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Intake Manifold Gasket Leak
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sobelsaint
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:32 pm    Post subject: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

I changed the intake manifold gasket twice and it still has a leak. First I sanded the manifold flat and used a new gasket and had no luck. I also used some Curil T on the second try and still had no luck. I need to know what kind of gaskets you guys are using that work best before I try this again. Thanks for the help.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

What are you using?

I use Berg paper gaskets and never had a leak.

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sobelsaint
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 3:40 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

I used the empi pack that my local shop sells. One thing i noticed is the first time I did it the leak was coming from the cylinder 3 and the second time the leak was coming from cylinder 4. I noticed because the idle mixture was not working properly. Should they be tightened down really hard or just enough? wondering if the head needs to be sanded or smoothed out somehow. I wonder if the berg gaskets are thicker than empi.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 4:02 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

The nuts should be snug... not "animal tight".

You can stack 2 gaskets if needed.
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 06, 2018 7:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

Make sure the manifold will sit in place with no gasket.
If it isn't sealing then the manifold must be hanging up on some edge, or mating surface on the head is FAR from flat.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:11 am    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

Is there a way to flatten the surface on the head?
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:14 am    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

Yes, but you'd have to remove it.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:38 am    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

Get a small straight edge and place it on the head mating surface.

I am betting it is not your head surface that is causing the problem. I am assuming that either the manifold is interfering with engine tin or the carb is hitting the shroud, or you are not getting enough torque on the wrench when tightening the manifolds. What kind of nuts are you using and what tools are you using to tighten the nuts.

These nuts are nice to use since the socket size required is only 10mm instead of 13mm. Using these with some long extensions and a swivel socket make it a lot easier to install.

http://vwparts.aircooled.net/ACN-Flanged-Racing-Intake-and-Exhaust-Nut-8-x-10mm-p/acn-nuts.htm
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:39 am    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

https://www.amazon.com/Loctite-50ml-Gasket-Elimina...dpSrc=srch

No gasket.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 1:13 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

Try making sure you tighten the nuts down at the same rate so the manifold does not lean over to one side or the other on the way down.
If you are using the metal gaskets you can manage to crush one side of the gasket, then have the manifold rock away from the crushed area as you torque up the other nut, leaving a gap.

Been there done that , have the T-shirt.

Also check it is not trapping tinware under the manifold on the way down.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:55 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

What heads? I was running CB's Super pros and the ports are very big....which left a very thin ara between the ports. Needless to say I kept developing vacuum leaks. Spoke with David at CB and he recommended Loctite 518 flange sealant and no gasket....just metal to metal. He said most of the guys he knew did that with big port heads. I did it and zero intake leaks.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 6:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

oops...just saw mcmscott's post to you. Ditto to that. 518 works great.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 7:00 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

Loctite 518 is only good to 300f. Heads run hotter than that.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 8:32 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

mcmscott wrote:
https://www.amazon.com/Loctite-50ml-Gasket-Elimina...dpSrc=srch

No gasket.

I assume it's Probably not much fun scraping it off the head when needed .
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 8:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

Comes off with spirits.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 9:39 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

chrisflstf wrote:
Loctite 518 is only good to 300f. Heads run hotter than that.

yes and no. It does lose a lot of strength at 300f but, it will survive that continuously without really any change for a very long time.

A lot of epoxys or sealants that say they are "good" to 400 or 500F will turn to cheeze eventually if they live at 300f in the presence of gasoline or oil vapor. Loses 60% of it's strength yes, but still stronger than silicone, and it's only sealing air pressure not hundreds of PSI or something.

How "STRONG" is silicone?

Also, the intake flange won't be as hot as the spark plug.
300 is possible but 250 would be normal.

The 515 sealant has a higher temp rating, but really the only difference is the 518 has something in it to make it more flexible.........and, ah, maybe the ability to flex is figured into the temp rating somehow...because it seems to me they both work the same if you use them for the same job.
So, the 300F rating is an ok guideline but in this case, it's OK.
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 10:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

modok wrote:
chrisflstf wrote:
Loctite 518 is only good to 300f. Heads run hotter than that.

yes and no. It does lose a lot of strength at 300f but, it will survive that continuously without really any change for a very long time.

A lot of epoxys or sealants that say they are "good" to 400 or 500F will turn to cheeze eventually if they live at 300f in the presence of gasoline or oil vapor. Loses 60% of it's strength yes, but still stronger than silicone, and it's only sealing air pressure not hundreds of PSI or something.

How "STRONG" is silicone?

Also, the intake flange won't be as hot as the spark plug.
300 is possible but 250 would be normal.

The 515 sealant has a higher temp rating, but really the only difference is the 518 has something in it to make it more flexible.........and, ah, maybe the ability to flex is figured into the temp rating somehow...because it seems to me they both work the same if you use them for the same job.
So, the 300F rating is an ok guideline but in this case, it's OK.



How strong is silicone?......VERY.

It also depends on the silicone. With several thousand formulations.....silicone is not just silicone.

Also....it depends on how thick you apply it. Thicker is weaker with any sealant. Too thin is just too thin.

A thin film of silicone on gaskets.....only has maybe .001" of its thickness or face ....actually accessible to the inside of the manifold where fuel vapor is. Even though most good silicones have only intermittent resistance to fuels.....that resistance is also at around 500+ F.... and it takes many hundreds of hours of fuel contact to seep laterally through the silicone film.

It also depends on the durometer/hardness of the silicone you use. Some are quite hard....some are quite soft. Ray
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 07, 2018 11:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

But in what way? It has a strong smell?

In this case.... it would be some combination of compressive modulus compared to sheer strength, which isn't so easy to imagine.
It's far easier to just say that it works, because it does.
Chances are under the hood of his car is an example of it working right now. The loctite family of sealants is used more often in situations that benefit from being more rigid, I think this counts as one of them.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2018 2:45 am    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

chrisflstf wrote:
Loctite 518 is only good to 300f. Heads run hotter than that.


But the intake tract runs quite a bit cooler, constant outside air running through it.
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 08, 2018 8:47 am    Post subject: Re: Intake Manifold Gasket Leak Reply with quote

Glenn wrote:
What are you using?

I use Berg paper gaskets and never had a leak.


I use the metal dual-port gaskets. These were included in my engine gasket set.
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