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joey1320
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Joined: September 12, 2006
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Location: Cleveland, OH
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 Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 5:20 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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Well the flexible fuel lines are needed for routing and vibration purposes. Now we have plastic lines running under new cars as opposed to metal ones.
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Zundfolge1432 
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Joined: June 13, 2004
Posts: 12467
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:04 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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If you do go inside the tunnel it’s more work, more tedious but if you search here or the other forum it’s been done complete with pictures. When it comes to tubing I sourced a local shop that sells brake lines, clutch parts and they reline obsolete friction products. But the tubing I get is better than anything VW used. In the first place it has greater wall thickness and its alloyed or plated for outside use like under a car. It’s close enough in size to OG and 5mm braided line will fit. It’s also malleable so you can shape as you wish using a tubing bender or freehand if you choose. You may also consider stainless tubing which if used outside would outlast anything and be plenty tough... whichever way you go will be better than the hack job someone else did. Good luck.
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mukluk
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Joined: October 18, 2012
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Location: Clyde, TX
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| Posted: Sat Jan 13, 2018 6:26 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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| markeaton wrote: |
| So if I do replace with a metal line, I am thinking of going inside the tunnel as it seems unsafe to have a metal line riding along the "outside" of the tunnel which is exposed to me or a rider kicking it (it's a dune buggy). |
You will break your toes long before damaging a metal fuel line as installed per the VW service bulletin posted earlier.
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Buggeee
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Joined: December 22, 2016
Posts: 4407
Location: Stuck in Ohio
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:50 am Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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Excellent news, for me anyway because I don't need glasses after all!
Also I think, in the long run for Mark. You don't want a rubber hose running through the tunnel where you can't see whether it's getting old and dry rotted. Especially since when it leaks it'll be leaking all inside the interior of the car.
That's I think that's why Volkswagen made the part running through the cab out of metal so that it wouldn't wear out. (I know they do eventually but come on these good little soldiers are decades beyond there anticipated life span). The rubber parts are outside of the cab so if they get brittle and start leaking it goes on the ground. But you don't want your gas line leaking inside the car and that's why they made it out of metal.
I don't think it would really matter whether the metal fuel line is running through the cab inside the tunnel or outside the tunnel because it's made out of metal and if it's run along the bottom corner there nobody would be kicking it really.
I think that running a new metal line to the inside of the tunnel of be a huge pain in the you-know-what and that's why Volkswagen put out the service bulletin explaining how could be done outside the tunnel in the route in that diagram. People who replace things running inside of the tunnel cut the tunnel open on the side to get access to it - at least from what I've seen on these threads (never done it myself)
How bout a bit of gratuitous bug porn with a picture of the bug we're working on here? 
I used 1/4 brake line to make a short stretch of fuel line in my engine compartment. I wonder what the proper material is for this application. Peeps? [EDIT Zundi's all over the material sourcing above. Up and at em early today! Is it even light out yet where you are Z?] [Double Edit - that was last nights post. Sheesh. I gotta learn how to read thes modern fangled interweb threadies - time for some more coffee apparently]
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AlmostHeavenWV_VW
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Joined: October 12, 2017
Posts: 1965
Location: WV
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 9:11 am Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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| markeaton wrote: |
Thank you all for your responses AND diagrams....
So from what I am reading a metal line seems to be the popular choice... which begs the question: why do places sell non-metal fuel lines if not a good idea ... or is it more of a personal preference from you gents? |
For clarity the OEW fuel line system is a mix of metal and rubber lines.
Metal tank outlet stub->rubber line->(rubber grommet needed here at entrance to tunnel)metal line up out of frame running inside tunnel and emerging out the rear of tunnel underneath near the clutch tubes, axles, etc.(grommet here at exit of tunnel) -> rubber line-> metal line which runs through the front engine tin (grommet here where passing through engine tin)-> rubber line to fuel pump inlet...then fuel pump outlet->carb
It is recommended to place a good inline filter at a point in one of the rubber line sections. Popular places are under gas tank, underneath body near axles,tranny, etc., and also from pump to carb.
A good filter has appropriate size inlet/outlet size (1/4" is the closest to what you need although 3/16" is also usable),needs to have 'barbs' on inlet/outlets to help from lines slipping off, small size is a plus. Examples:
good
https://www.knfilters.com/search/product.aspx?prod=81-0221
bad no barbs, larger size, cheaper filter materials
http://www.jbugs.com/product/803201511E.html
Be aware that there are risks/benefits to each fuel filter location (road debris damage, mounting securely, ease of access and replacement, fire risks)
Also if you choose to put the filter in the engine bay be prepared to hear about how that's 'wrong.' Many will cite fire risks, but there are remedies to most (if not all) of those risks.
Glenn's thread on fuel filter location in engine bay and the fixes to risks associated with that:
https://www.thesamba.com/vw/forum/viewtopic.php?t=136647&highlight=
Ultimately it is your car, your decision on the risks/benefits regarding filter location.
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Brian
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Joined: May 28, 2012
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:45 am Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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Honestly, I use the Jbugs filters no problem. They're the ones that say "made in Israel" on them. I use it with the 5mm lines and no hose clamps. Call me crazy, but that stuff fits perfectly and is a bitch to remove. I put it above the transmission because it's one straight shot from the frame to the hard line on the tin. Keep the length just right and it'll never move. But as stated:
| AlmostHeavenWV_VW wrote: |
| Ultimately it is your car, your decision on the risks/benefits regarding filter location. |
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markeaton
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Location: Seacoast NH
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 1:50 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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Almostheaven ... i guess i did not know that about the mix of metal and rubber for oem parts...
for poops and giggles i pulled out my old rubber hose today and replaced it with the one I bought from Woflburg West: https://www.wolfsburgwest.com/cart/DetailsList.cfm?ID=111209185
Took me all of 10 minutes to do.... However, I am planning to review all the posts here and make a couple of calls this week to suppliers. I really need to think about the rubber - to metal - to rubber route. |
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Cusser
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Zundfolge1432
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Joined: June 13, 2004
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 3:27 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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| Cusser wrote: |
| I'd use stainless steel tubing instead of copper. |
Copper is a no no for the reason Mr. Blue explained. Line I showed might be mistaken as such but it’s steel with a zinc or cadmium plating. It’s industrial brake line that comes off a spool and sold by the ft. Good stuff, can also be flared if you are using fittings. Places that build trailers also a good place to access tubing. |
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Fiddlestyx
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Location: Texas
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 4:10 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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Curious question, the fuel line here https://www.wolfsburgwest.com/cart/DetailsList.cfm?ID=111209185 states "Not for use with Ethanol gas". Does that mean gas that contains Ethanol or is it referring to E85?
I have my fuel filter below the gas tank and just above the filter I have a fuel shutoff valve. It will make changing the filter easy and I figure in an emergency I might be able to slip under the passenger front side and shut off the fuel flow.
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joey1320
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Joined: September 12, 2006
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Location: Cleveland, OH
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:44 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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| Fiddlestyx wrote: |
Curious question, the fuel line here https://www.wolfsburgwest.com/cart/DetailsList.cfm?ID=111209185 states "Not for use with Ethanol gas". Does that mean gas that contains Ethanol or is it referring to E85?
I have my fuel filter below the gas tank and just above the filter I have a fuel shutoff valve. It will make changing the filter easy and I figure in an emergency I might be able to slip under the passenger front side and shut off the fuel flow. |
Unfortunately ethanol is mixed in at about 10% in commercial fuels. So yes, ethanol is present. Reason why Cusser recommended replacing the hoses every couple of years.
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bluebus86
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Joined: September 02, 2010
Posts: 11075
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 5:58 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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| Brian wrote: |
Honestly, I use the Jbugs filters no problem. They're the ones that say "made in Israel" on them. I use it with the 5mm lines and no hose clamps. Call me crazy, but that stuff fits perfectly and is a bitch to remove. I put it above the transmission because it's one straight shot from the frame to the hard line on the tin. Keep the length just right and it'll never move. But as stated:
| AlmostHeavenWV_VW wrote: |
| Ultimately it is your car, your decision on the risks/benefits regarding filter location. |
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That location is really good, (near tranny above axle,) if leaks occur above axle there is no ignition source. Thats why I prefer mounting filter not over the dizzie in the engine bay my car caught fire froma leak there, spark spark, Proof!!!!
Just dont suspend filter in free space on a long run of hose, else it can wip around and become damaged
See important other engine fire info on link at bottom of post regarding safety wire.
Bug On, Be Fire Safe!
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Brian
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joey1320
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Location: Cleveland, OH
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dirtkeeper
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| Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:04 am Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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| joey1320 wrote: |
| That's a well thought out design. |
I agree that is a cool little fixture. I think it could have been thought out just a little more , Having to remove two little bolts in a hard to reach location would discourage me from replacing the filter more often. |
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AlmostHeavenWV_VW
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Posts: 1965
Location: WV
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| Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:45 am Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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| dirtkeeper wrote: |
| I agree that is a cool little fixture. I think it could have been thought out just a little more , Having to remove two little bolts in a hard to reach location would discourage me from replacing the filter more often. |
You also have two hose clamps to remove in that area too, I don't see it being too awful to do it. 1/4" bit in a 1/4" socket on a ratchet should do it nicely.
It's by far not the most difficult fastener removal on ACVWs. Besides, It's a ?once a year? thing- those two fasteners might add 15minutes to the filter swap. Shouldn't be too bad, IMHO
EDIT: 2 'work arounds' to the fasteners:
1) Just disconnect your hoses and remove the entire bracket, so you are able to work on it at the work bench
2) Further looking at that bracket, if the fasteners bother you- some good strong magnets (rare earth or ceramic) would probably hold the two plates together enough to support the filter. (assuming the bracket is ferrous metal)
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BIGMIKEY
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| Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:27 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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Uh, guys. I don't think markeaton has gotten the picture yet. Did anyone notice his last post? He has replaced the rubber line running through his tunnel with the OEM style cloth covered line. From front to rear. Still no steel line.
Mike T
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joey1320
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Location: Cleveland, OH
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| Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:46 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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| BIGMIKEY wrote: |
Uh, guys. I don't think markeaton has gotten the picture yet. Did anyone notice his last post? He has replaced the rubber line running through his tunnel with the OEM style cloth covered line. From front to rear. Still no steel line.
Mike T |
He also said he's calling vendors and figuring out the metal/rubber fuel line setup.
I think he understands the severity of it.
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AlmostHeavenWV_VW
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Joined: October 12, 2017
Posts: 1965
Location: WV
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| Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 8:50 pm Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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| markeaton wrote: |
| However, I am planning to review all the posts here and make a couple of calls this week to suppliers. I really need to think about the rubber - to metal - to rubber route. |
I think he said he fiddled with it today for "poops and giggles" but it looks like he's gonna get the hard line run.
If not, let's be clear, that line from the tank through the tunnel (or inside passenger compartment per that service bulletin) must not be rubber else we risk chaffing and potential damage to that section
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markeaton
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Location: Seacoast NH
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| Posted: Wed Jan 17, 2018 11:01 am Post subject: Re: Would you? Gas line replacement |
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Gents.... I for sure "got it": and plan to go the metal route...
Thanks for the tips and knowledge that I lack... |
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