connected to the common ground, it should find ground (when you have no oil pressure) at the oil pressure switch on the engine. The choke should be connected to terminal 15 on the coil. I don't see any power source for the light switch. Do the colors represent wire color? Lastly, I don't see any fuses! All that said, I've seen kit cars running around with more messed up wiring. Confused

Sharp64 wrote:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 11:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

To clarify. The oil pressure light is referring to the illumination bulb. It痴 an old gauge with a pressure line going to it. What痴 represented in the diagram is just the wiring for the bulb in the gauge. I知 swapping it out soon.

Those lines are not spliced together anywhere I can find. Somehow they got switched. Maybe I知 tracing them wrong? They are similar size and both red. So maybe I知 losing track. I知 going to actually pull it the wires tomorrow and double check. At one point they go through a conduit and maybe there is a splice inside where they switch. I値l confirm in the morning.

The light switch is running off the accessory tab off the ignition. (Grey wire)

I知 wrong. The choke is on 15. I値l change the diagram.

Yes the colors represent close approximations or actual wire colors.

There are two fuses that I didn稚 put in the diagram. One between the starter and 澱attery tab on the ignition switch and one between the light switch and bundle.

My goal is to put an 8 fuse panel in. Right now just trying to clean it up. Tomorrow I may start shortening some wires. I値l probably reduce the weight of the buggy 10-15lbs getting rid of the spaghetti mound under the dash.

To get the idiot light on the speedo to work would I just splice into the wire from the reg and run it to the light in the speedo, then run a ground from the tab on the speedo to the common ground? I知 going to head to a place locally and grab a bus bar tomorrow if I can find the time.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:26 am    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

Sharp64 wrote:
Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Don't laugh, I spent the last 3-4 hours doing this.

I have this turn signal switch:


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


There are 7 wires coming out of it and all are accounted for.

I pretty much understand ( sort of) most of the wiring except the wire from the solenoid to the TS. This one just doesn't make sense. Ive traced it a couple of times and the wire does go there and the wire from the center pole on the switch does go back to the right rear tail light.

Works. I don't know why, but it works..

Edit*. Did some digging and found this diagram. I think somehow whoever wired this swapped the solenoid wire and the taillight wire. I知 going to swap those wires and think it will be good.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Nobody is laughing... Its a awesome undertaking to get a usable diagram... When you get it wired properly update diagram, somewhere down the road it will save your life....

The turn signal switch wiring diagram is one of mine that someone has edited off my name and date of creation...

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Other variations...

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


Some of my other wiring stuff can be found here...

https://www.flickr.com/photos_user.gne?path=&nsid=12136747%40N03&page=&details=1

Dale
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mcmscott wrote:

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All suggestions and advice are purely my own opinion. You are free to ignore them if you wish ...


Last edited by Dale M. on Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:38 am; edited 1 time in total
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 8:33 am    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

About speedo.... The tab at bottom of three light cluster goes to 12 volts with key on.... It powers the ALT, OIL and high beam (idiot) lamps.... Speedo body should be grounded for illumination, there may or may not be grounding tab on speedo body. (year dependent)..

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:00 am    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

I was wrong. The starter solenoid and right rear light were wired correctly. I was just getting confused in the jumble of wires. So that痴 all good.

I知 making some changes today as I知 up under. Removing the headlights and taillights bundle and pushing the taillights to the correct tab so that they light when the high beams are on. I知 going to grab some inline fuses today and a bus bar for the grounds.

Regarding the idiot light. The speedo seems to be grounded. Im guessing through the metal faceplate that is also in contact with the steering column. So would I run a wire from the accessory side of the ignition switch to that tab and then the second from a splice in the regulator wire? Problem is the regulator wire is already on that tab.....

*edit- NVM. I realized I should just run the wire straight to the idiot light instead of to the accessory tab.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 9:21 am    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

I wire up a 2 fuse system for my buggies. What I do is run a wire off "30" (constant unfused battery positive) to a 2 fuse block (I use the high beam fuse block from '59 and older Bugs.) One of the sides gets a 16 amp fuse and runs to the light switch. The other side gets an 8 amp fuse and runs to the ignition switch. The fuse block is in the back by the battery. Like you I don't have wipers and I power the horn with switched ignition power.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 10:02 am    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

EVfun wrote:
I wire up a 2 fuse system for my buggies. What I do is run a wire off "30" (constant unfused battery positive) to a 2 fuse block (I use the high beam fuse block from '59 and older Bugs.) One of the sides gets a 16 amp fuse and runs to the light switch. The other side gets an 8 amp fuse and runs to the ignition switch. The fuse block is in the back by the battery. Like you I don't have wipers and I power the horn with switched ignition power.


Not a bad idea. I already have the 8 fuse panel as I tossed it in with my last WW order. I値l probably end up using it and will draw up a diagram incorporating it shortly. I知 sure I値l come up with some additional ideas.

I値l be adding a tach, new Oil Pressure gauge and ampmeter soon. Eventually I will hopefully be able to move the tank and at that point may need to wire for a fuel sender. Also waffling on just getting a Bluetooth rechargeable speaker like in my bug or actually wiring in a set of Bluetooth speakers. So in the end I may need more options than just two wires. Having an 8 fuse panel will help clean up the wiring.

Yeah wipers are a very distant option. Hell I don稚 even have a top for it so the chances of driving in the rain are nil.

I appreciate the input.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:45 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

Suggest volt meter instead of ammeter.....Easier to wire and once you learn to understand it, its more telling than a ammeter.....


Also when redoing schematic eliminate all the ground wires and just use ground srmbol at device.... It is assumed that device has proper ground even if mounted on fiberglass.... Makes schematic less "busy"....

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 4:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

Yeah. Voltmeter. Sorry typed it on the fly.

I get what you池e saying but for my own purposes I壇 prefer to have the ground wires as part of the diagram so that I can quickly identify which ones are grounds. Yeah I know, they are either black or white, but I also have one black wire in the bundle running up the side that痴 from the taillights and another that痴 from the alternator. Keeping them on the diagram will help me later when I forget that there are two black wires that aren稚 grounds.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 6:34 pm    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

Dale M. wrote:

Image may have been reduced in size. Click image to view fullscreen.

.... The tab at bottom of three light cluster goes to 12 volts with key on....
It powers the ALT, OIL and high beam (idiot) lamps...


Don't you mean ALT, OIL and turn signal indicator ?
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 15, 2017 7:40 am    Post subject: Re: Rewiring my buggy Reply with quote

Here is a tip to make things easier ... pick a different color of wire for grounds and only use it for grounds. Brown is probably the best choice because lots of vehicles use that.

It seems none of my FLAPS carry brown wire, but I picked up a roll of brown the last time I ordered terminals from Delcity and I am using that exclusively for grounds on all my wiring projects. The advantage is that lots of vehicles use brown for ground so that makes it easy to remember.

Recently installed a new factory style harness in a 1957 Chevy pickup, and when I ran a couple of new circuits I used the brown for grounds. Looks like factory work under the dash.
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