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Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video
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YosemiteBound
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 7:34 pm    Post subject: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

Hey all,

I've been wracking my brain trying to find the source of this noise. It just started today. But I haven't really driven the westy for a few weeks.

Things I've done in the past few weeks: change a few coolant lines, aluminum h bar install, bleed lines and radiator, oil and filter change today.

So the coolant levels look good. There's only a steady stream of coolant coming out of the radiator bleed valve, the fan comes on fine, the radiator is warm to the touch and the westy isn't overheating.

I have nothing trapped under the vanagon. Turning the vent fan off and on in the dash does nothing to change it.

It pops up over 40 mph and then hangs around. Goes away when I slow down.

I thought it was more air trapped in the radiator but how many times can i bleed it? Had the wife holding the rpms at 2500 while bleeding. Does it sound like the radiator? Or something else?

Something come loose somewhere?

You gotta love these vans. You change coolant, change oil, polish her up and you're thinking - man I'm ready to drive across the country - then there's a new noise. It really keeps one on their toes. I know I'll find it.... I tried for a couple hours before posting here. But, darnit I'm stumped.

Love this community. Thx all.


Link

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VicVan
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 7:51 pm    Post subject: Re: A new episode of "What's That Noise?" With Video Reply with quote

This reminds me of the noise my old speedo cable would do. Try disconnecting it (white round plug on the back of the dash), let it hang upstraight, and go for a ride.
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YosemiteBound
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 8:48 pm    Post subject: Re: A new episode of "What's That Noise?" With Video Reply with quote

Hey, sorry newb here. Can I literally just remove the top of the cluster - reach down under the plastic and pull the speedo cable? Put the cluster top back on and go for a drive? Or am I missing a step? Thx Smile First time messing with cluster or dash.
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 9:16 pm    Post subject: Re: A new episode of "What's That Noise?" With Video Reply with quote

No worries. Yes, unclip the top cover of the instrument cluster. Reach to the back of the cluster, on the speedo side, and disconnect the speedo cable (white plug). There's two small tabs on each side of the plug, just squeeze them and pull gently.


This shows how to remove the whole cluster. Do the two first steps : remove the black cover and the white plastic heat shield. Then jump to 00:45 (45th second of the video) and remove the plastic plug as shown.


Link


Bonus : While you're in there, check your brake fluid level ! It's the white container. (well, provided you're not in your neighbor's driveway... otherwise the readings might be a little off Razz )
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YosemiteBound
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 9:35 pm    Post subject: Re: A new episode of "What's That Noise?" With Video Reply with quote

Thanks!! That was a perfect step by step.

Well, I tried it out. Went for a test drive. Noise still there. Darn. Cool to know how to get back behind the cluster now tho. So def thx for that Smile But what the heck. No idea where this noise is coming from.
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Wasted youth
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:06 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

I watched your video. Your speedo is bouncing pretty bad. I know you said you disconnected it from the speedometer and the noise is still there, but the cable is still connected to the front wheel hub, so if the cable is the culprit, then it stands to reason the cable could still be vibrating in its sleeve... without being connected to the speedometer. So the problem might not be the speedometer but is actually the cable vibrating in the sleeve.

Disconnect it again, get some aerosol lithium lube and carefully shoot some down the cable from the top (now it’s opened up from you disconnecting it from the speedometer).

Also... go take a look at the plastic headlight grille and see to it that it’s not loose and allowing a corner of it to vibrate in the wind as you get up your speed.

Go for another test drive. Carefully try to reach up and get a few fingers on the cable sleeve. Does the sound match any vibration you’re feeling?


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:08 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

Darn it ! Even though it is hard to tell from a video, I was 90 % sure that was it.
What I can think of, randomly:
Vent flaps (try operating them all)
Metal clanging against metal. Due to wind if only happens past a certain speed ? Antenna ? Something on the roof rack?
Loose piece of bumper or something ? Have a good look all around and under the van. Any loose stuff ? At least you'll get to know your van !

Your subject title mentions a shudder or vibration. Is there or is it just the sound that makes you think that ?
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 12:15 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

I get the feeling that it’s related to your jumpy speedo, but I couldn’t tell you what to look for. Sounds like it’s in the cabin as to say, not transmitting from the wheel hub where the speedo gearing is at.

Gotta love the sleuthing - these vans help sharpen all kinds of skills Very Happy
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 4:16 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

Pull off the LF wheel, or wheel cover/hub cap to expose the wheel bearing grease cap.

Remove the clip /cotter pin on the end of the speedometer cable.

Push the cable into the hub so it clears the square hole in the cap.

Go for a ride to see if the noise stopped.

Dave
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:26 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

Wasted youth wrote:
I watched your video. Your speedo is bouncing pretty bad. I know you said you disconnected it from the speedometer and the noise is still there, but the cable is still connected to the front wheel hub, so if the cable is the culprit, then it stands to reason the cable could still be vibrating in its sleeve... without being connected to the speedometer. So the problem might not be the speedometer but is actually the cable vibrating in the sleeve.

Disconnect it again, get some aerosol lithium lube and carefully shoot some down the cable from the top (now it’s opened up from you disconnecting it from the speedometer).

Also... go take a look at the plastic headlight grille and see to it that it’s not loose and allowing a corner of it to vibrate in the wind as you get up your speed.

Go for another test drive. Carefully try to reach up and get a few fingers on the cable sleeve. Does the sound match any vibration you’re feeling?


Thanks, I forgot to mention that I thought maybe it was the grille. I popped it off when I was re bleeding the radiator and left it off while test driving.The noise was there whether I had the grille on or off. Also there is no physical vibration or shudder that is just how it sounds. Also the speedo has always jumped and shook - since we’ve owned it and it’s never made this noise. What would cause the speedo to suddenly be so, joltingly, loud? On top of my recent work it’s also been raining very hard for the first time in months. Could this have anything to do with it? I have hope. At some point things have to stop breaking lol. I’ll try the aerosol thing Smile
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:32 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

You can test the speedo cable while you drive. I had a noisy cable and jumpy speedo needle. Remove the instrument cluster cover and plastic shield. Sit in the drivers seat and pretend you are driving and reach your left hand behind the cluster and find the speedo cable so you know where it is. Now go for a drive on a deserted large road and carefully reach to the cable and move it slightly in various directions. You may find that there is a sweet spot where the vibration goes away, assuming it is the cable to begin with. Worked for me. I zip tied the cable to something behind the dash to keep it in the sweet spot. YMMV.

(Stunt driver on closed course only. You may die if you try this at home...)
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 8:47 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

Okay lol. I’m getting the consensus that this is the speedo cable. I was skeptical, but y’all def know more than me. I’ll try these things and report back (except pulling the wheel off as I have no way of doing this yet).
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 9:23 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

YB, I also am thinking speedo cable... especially if it does this when cold but not when it's warm outside.

Our old van did this only when cold in the morning, and it stopped when warmer. If the sound quiets when warmer, I think it's the cable.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 10:04 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

I don't think it's the speedo cable. I did not hear it decreasing in frequency as you slowed and it is directly tied to vehicle speed. I merely lessened in intensity/loudness but stayed the same frequency as it quickly tailed off as you were on the exit ramp. It's also way too high a frequency to be the speedo cable. The tire is not turning that fast at only 40.

So, it's a part on the body that's vibrating from air passage and that's the frequency it vibrates. Remove the grille again and look around with an eye toward "what thin plastic part is fluttering in the wind.

If you need a quick test for validation of my opinion, tape a few garbage bags over the entire grill and go for a quick spin. quick because you're stopping the airflow that also cools the vehicle. Get it up to the 40 you showed where it was loudest and see if its gone.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 10:46 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

Check the grill. Noise wasnt there last week and youve been dicking around w the grill. Remove grill and go for ride. Not at same time as you remove the speedo cable. LOl Good luck. Happy sleuthing.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 11:51 am    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

AZ Landshaper wrote:
Check the grill.

Confused. My Westy has no grill. Would be handy for brat night.

Wink

Starting to concur with vibration theory. Seems like a lot for 30-40, though, perhaps recorded at hyper-volume.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 1:05 pm    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

E1 wrote:
AZ Landshaper wrote:
Check the grill.

Confused. My Westy has no grill. Would be handy for brat night.

Wink

Starting to concur with vibration theory. Seems like a lot for 30-40, though, perhaps recorded at hyper-volume.


Haha E1 Wink

Okay, I'll try and get another vid. I see nothing loose under the grille or under anything... that could be making that kind of noise.

Is there any chance anyone thinks it's the luggage rack piece? I took it off a couple months ago and cleaned it out - put new seals and cleats on etc. But we've driven a few hundred miles up into the mountains since then etc. With no noise.

Could the rains have messed with something in there? One corner does maybe feel a bit loose. Could the wind pick that up and make it flap? Seems unlikely, but... these things are super weird lol.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 1:51 pm    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

Tape is your friend. Tape the luggage thing down. Check your radiator cardboard air deflector, move the vent switches while its happening, that bug screen on the heater intake at grille top center, etc. use tape to hold suspects.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 2:14 pm    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

IdahoDoug wrote:
Tape is your friend. Tape the luggage thing down. Check your radiator cardboard air deflector, move the vent switches while its happening, that bug screen on the heater intake at grille top center, etc. use tape to hold suspects.


Tape. Great call, thank you Smile

Just want to make sure - no one thinks that it's the sound of trapped air in the cooling system? Thx again Smile
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 2:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Loud Front End Shudder/Vibration Noise With Video Reply with quote

not in my humble opinion.

remove and replace speedo cable. Has done the trick fro me in the past. My sound was diff but yours (speedo) appears to move w the vibration intensity. Has speedo always jumped around? The sound you have is more of a vibration to me.

Do your bearings (front) feel secure? Have any wheel wobble when jacked up? You could check a lot by jacking it up and tooling around for a few mins. try to wiggle the wheel, maybe release the cable from the hub.
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